VST Instruments

[coleBoom]

I am not a musician. I started doing the home recording thing because I knew a bunch of musicians, and I am a technocrat. It fascinates me to watch people play music. I think it is insane that anyone can do it.

I told myself I would never get into the Midi thing because so many people who can't actually play use it to do their own music.

I just upgraded to Cubase 5 and decided to hook my electric piano up to the computer to see all the different voices available with cubase....
I think this is really cool, and I have decided if my Keyboard friends want to use these voices instead of the ones on the piano that would be fine..

So here is the question

If I am looking for a great package of midi voices and a player which is based on samples (so I can add my own voices of I want to)

What would be a great one

Less than $500

Thanks ahead of time for your help

 

[Jim Lad]

I told myself I would never get into the Midi thing because so many people who can't actually play use it to do their own music.

What?
People who can't play shouldn't use midi?
Is this some unwritten rule?

 

[Chili]

I am not a musician. I started doing the home recording thing because I knew a bunch of musicians, and I am a technocrat. It fascinates me to watch people play music. I think it is insane that anyone can do it.

I told myself I would never get into the Midi thing because so many people who can't actually play use it to do their own music.

I just upgraded to Cubase 5 and decided to hook my electric piano up to the computer to see all the different voices available with cubase....
I think this is really cool, and I have decided if my Keyboard friends want to use these voices instead of the ones on the piano that would be fine..

So here is the question

If I am looking for a great package of midi voices and a player which is based on samples (so I can add my own voices of I want to)

What would be a great one

Less than $500

Thanks ahead of time for your help

I don't really use VSTi's (except ezdrummer), but EMU has a free download called Proteus VX. It's got a ton of patches. www.emu.com

 

[Jim Lad]

We just spent $200 on a Yamaha keyboard (Christmas) for my daughter to learn piano on. Comes with the full Yamaha effects which I think, Cubase has in there too.
There is a huge array of midi keyboards with USB and stand alone keyboards with midi I/O.
You can actually spend as much on VSTs in your music shop as you would for a keyboard.
A whole fascinating variety of music and instruments at your fingertips.
I'm just starting to use it a little myself, Coleboom. (and can't play a note on the piano)
Enjoy your new venture.

 

[studiogenocide]

I'm a Sampletank nut, and have ben for years. for about $250, you can get the complete version and about 4 gigs of sounds if I am not mistaken, and it is very expandable- order the expansions a la carte. I use them on almost EVERY mix, and I guarantee you will not know its MIDI when its in the mix. Good luck.

 

[studiogenocide]

I don't really use VSTi's (except ezdrummer), but EMU has a free download called Proteus VX. It's got a ton of patches. www.emu.com

Chili, tell me about EMU. I have Sampletank and I love it, but I love MIDI stuff- the more the merrier. Is it good? or even decent?

you use ezdrummer- what do you think of the Ocean Way drums? I have kits 1 - 13 but have not had a chance to use them yet. maybe you can help me use my program?

 

[Chili]

Chili, tell me about EMU. I have Sampletank and I love it, but I love MIDI stuff- the more the merrier. Is it good? or even decent?

you use ezdrummer- what do you think of the Ocean Way drums? I have kits 1 - 13 but have not had a chance to use them yet. maybe you can help me use my program?

When I downloaded Proteus VX, I was looking for a good Grand Piano patch. It has several in its library, but none that I thought were better than my keyboard. Just browsing through the library, I saw that it had a ton of patches and it looks like they are programmable. Probably modeling after the Proteus synths.

I don't know anything about Ocean Way drums except when they were announced through UAD, they were wayyy more expensive than I could afford.

 

[studiogenocide]

When I downloaded Proteus VX, I was looking for a good Grand Piano patch. It has several in its library, but none that I thought were better than my keyboard. Just browsing through the library, I saw that it had a ton of patches and it looks like they are programmable. Probably modeling after the Proteus synths.

I don't know anything about Ocean Way drums except when they were announced through UAD, they were wayyy more expensive than I could afford.

I got some kits through a promo at a very cool $100. More than I need, I have several now. As far as grands go, the best sounding one I got believe it or not was a freebie I got through the same promo that got me the drums through ezsoundz. you'll have to check out some of my mixes later. we are doing some nice stuff- you dig country?

 

[grimtraveller]

I'm a Sampletank nut

I guarantee you will not know its MIDI when its in the mix. Good luck.

