what is the difference between an FX channel and a group channel?

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Pony!

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Ahoy folks,

I'm summing some tracks and it occurred to me... is there a difference between an FX channel and a group channel? They both seem to do the same thing when acting as an insert. So what would I use each for and what wouldn't I use each for?
 
In many ways they are the same. First difference, they show up in your mixer screen as a different color. Second, FX channels are only accessed from individual channels through the aux sends of each channel instead of through the aux and the post fade output routing like group channels. Third, The FX channels do not have aux send routing on their returns like Group channels. Basically, FX channels are somewhat similar to a dumbed down group channel. There may be other differences too, but those are the things that stuck out in my mind.
 
You route the output of tracks to group channels. It pretty much does what it says on the tin. You can group a number of tracks and control them as one track.

FX tracks are tracks for..well...effects. You can send tracks to to an FX channel, but you don't send the output. The output of the track will still go to the master bus, while also sending a signal to the FX track.

Example...

If you want to add reverb to a number of tracks, you create your FX track, and stick a reverb in it. Then you take, say, a guitar, and open up its track. On the right of where the EQ section is, there a bunch of sends (black rectangles similar to the inserts on the left). If you click on it, you'll see your FX track in there. Once you've selected it, there's a blue bar at the bottom of the send. You can alter that to set how much signal goes into the FX channel.

When using sends like that, generally, the effect you use will want to be set to 100% wet, because you already have the dry signal going from the track to the master bus. Then the FX channel is only outputting the effect, rather than the combination of the dry signal and effect. That way, you can alter how promenant the effect is with the volume slider on the FX channel.

FX channels are pretty useful if you want to send a whole bunch of stuff to one reverb or something like that. You could do it with a group track, and stick the effect on the insert, but that's kinda different. Insert effects are for altering or shaping the signal (like with compression for example), and occur pre-fader. Send effects are for adding to it, and occur post-fader. Generally with something like reverb, which naturally occurs after a sound, you'd want to send to an FX channel, thereby adding the reverb to the original signal, rather than shaping the signal with reverb.

That said, it's all horses for courses with music.

Sorry if this isn't explained too well. For something like this I'd prefer to try and put some screenshots and diagrams together for you, but I'm at work at the moment and don't have cubase to hand. If I have the time later I'll try putting something together.
 
xstatic said:
In many ways they are the same. First difference, they show up in your mixer screen as a different color. Second, FX channels are only accessed from individual channels through the aux sends of each channel instead of through the aux and the post fade output routing like group channels. Third, The FX channels do not have aux send routing on their returns like Group channels. Basically, FX channels are somewhat similar to a dumbed down group channel. There may be other differences too, but those are the things that stuck out in my mind.
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Well, you got the first one right! :D

Cubase 5 eliminates all that (except the different color).

Did I also mention that it kicks ass! :D :D :D
 
One note that should be maybe added to legion's post....

Send FX are not necessarily post fader. In Cubase SX, each channel that you are sending to an FX send has a prea nad post fade button. Just like inserts. Inserts are not always prefade. The last two slots (inserts 7 and 8) on each channel or group or FX return have two post fade insert slots.

Generally speaking, FX channels are just group channels with limited routing otpions. In fact, Most of the timne I tend to not use FX channels, but use group channels for my FX. The reason I do this is so that I have a full featured channel on my FX. It comes in really handy when you want to do something like have a delay return for a vocal feed into a reverb so that the delays are also a little verbed instead of dry. If you were to use an FX send for your reverb, you would acutally have to put your delay on insert 1 of the FX channel, and then add a reverb to insert 2 which means your wet/dry balance is controlled by the reverb plugin itself, and not balanced by the faders of the returns. Keep in mind that group channels can be routed into by channel aux sends as well as the channel's main output routing. FX channels, are only accesible by the channel aux sends.

In the end there are many different ways you can use each. There is not a set right or worng method, only that which works and that which doesn't. For me I prefer to use the group channels because then all of my options are open to me all the time.
 
xstatic said:
One note that should be maybe added to legion's post....

Send FX are not necessarily post fader. In Cubase SX, each channel that you are sending to an FX send has a prea nad post fade button. Just like inserts. Inserts are not always prefade. The last two slots (inserts 7 and 8) on each channel or group or FX return have two post fade insert slots.

Generally speaking, FX channels are just group channels with limited routing otpions. In fact, Most of the timne I tend to not use FX channels, but use group channels for my FX. The reason I do this is so that I have a full featured channel on my FX. It comes in really handy when you want to do something like have a delay return for a vocal feed into a reverb so that the delays are also a little verbed instead of dry. If you were to use an FX send for your reverb, you would acutally have to put your delay on insert 1 of the FX channel, and then add a reverb to insert 2 which means your wet/dry balance is controlled by the reverb plugin itself, and not balanced by the faders of the returns. Keep in mind that group channels can be routed into by channel aux sends as well as the channel's main output routing. FX channels, are only accesible by the channel aux sends.

In the end there are many different ways you can use each. There is not a set right or worng method, only that which works and that which doesn't. For me I prefer to use the group channels because then all of my options are open to me all the time.
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Again, depending on what version of Cubase you are using 99% of this is outdated info. :)
 
Ha.... For some reason, I thought that the original poster had mentioned Cubase SX3, so this whole time I had been asusming that. Some of the info still aplies though, at least the technique parts. :D

Out of curiosity NL5, what are the biggest differences you noticed?
 
xstatic said:
Out of curiosity NL5, what are the biggest differences you noticed?
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I upgraded from SX3, so the differences are greater than from Cubase 4. The biggest change has been in the routing. All the BS routing limitations from SX3 are gone. You can route anything to anywhere as long as it doesn't make an infinite loop. You can also drag plugins anywhere on the mixer - in other words, change the order on the fly, or move them to another track. Combine that with Variaudio, and it is WELL worth the upgrade.

edit - and so far Reverence seems pretty awesome too, although I mainly use outboard verbs.
 
I'm on cubase sx3. So how and where do you create a group channel? Some more details please.
Thanks
 
Do as you would normally do to create an audio or midi track, only choose 'group track' instead.
 
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