Well, I'm no Jesse M. Garcia, but I try hard...

  • Thread starter Thread starter chrisharris
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NL5 said:
Hey Chris,

Could you explain how you recorded this peice? (with as much detail as possible)
I'm floored you asked, but all I can take credit for recording are the vocals and acoustics, both of which were recorded with an AKGc3000 condenser (I hear it's good for mic'ing drum toms, lol).

acoustics/vocals - Actually, I kinda' dig that mic on my acoustic, but that's probably because it's a rosewood (really boomy) and something about the harshness of the mic kinda' helps offset the "warmth" of the guitar, lol. On just about every song I record, acoustic gits are part of the mix, and my standard treatment is to roll off everything below 80Hz right off the bat. On this tune, I ended up compressing them fairly heavily, then I hacked out a hole at 100Hz and eventually made a pretty wide/deep cut at 315Hz because the drums and bass were all in that area and the mix was muddy. I also almost universally boost 12K about 3dbs. On vocals, the mic is rough. On this tune, I ended up making about an octave wide cut 3 or 4 db deep centered at 2.5K to scoop some of the harshness out, and then I boost it a bit around 12K to try to give a touch of life to this shitty mic, HAHAHA!!!! There is absolutely no reverb on either the vocal or the rhythm acoustic guitars. There's a little bit on the acoustic leads. I did some doubling of the vocals in a few spots where it was sounding too upfront. When I double a vocal, I take the doubled track and compress the living shit out of it, boost the highs in it, autotune it, :D , and mix it about 12db-15db lower than the main vocal...or basically, up to a point where I can't consciously HEAR it, but when I mute it, the vocal "feels" different, if that makes any sense at all, lol.


Drums - As far as mixing goes, the kit was the hardest. It was well recorded, but everything except the kick was a lot darker than any drums I've ever mixed. It works in the context of the song, but it took my slow ass awhile to get it close. The drummer sent me the Kick, Snare, 3 tom tracks, and 2 overheads. I just highpassed everything except the kick, which I boosted at 50Hz and 6K (normal). I hate to admit this, but I actually used a BBE sonic maximizer on the kick to soften it a bit and put a little more meat in it. If the drummer sees this post, he WILL flame me, lol. I originally overcompressed and overgated the snare and it was just really shitty and thin, so after jacking around with it for 2 days, I finally just started over and manually enveloped/automated the volume of the snare throughout the entire song. Toms I only highpassed...and notched out around 315Hz. The overheads were the the easiest. Just panned them out about 70% each way, highpassed them at like 300Hz, lol...used a soft knee compression preset after the reverb plug, so it was kinda' compressing reverb, which is usually a disaster, but I liked it okay for the overheads.

bass - I got a good bass player who sent me a good bass track, end of story, LOL. I think he played through a POD, but I only made 2 adjustments to it. First, cut out a hole between 80Hz-100Hz (to make room for the kick) and then boosted it a couple of dbs at 500Hz and 1K. It was just a little too bright, so I also ended up using one of my favorite "fake vintage warmth" plugs, LOL. (PSP Vintage Warmer)...it's basically a multiband compression plug, but I didn't use much compression at all...used it more like a very simple EQ to add some lowmid psychoacoustics. It's hard to explain, but that plug is capable of warming up a track without muddying up a mix as much as using normal EQ would to get the same sound. I really don't know how it works, and just a LITTLE BIT goes a long way, but I dig it. In fact, I used that same plug to compress the acoustic guitars, too.

I don't know how the electric leads were recorded, but I'd bet that the wah was a mic'd mesa boogie. Sluice sent me another clean lead track that I think he actually liked better from a tone standpoint, but then, it wasn't a wah, hahaha. I'll ask both shredders how they recorded.

Wow...detailed enough? The truth is that all the tracks I got were just very well recorded, so even a knucklehead like me will eventually be able to stumble onto a decent mix. Others could make an astounding mix out of it, I think. Thanks a lot for asking...I enjoy rambling about this stuff.
 
wow . . agreed - I am dwarfed.