I've been using Sampletank for close on 6 years and it's a really good programme if you're looking for authentic instrument sounds. Not all of them are, but enough are to give you a wide range to choose from for many different genres. You can add other sample programmes to it or add your own samples which is kind of interesting.
I didn't appreciate this at first but I find now that tweaking each instrument is so important in determining how it sounds - it's a little deceptive to say "just plug in and play". Also, in a mix, it's important that the sounds aren't too prominent or if they are, to be mixed with not so much brightness so that they don't sound odd. Also important is playing each instrument the way the player of that instrument would, not the way a keyboardist or cak handed octopus would.
With those in mind, I'd recommend it to anyone if you're not happy with your current VSTis.

 

[kcearl]

most of my sounds come from my JV now its fully expanded, I also use a Korg EA-1 for basslines and a S-50 for older samples...i find that compared to vsti's they are much fuller and really stand out..

Ive heard sylenth and gladiator and they seem to be the only soft synths that come close to the quality of an outboard, saying that i havent demo'd everything

I use Kontakt for any traditional sounds I dont have of the JV and because I buy MusicTech magazine every month, it always comes with excellent Kontakt patches...worth its $20 price alone...last one came with the Solina Strings and the one before that had samples from the VCS3 synth...priceless imo

 

[studiogenocide]

I've been using Sampletank for close on 6 years and it's a really good programme if you're looking for authentic instrument sounds. Not all of them are, but enough are to give you a wide range to choose from for many different genres. You can add other sample programmes to it or add your own samples which is kind of interesting.
I didn't appreciate this at first but I find now that tweaking each instrument is so important in determining how it sounds - it's a little deceptive to say "just plug in and play". Also, in a mix, it's important that the sounds aren't too prominent or if they are, to be mixed with not so much brightness so that they don't sound odd. Also important is playing each instrument the way the player of that instrument would, not the way a keyboardist or cak handed octopus would.
With those in mind, I'd recommend it to anyone if you're not happy with your current VSTis.

You hit the nail on the head. Piano is easy. What might be tough though, is playing a violin to sound "authentic". I recently mixed a project in which I played a lot of two noters the way a "fiddler" would (I do alot of country and bluegrass)- I was amazed at how real it sounded. Of course, if you play it solo, you can immediately pick up on the "that can't be a real fiddle" dynamic, but in the mix, you just cannot tell. I love it, and fiddle is so tough to sample as it is, so it just shows how far the technology has come.

Yep- definitely gotta make sure you play your "instrument" the way an instrument would actually be played. Guitars and other instruments sound really strange when not done properly. Good luck again.

 

[Chili]

I got some kits through a promo at a very cool $100. More than I need, I have several now. As far as grands go, the best sounding one I got believe it or not was a freebie I got through the same promo that got me the drums through ezsoundz. you'll have to check out some of my mixes later. we are doing some nice stuff- you dig country?

<sigh> I live in Texas, I have to listen to country!!! ha haha, j/k. Actually, Austin is like the anti-Texas as far as music goes. Tons of great music here. I'll check out your tunes later tonight or tomorrow.

$100 sounds like a very good deal indeed.

 

[grimtraveller]

What might be tough though, is playing a violin to sound "authentic". I recently mixed a project in which I played a lot of two noters the way a "fiddler" would (I do alot of country and bluegrass)- I was amazed at how real it sounded. Of course, if you play it solo, you can immediately pick up on the "that can't be a real fiddle" dynamic, but in the mix, you just cannot tell. I love it, and fiddle is so tough to sample as it is, so it just shows how far the technology has come.

Yep- definitely gotta make sure you play your "instrument" the way an instrument would actually be played. Guitars and other instruments sound really strange when not done properly. Good luck again.

Interesting you should say that for as I was writing earlier, it was the violin that I had in mind. Some of my earliest sampletank attempts on violin or viola were unfortunately in the days before I had really discovered 'tweakability' so they don't sound consistently authentic; I was just so excited at having instruments at my disposal that meant I wouldn't have to approach busking strangers or music college students to see if they'd lay down a piece ! I was actually going to do that. I probably would have scared the life out of whoever.....I love the violin and like it's usage within rock and jazz fusion (think Kansas, Shadowfax, Mahavishnu Orchestra or early 70s Mothers of Invention) as well as other genres so it's important to get it right. I imported this VSTi called "Celtic Instruments" into Sampletank that has great violins and I also use these other ones created by IK Multimedia called "Miroslav Philharmonik" which has superb ones.
You're right about the guitars too; I've used the electric guitars on a couple of things - didn't really like them but fortunately, the guitar in those songs was not important so I left them in for posterity. The acoustic guitar sounds I've never found good though I did do a solo with one from Sonik synth. You can't tell it's a sample as I made sure it was well enveloped in other elements in the mix.

