"Wall of Sound" Mixing

ausgrindslaught

New member
I play grind. Some of you know this. I want huger than hell production. A massive wall of guitar - screams up front, snare cutting through the mix, distorted bass creating all kinds of chaos underneath. Like;

www.myspace.com/splitter
www.myspace.com/rottensound
www.myspace.com/nasum
www.myspace.com/gadgetgrindcore

Any tips in terms of;
- channel mixing/placement
- compression (or lack thereof)
- guitar tracks (2 x 2 guitars? or just 2 tracks? phase flipping?)
- cranking the life out of the limits post mixing

And so on?
 
I think the wall of sound has as much to do with the arrangements as the mixing. If you haven't already, do some google searches, you might come up with some interesting info. I believe part of the wall of sound concept is lots of doubling in the arrangements. By doubling I don't mean just doubling once, I mean doubling over and over with different instruments.
 
I've found one decent article;

http://www.recordingeq.com/EQ/req0600/stereogt.htm

It talks about recording guitar tracks with a dynamic mic and a condensor mic, and making sure theyre 'in phase'. I tried doing this with recording - spent bloody HOURS trying to get them in phase. I failed. I'm not looking for post recording ideas. Aint too much out there on the web that I could find :(

*Edit: Had another look and found advice to the effect of 'use shitloads of tracks'. How the hell do I do that while having any reasonable DB level? Insanity. Anyone have an experience create a really huge sounding wall of electric guitars?
 
Last edited:
ausgrindslaught said:
*Edit: Had another look and found advice to the effect of 'use shitloads of tracks'. How the hell do I do that while having any reasonable DB level? Insanity.

This advice is along the lines of what I've read on the subject.

As far as the dB levels, you just make sure you adjust the levels so that you aren't overloading. It's not about pure volume, it's about a particular "sound".

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "I'm not looking for post recording techniques", but the wall of sound approach will involve the arrangements, recording, and mixing aspects. You can't just pick and choose which part of it you want, and which you don't want. Unless you are intending to modify it in some way.

The whole thing is, the wall of sound was Phil Spector's innovation. So you need to read what he said about it, and those that worked with him. I'm not sure about that article you linked to, but it really only covered one aspect of the sound. Basically the near and far miking aspect of it.

Read this link, it's a pretty concise description of the wall of sound that seems pretty much like what I've always read about it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wall_of_Sound

So based on that article there are two essential things you need do to simulate the wall of sound: multiple near and far miking, and heavy doubling of the instruments in the arrangements. The far miking was basically creating echos and reverb by miking an echo chamber, so you could simulate that with multiple delay/fx boxes probably.
 
Last edited:
As far as building a wall of sustained and distorted electric guitar, try to give eack guitar track as individual a sonic personality as possible. The basic mixing rules of wantng to fill and balance the three dimensions of the soundstage still apply; they don't just go out the window because we're talking all guitars.

This means stuff like when recording your individual tracks to be assembled into the wall like bricks, using different pickups, mixing up the stomp box chain a bit, using different amp channels, switching microphones, and using some tongue-and-groove EQing all to get the tracks to play together spectrum-wise. Recording the exact same guitar sound over and over again will result in a lot of mud; even though it's a wall of guitars, there has to be some sonic mortar seperating the individual bricks, otherise it'll just be a messy pile of bricks and not a nice solid wall.

This also means balancing these sonic difference in pan space. For example, if you have, say, six guitar tracks and tracks 1 and 3 sound almost the same frequency characteristics-wise, seperate them in pan space left and right (not necessarily hard panned; while you can have some gits hard-panned, not everything with 6 strings need to be hard panned, even in metal.) Layer your guitars across the wall so that not all alike-sounding tracks are in one spot; seperate the fuller-sounding tracks with brighter-sounding tracks and vice versa.

Your arrangement will dictate what's best compression-wise once you're mixing. While most people individually compress every track to the max and then stack them, when building a wall, sometimes it's best to ease off on the amount of individual track compression, adding just enough to thicken the track just a little, but not squash it. Then when the tracks are assembled into the wall, add the final amount of smaller compression to the entire wall (perhaps as a submix) to give it some overall glue. You'll have to figure out which way is best for your composition.

HTH,

G.
 
Last edited:
What he said, except I wouldn't even think about compression until the tracks are all recorded and the sound is getting where you want it. It's much more about the arrangements and the echo/reverb creating the right space for everything.
 
SonicAlbert said:
What he said, except I wouldn't even think about compression until the tracks are all recorded and the sound is getting where you want it.
I completly agree. I didn't specify that very well in my post, but yeah, that should, along with the EQ, be something that's applied after the raw tracking is complete.
Ironklad Audio said:
Man, not only is my typing getting worse, but I've been slacking off on my typo patrol. "wapp" is of course supposed to be "wall". Going back in and making corrections...

G.
 
*core music is it's own worst enemy when it comes to sounding big. There's usually just too much going on. In order to be big you have to have something small to compare it to.

Arrange your songs with some simple intros and breaks. Have those be more mono sounding so when the full band kicks in it sounds huge in comparison. Use dynamics. If it's all at 11 then it's just a big wash.

The reason Metallica became the biggest metal band around is because they learned to use dynamics and mix things up.
 
Metallica were masters of dynamics and composition if nothing else. Grindcore bands however... a different beast. I can understand what youre saying though.

I meant that I cant really use PRE MIXING techniques (instead of post recording which was just retarded). What I intended to do was record 2 guitar tracks for each song. Just about got 1 down. Now I'm thinking about doing 3 - but its pretty impractical for me to do much more than that.

From there I see my options as using each track multiple times with differing EQs and panning. Hell if two tracks are similar use a small delay to knock them out of phase a little. Experiment some with some echo chamber or reverb/delay effects.

Clearly I'd just have to keep lowering the DB output of each track so make sure the levels arent overcranked.

What about in terms of channel mixing? Again, similar to panning - let each track overlap slightly with another so they blend? Anyone got a good channel mixing page for idiots?

Thanks for the responses guys - but close and far micing aint gonna happen. Very limited in where and when I'm recording. I havent even got my own place.
 
TexRoadkill said:
The reason Metallica became the biggest metal band around is because they learned to use dynamics and mix things up.
And they wrote some fucking good songs? DUH :D
 
ausgrindslaught

consider asking this over at UltimateMetal.com and probably on the Sneap Forum

it's way more heavy guitar centric and some guys over there produce some really good stuff.

you're much more likely to get what you're looking for over there.
 
Back
Top