Those acoustics sound REALLY nice (heaps of clarity and depth) and I really like the deep quality to your voice.

It's a great song too. Love the sweeping chorus.

I'm listening to it again - shit that mix is so good
 
Thank you very very much nickjc. Do you have any mp3's of your tunes with acoustic guitar sounds that you DON'T like? Seems there are very easy (and common) EQ tweaks that can help them a lot.
 
nice job chris and collaborees.. sounds really good!

do i hear auto tuning at 1:08 :D

id like to hear a little more air around the vocals to gel them to the drums a little better ..

a hear a tad of mid range boominess in the intro guitar... maybe next time point the mic towards the fretboard just a hair more... and try to use a small condenser when more than one acoustic guitar is being used.. you can tuck it in better

i think you did a pretty good job sorting out the frequencies and instrument placement

enjoyed!!
 
Mr. Harris & Associates,

I would never tell you this kind of music isn't my cup of tea because I don't drink stinking tea!

You guys did a great job on this! :cool:

Very smooth and slick all around, good composition, excellent playing skills by all and a very serviceable mix! :)

About the only concern I have with it is perhaps in the MP3 transfer, I was detecting a bit of low end clipping and looking at the sine waves on my scope, there was bits of flat-line signaling that corresponded to the minor clipping I was hearing.

Obviously, (as I trust your engineering skills), I am sure this more a problem with NWR artificially bumping up the signal of the MP3 file once its on their server as apposed to you not doing a competent transfer. I've noticed this effect from them from a few other people who post on there too. :eek:

Anyway, great tune. I enjoyed it.

Cheers! :)
 
Man I'd drive to Hewitt, Texas just to sit in on a recording session and see how you got this to sound so GOOD! I mean i am listensing to this on a mono speaker at work all i can say is wow!
 
WOW, spamming works, lol

JMarcomb said:
do i hear auto tuning at 1:08 :D
I sure wouldn't rule it out, LOL!!!

JMarcomb said:
id like to hear a little more air around the vocals to gel them to the drums a little better
Ahhh...interesting comment, and noted. This is the 2nd tune I've done in my life without vocal reverb. I'll boost the hiss region a tad more, b/c I totally trust your ears, lol.

JMarcomb said:
a hear a tad of mid range boominess in the intro guitar
Yeah, that's the only section where I didn't EQ the gits at all, but now I can. Thanks for the tips, Jeff. Appreciated as always.

The Ghost of FM said:
About the only concern I have with it is perhaps in the MP3 transfer,
Or perhaps I slammed the shit out of the low end, LOL!! Thanks for the ears...I'll definitely look into that. Thanks again man.

bigwillz24 said:
Man I'd drive to Hewitt, Texas just to sit in on a recording session ...
DO IT!!! Actually, all I do is ask great musicians to help out, lol...sounds WAY better that way :D - Let's see...I've got a gig at Papa's on The Lake next weekend...come out and record it and we'll mix until one of us passes out, lol. Thanks a ton for the listen and the comment.

I APPRECIATE THE INPUT VERY MUCH...THANK YOU EVERYBODY
 
chrisharris said:
Thank you very very much nickjc. Do you have any mp3's of your tunes with acoustic guitar sounds that you DON'T like? Seems there are very easy (and common) EQ tweaks that can help them a lot.

the answer to this question is HELL YEAH!!

I'm still getting into the whole mixing bag and I still would say I'm a musician first, so if you could point me in the direction of some posts with those EQ tips I would be most grateful.

at the moment I'm only using an average dynamic mic, so I think what I can do might be a bit limited without a condenser :(
 
Hey Chris

As always, sounds great. Good enough to be that song that you let keep playing while your cruising the site. Thats how I judge songs. Is this one a colaberation? Sounds good man. I think some one said it already but I think a little more space on the vocals would add to the kinda sad theme thing. But, what the hell do I know, Your the genius. lol. Very cool kinda Kid Rock. Sorry if thats not a compliment. Have fun


Tony
 
nickjc said:
the answer to this question is HELL YEAH!!