 

[Jim Lad]

I imported this VSTi called "Celtic Instruments" into Sampletank that has great violins

I'd be really interested in that VST. Any links? How much $?

 

[studiogenocide]

Interesting you should say that for as I was writing earlier, it was the violin that I had in mind. Some of my earliest sampletank attempts on violin or viola were unfortunately in the days before I had really discovered 'tweakability' so they don't sound consistently authentic; I was just so excited at having instruments at my disposal that meant I wouldn't have to approach busking strangers or music college students to see if they'd lay down a piece ! I was actually going to do that. I probably would have scared the life out of whoever.....I love the violin and like it's usage within rock and jazz fusion (think Kansas, Shadowfax, Mahavishnu Orchestra or early 70s Mothers of Invention) as well as other genres so it's important to get it right. I imported this VSTi called "Celtic Instruments" into Sampletank that has great violins and I also use these other ones created by IK Multimedia called "Miroslav Philharmonik" which has superb ones.
You're right about the guitars too; I've used the electric guitars on a couple of things - didn't really like them but fortunately, the guitar in those songs was not important so I left them in for posterity. The acoustic guitar sounds I've never found good though I did do a solo with one from Sonik synth. You can't tell it's a sample as I made sure it was well enveloped in other elements in the mix.

Well- and interestingly enough, the violin I used was the solo violin from miroslav. As far as guitars go- I play one so I have no need to use the sounds, but for pop music, I thknk the acoustic ones would do fine. an absolute no-no foir country, as folks want the real wooden sound and the string sqeak to go with it. us country folks, we're a peculiar people, I know...

 

[studiogenocide]

<sigh> I live in Texas, I have to listen to country!!! ha haha, j/k. Actually, Austin is like the anti-Texas as far as music goes. Tons of great music here. I'll check out your tunes later tonight or tomorrow.

$100 sounds like a very good deal indeed.

i'll shoot you my latest project- you can;t go off my other ones on myspace, they're old and old equipmetn. have had a lot of nice upgrades as of late, and those recording are almost ten years old.. i'll shoot you a PM later.

 

[grimtraveller]

I'd be really interested in that VST. Any links? How much $?

For you, Jim lad ! A couple of them are current ebay links that are going cheaper than the advertized going rate. I quite like the pipes and fiddles and bits of percussion. Anyway, have a peruse !

http://www.inspirationsounds.co.uk/acatalog/big-fish-audio-celtic-instruments.html

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/New-Big-Fish-...tem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d2805c875

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/New-Big-Fish-...tem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d2805c900

http://www.dv247.com/sample-cds/big-fish-audio-celtic-instruments--52442

 

[Jim Lad]

Well I've yet to hear pipes, large or small, that come close. Some nice fiddle, flute, harp and accordion though. Banjo is another tough one and as already mentioned, acoustic guitar.
I'll bookmark this thread as a reference.
Thanks GT

 

[dintymoore]

... I don't know anything about Ocean Way drums except when they were announced through UAD, they were wayyy more expensive than I could afford.

Here's the samples: http://www.oceanwaydrums.net/audio2.php

The Ocean Way drums sound great, I wish i had them. I bought the Steven Slate Drums that were $20 a few months ago, that was a steal. Still, all the cymbals are pretty weak, but the drums are good and tweakable. Generally, I find all the drum samples need low pass filtering on the kick and some on the snare. Since day 1 I've found that all bass drum samples don't have near the needed ratio between the fundamental and the harmonics, and I've yet to hear one that the fundamental isn't drastically weaker than a real life kick. That's why I roll the top off of the samples - to get less harmonics and more fundamental.

 

[ddash85]

I think you would like Komplete 4. It has a ton of great sounding instruments. I believe close to 7000 or so. Also you get kontakt included, which you can import various different files of sounds.
It seem to load up and play everything.

Kontakt alone is priceless to me.