vf160 Internal mixdown and levels

  • Thread starter Thread starter glynb
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glynb

Balladeer
Simple question. When using internal mixdown on the vf160 how do you guys make sure you get the highest possible sound without clipping?

Should I be looking at the virtual meters and making sure they are near the top, or around 0db's? I'm not sure about this apsect, but I know I want my CDs to end up at least a similar level to those commercialy produced. Please don't direct me out to dicsussions of how commercialy produced Cds are mastered, i have read all about that, but i just want the best advice specificaly for the vf160 - I will be burning the mix downs to internal CD writer. The intention is to produce my own 'album' so its also im[portant that all the mixed songs have a similar volume level.

My current technique is to always put the lead vocal at 0dbs on its fader position at mix down and themn adjust the levels of the rest of the tracks accordingly, ensuring that the lead vocal can always be heard. I also leave the master fader at 0db and never move it, apart from fade-in or fade out.

Is what I want to achieve possible keeping the stuff on the Fostex, or is there no alternative but to output to PC and fiddle with it, which I'd rather not do.

Thanks in advance...
 
Should I be looking at the virtual meters and making sure they are near the top, or around 0db's?
Click to expand...

Yes,you should pay attention to the meters at all times during tracking AND at mixdown.The VU meters are the only way to know what the input and output signals actually are.Setting a fader to 0db does not equate to getting a 0db signal.

You need to get the "Master" output up to 0db.Just take a look at the Stereo master output VU meters and make sure the signal is hitting 0db.Just because you have faders set to 0db doesnt mean you are achieving a 0db output.It all depends on how hot your recorded tracks are to start with.You'll find that sometimes you'll have to push all the faders(including the Master fader) well above 0db during mixdown to achieve a 0db output.

It all comes down to getting source tracks that are close to 0db during tracking.If you get decent track levels during the tracking process you wont have a problem getting a decent output level at mixdown.

Pay attention to the VU meters for all tracks at ALL times to make sure you are getting decent levels.

Hope this helps,
Kramer
 
I'm working on a series of CDs for an acoustic blues compilation. I've recorded around 35 songs by individuals and groups, recording up to 8 tracks at a time. I'm getting equal volume levels from song to song, maybe not to a meter or PC mixing program, but certainly to my ears and those who have heard the mixes. Put simply, I'm getting a good enough product on the VF160 alone to preclude PC mixing or mastering.

When I first got the VF160, low volume and consistency was a problem for me, so I experimented and found some gear to help.

For more volume on my final products, part of the fix was increasing the strength of the original recorded signal and attempting to keep the virtual VUs at the 0db line at it's loudest. Probably the best tool I have to ensure a good strong signal is a Behringer mixer with 8 preamps- I use the mixer inserts to send as many sources as I'm recording at a time to the VF160. I set the gain pretty high on the Behringer preamps (2 or 3 o'clock) and then the VF160 input gains at about 12 o'clock. I think I get a more detailed, more consistent, more controllable signal using the preamps. (There's probably lots more on this site with preamp rationale...)

To prevent clipping during internal mixdown, I usually start the master faders at 0, and balance the mix as best I can. Once I happy with the balance, pan, effects, and EQ, I'll look at the check the L and R master virtual VUs and adjust the master faders to keep the L/R virtual VUs at the 0db lines.

I'm getting good, undistorted results with this basic approach.
 
Thank you for your responses, which were helpful.

I can get hot signals on virtualy everything I record on the vf160 except for vocals and acoustic guitar, which I have to turn the gain almost right up for, but using a compressor i can ensure the signal doesn't clip. So hot individual tracks is not a problem.

The budget doesn't stretch to a pre-amp at the moment.

I think I've been doing OK so far, but in future i will monitor the master meters and move the Master fader up as necessary to get as close to 0db as possible for each internal mix I do. I thought previously this wasn't 'allowed' because it might cause clipping. That way I should end up with songs of a similar consistent volume level on the final CD.
 
vf160 volume

Hey Glyn- mwaynew here. (Mike W.). I try to keep volumes above 0dbs, consistantly. I try to avoid the top. Any additional volume I gain from compression. I've found that, if I'm careful, I can boost the compression level enough to give me a good strong mixdown level.
 
Hi Mike - looks like you hang out on a lot of the same forums as me!!

You say you use compression to boost the volume safely - how do you do this. I mean do you channell the mixed-down track through an external compressor or do you transfer the mix from track 1&2 to 15&16 and compress it as you go using the Fostex compression? What are your compression settings for this?

- GB
 
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