I'm still getting into the whole mixing bag and I still would say I'm a musician first, so if you could point me in the direction of some posts with those EQ tips I would be most grateful.
Hey man, I clicked on your link and am listening. Your voice and harmonies remind me a LOT of another guy who started posting on this site a couple of years ago - he turned out to be one of my favorite people on the planet....the good news is, he actually got a record deal earlier this year. The bad news is, his recordings sounded a lot like yours, and they had to get a shitload better before his demo got in the right hands, LOL!!! But the songs are hooky and melodic and vibrant to my ear, which trumps asslike sounds anyday.

Now, like on "new market," the acoustic sound is not bad, but the guit's out of tune, lol. DAMMIT. I'm rambling, I just think you have something that will definitely get better over time. Whenever an acoustic sounds boxy, cut it at 315Hz and smile. Oh, and I've heard some AMAZING recordings of acoustics done with dynamic mics...the trick is to close mic it because a 58 won't pick up much of anything worthwhile 6 inches away from the mic. So mic 'em ridiculously close and then just pull some of the lows and low mids out until it kinda' rings...but honestly, your acoustic sounds not too shabby at all my friend. Tune it next time, lol. Man, you have some strong songs. KEEP WRITING THOSE.

stoctony - I'm a genius like Brittany Spears is an artist...(i.e., NOT). Man, I have to confess, I really like Avril AND Pink, lol. I think they have strong songs that I can't turn off, lol. But to answer your question, yes...it was a collab. I posted it as an acoustic piece in this thread earlier this week, and it grew in a way that warms my heart. http://www.recordingproject.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=8664 - not spamming for RP, it's just interesting to me to listen to the original now. :D
 
Chris, its cool about the spam, you already spamed me to that site and I am now an official RP member. life doesn't get much more satisfying than that lol

Tony
 
chrisharris said:
Hey man, I clicked on your link and am listening. Your voice and harmonies remind me a LOT of another guy who started posting on this site a couple of years ago - he turned out to be one of my favorite people on the planet....the good news is, he actually got a record deal earlier this year. The bad news is, his recordings sounded a lot like yours, and they had to get a shitload better before his demo got in the right hands, LOL!!! But the songs are hooky and melodic and vibrant to my ear, which trumps asslike sounds anyday.

Now, like on "new market," the acoustic sound is not bad, but the guit's out of tune, lol. DAMMIT. I'm rambling, I just think you have something that will definitely get better over time. Whenever an acoustic sounds boxy, cut it at 315Hz and smile. Oh, and I've heard some AMAZING recordings of acoustics done with dynamic mics...the trick is to close mic it because a 58 won't pick up much of anything worthwhile 6 inches away from the mic. So mic 'em ridiculously close and then just pull some of the lows and low mids out until it kinda' rings...but honestly, your acoustic sounds not too shabby at all my friend. Tune it next time, lol. Man, you have some strong songs. KEEP WRITING THOSE.

hey chris, cheers HEAPS for the advice - I really value compliments from you after listening to your stuff :D

really? who did I sound like? and here I was thinking I was sooo orginial lol :rolleyes:

which guits are out of tune on newmarket? the acoustics? I never noticed, dammit!!

anyways, cheers heaps for the advice. I must go as I'm busy downloading more songs from your site . . . :D :D
 
This is really cool.
I'm not hearing twenty guys playing though...
 
chrisharris said:
I'm floored you asked, but all I can take credit for recording are the vocals and acoustics, both of which were recorded with an AKGc3000 condenser (I hear it's good for mic'ing drum toms, lol).

acoustics/vocals - Actually, I kinda' dig that mic on my acoustic, but that's probably because it's a rosewood (really boomy) and something about the harshness of the mic kinda' helps offset the "warmth" of the guitar, lol. On just about every song I record, acoustic gits are part of the mix, and my standard treatment is to roll off everything below 80Hz right off the bat. On this tune, I ended up compressing them fairly heavily, then I hacked out a hole at 100Hz and eventually made a pretty wide/deep cut at 315Hz because the drums and bass were all in that area and the mix was muddy. I also almost universally boost 12K about 3dbs. On vocals, the mic is rough. On this tune, I ended up making about an octave wide cut 3 or 4 db deep centered at 2.5K to scoop some of the harshness out, and then I boost it a bit around 12K to try to give a touch of life to this shitty mic, HAHAHA!!!! There is absolutely no reverb on either the vocal or the rhythm acoustic guitars. There's a little bit on the acoustic leads. I did some doubling of the vocals in a few spots where it was sounding too upfront. When I double a vocal, I take the doubled track and compress the living shit out of it, boost the highs in it, autotune it, :D , and mix it about 12db-15db lower than the main vocal...or basically, up to a point where I can't consciously HEAR it, but when I mute it, the vocal "feels" different, if that makes any sense at all, lol.


Drums - As far as mixing goes, the kit was the hardest. It was well recorded, but everything except the kick was a lot darker than any drums I've ever mixed. It works in the context of the song, but it took my slow ass awhile to get it close. The drummer sent me the Kick, Snare, 3 tom tracks, and 2 overheads. I just highpassed everything except the kick, which I boosted at 50Hz and 6K (normal). I hate to admit this, but I actually used a BBE sonic maximizer on the kick to soften it a bit and put a little more meat in it. If the drummer sees this post, he WILL flame me, lol. I originally overcompressed and overgated the snare and it was just really shitty and thin, so after jacking around with it for 2 days, I finally just started over and manually enveloped/automated the volume of the snare throughout the entire song. Toms I only highpassed...and notched out around 315Hz. The overheads were the the easiest. Just panned them out about 70% each way, highpassed them at like 300Hz, lol...used a soft knee compression preset after the reverb plug, so it was kinda' compressing reverb, which is usually a disaster, but I liked it okay for the overheads.

bass - I got a good bass player who sent me a good bass track, end of story, LOL. I think he played through a POD, but I only made 2 adjustments to it. First, cut out a hole between 80Hz-100Hz (to make room for the kick) and then boosted it a couple of dbs at 500Hz and 1K. It was just a little too bright, so I also ended up using one of my favorite "fake vintage warmth" plugs, LOL. (PSP Vintage Warmer)...it's basically a multiband compression plug, but I didn't use much compression at all...used it more like a very simple EQ to add some lowmid psychoacoustics. It's hard to explain, but that plug is capable of warming up a track without muddying up a mix as much as using normal EQ would to get the same sound. I really don't know how it works, and just a LITTLE BIT goes a long way, but I dig it. In fact, I used that same plug to compress the acoustic guitars, too.

I don't know how the electric leads were recorded, but I'd bet that the wah was a mic'd mesa boogie. Sluice sent me another clean lead track that I think he actually liked better from a tone standpoint, but then, it wasn't a wah, hahaha. I'll ask both shredders how they recorded.

Wow...detailed enough? The truth is that all the tracks I got were just very well recorded, so even a knucklehead like me will eventually be able to stumble onto a decent mix. Others could make an astounding mix out of it, I think. Thanks a lot for asking...I enjoy rambling about this stuff.


Thanks Chris.

One again, really nice job!
 
Yawnnnn!!!!
Yeah.
So?

:D

Just kidding! That was real solid. Definately the kind of stuff I'd listen to.
Everything sounded real good.
At around 24 sec., you pan the guitar to the left? Why?

I thought the cymbals had some real... sizzle to them.... maybe a tad too much.

The Wah guitar at the end seemed completely out of place. Nowhere else in the song was it ever introduced, so when you hear it at the end.... it was almost like that was an after thought. Also, the style of the guitar at the end didn't fit well with the soft acoustic ballad you were performing through out the song. I mean, a screaming electric, featured at the end would have been real cool, because we heard that in other parts of the song... but the Wah.... well, it just seemed out of place.

It'd be cool to submit this to something like Recording Mag's "Reader's Tapes", just for some additional perspective.

Real good job though.
 
great song Chris...

So crisp and clear, I am extreamly jealous.

I love the electric guitar sound you put together, really sits well and adds an exciting texture to the tune.

Dry vocals eh? I don't think it would hurt to add in some effect to key lines in the song. Then again if it ain't broken don't fix it.

I can't comment on the low end (bad response in my room), but it seemed well balanced thourout the entire song.

thanks for the listen.
 
Hey guys, thanks a ton for checking it out...

nickjc - the guy you sound like to me goes by the username "Jamal Bucket," and his real name is actually Jamal Buchet (boo SHAY'), lol. Despite the name, HE'S A WHITE GUY, lol. Your voices sound really similar, and I'd love to point you to one of his tunes, but since he got signed, he had to take all of his internet stuff down. He's recording his first album now under the band name 'Blame Amy.' Yeah, the acoustic was out throughout the song...sounded like the B string, lol....SORRY!!!

acid rock - GREAT TO SEE YOU IN HERE, lol. Hmmm...i wonder what possessed some of you cave dwellers to venture out? :D - Thanks a ton for listening...I may have exaggerated the number of players just a bit.

JONES - Spot on, as usual. The overheads were done differently this time than any other drum tracks I've ever treated. I put some reverb in front of the compressor in the chain to kinda' bring out the super top end a bit better than the 5K that was killing me. You're not the first to comment that they may be a bit hot, so I'll adjust that. Now, on the wah, you're totally correct, but there's a story behind it. This tune was actually inspired by Slackmaster2K...he posted recently on RP that he and his wife were seperating, and that basically, there wasn't even a fight, but that it was just out of the blue for him. Well, that's what the song was about, and I really wanted to get as many people as possible to do as many weird things as possible. When I first posted it, I begged for somebody to do "the most out of place solo possible," and Sluice nailed the idea. I don't wanna' get all artsy on you, but the IDEA for the end was to be chaotic and disjointed, much like a divorce...and I couldn't think of a more fitting tribute to Slack than to have as many visitors of his site as possible add to the chaos. I had never even HEARD of a "Melodica" before this song, lol. I know it's weird, but for the only time in my life, I can actually say the weirdness was intentional...I mean, it's not like I'm pitching anything to Warner-Chappel these days, HAHAHA. Thanks for the panning tip...it's the same position that the guitar is in when I'm singing solo at the beginning, but you're right in that it does seem weird later in the song.

JKestle - thanks very very much...I've been fighting every instinct in my body to NOT put reverb on the vocal for this tune, but I think I can experiment a little now...I mean, a little won't hurt, right? RIGHT?!?!?!! (**cowers in the corner and wets himself like a dope-sick heroin addict**)

:D

Thanks everybody...this mix has come a long way thanks to some very valuable help from you guys...and no, I'm not drunk...I just type a lot, lol.
 
>>Well, I'm no Jesse M. Garcia, but I try hard<<

Dude, I just got it......a little slow around here.

(shameless bump)
 
I can't download at work anymore so I downloaded this morning and put it on a CD and listened on the way to work. True, you're no Jesse M. Garcia, but who is? The bar has indeed been set high when Jesse allowed us access to his art but you sir approach that mark. GREAT acoustic tone. And the envelope follower on the lead at the end a la Garcia (JERRY Garcia :D ) was a nice touch. Great job to all involved.
 
Track Rat said:
...e so I downloaded this morning and put it on a CD and listened on the way to work...
Dude, I HAVEN'T even gone to that much trouble yet to check it.

Okay, seriously, I value your opinion a ton, so thanks very much, TR.
 
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