VC1Q v. VC3Q - Help Alan Hyatt (or anyone else)

S

StillAwake

New member
OK, this might sound weird, but I cannot get as good of a vocal sound from my VC1Q as I can from the VC3Q. The VC3Q grabs my voice and gives it give punch- especially on the ah sounds and consonents- it's hard to describe; the VC1Q just doesn't sound as good and I've tried every setting I can think of - it's somehow rougher, not as crisp, although it is pretty "smooth" when I'm not hitting the consonents hard. The VC3Q is much better grabbing and taming consonents. I've tried different slopes, attacks, gain and output settings, and eq settings. I hardly have to touch the VC3Q to make it sound good- the VC1 I have to fuss and fidget with it constantly. Is the VC1Q just that much different of an animal? ANY suggestions would be gratefully appreciated!
 
StillAwake,

The VC1Q is a different animal, but the question is, which VC1Q do you have? Is it the VC1Q, or VC1QCS. It will say this on the front panel.

The VC3, or VC3Q is a great little box that does ratios automatically so you don't have to fuss much with the unit. In addition, the mic pre is a 2017 chip based design that is a very efficient design.

The VC1Q, if it is the 1Q and not the 1QCS is a descrete transformer design, and reacts much different than the VC3Q. In addition, you have to work the compressor rather than it work for you. In either case, the units tend to attract different customers at different levels.

The VC1Q likes to be driven hard. As I am not familiar with the vocal style you are looking for and what microphone you are using, I can't say that I can be your magic fix it man, but try setting up the input gain at + 18 on your VU meter, set the compression knob at 11 O'clock, ratio at 2 O'clock, attack at 10 O'clock, release at 9 O'clock, and drive your output gain to the necessary output level.

From there, increase the compression control knob, and or increase the slope control to ratio 3 or 4 for more punch, but then drive your output control harder, and listen to the track playback, not just the monitors

For now, leave the enhancer out, and tweak the eq to your liking. Give that a try, and if you need to, just give me a call on our toll free number, 877-563-6335, and ask for me.
 
Thank you...

I really appreciate your responding. I have a VC1Qcs and I'm using an AT4033 (I have a JM-47 which actually sounds a little better (as long as I de-ess). Anyway, my vocal style is is a strong baritone, blues/country style (you can hear it on acidplanet.com (Blue Sky Falling, Burnin' What is Left -sung on a VC3Q). I bought the VC1Qcs as a gold (or Green! :-) channel, thinking it would be better than th eVC3Q from all the reviews I read.

One trouble is the controls: you said to try setting the input gain at +18 on the VU meter. The VU meter goes from -20 to +3. If you meant the Input Gain knob, the only markings are 0, 40 & 60. The increments in between I can't figure- they don't go by 5db increment, or 10db increments- what's the math here? So where the heck is 18? 12:00? You said Ratio at 2:00- do you mean Slope at setting 2?

Both Meek units run into a Mackie 1202, and its outs go into a Gina. I don't think there's any problem there.

I suppose I'll get this eventually. I must say I really appreciate your giving me advice on the settings- that' more than you had to do given the information you had. If you can help me clear up a couple things here I think I'll be ok. Again- thanks so much!
 
I just bought a VC1Q this week.
LOVE IT!
I think you need to be more aggressive with the settings than a VC3Q. Use a higher slope to start, and if its too much, cut back.
I think you can get a much cleaner sound with the VC1Q than the 3Q, but the 1Q can be just as aggressive if you want it to be.
Oye, crank it up and see what it does!
Good luck,
C :D
 
Hey Guys,

All the Joemeek units have a very high overload margin. What this means is that most gear at 3db before clipping, mean 3db before clipping. Joemeek gear has about 18db to 21db of headroom left even when your red LED's are pegged, or your meter is nailed to the right.

You will hear distortion when you hit its clip point, but the problem is most people stop at the red, or when the meter is nailed. Now most professionals will tell you that you should stop, and even back off if your that hot until your at 0, but in the case of Joemeek. 'CRANK IT UP". The harder you hit the Joemeeks input, the better it sounds and performs.

So if you think your missing something, turn up the heat guys, it can take it. Don't worry, nothing will break, and even if it does, we fix it for free, so go to town and turn it up.
 
Alan-

how do I keep it from nailing the sh-- out of my soundcard when I push the gain up on it? Crank the input gain high, then hold the output gain back so it doesn't hit the soundcard so hard?- is that the general idea? I have a Gina-24 card that I can push pretty well w/ 108db of headroom, but it has it's limits.
 
StillAwake

The general idea is to hit the s!@* out of the Joemeek, not the Gina. Bring your input gain way up until the Red LED is glowing solid red, then add the compression and eq setting you want to ad.

Once this is done, just bring up your output gain until your Gina gets happy. Like I said, there is so much headroom in the meek, that in order to make the compressor and EQ happy you have to hit it hard. I am not a fan of the way the meter reads on the VC3Q, but I think I am qualified to say something negative on our own stuff.

England just reads gain stages a bit different from us here. They also put a ton of headroom in their products so they don't break up. This is why you have to push the VC3Q hard. When you do this, it sounds way better.
 
Re: V3Q

And another question for alan....
One reviewer on the V3Q speculated that the compression ratio
is fixed at an approximately 4:1. Therefore, when you adjust the
compression dial it's just changing the threshold level, whereupon
the compression effect follows a soft knee pattern.
Does this seem correct to you?.

Thanks for the advice on input levels.
 
Alan

so the same advice applies to the VC1Qcs- hit it hard and adjust the output gain until the Gina is "happy". I assume that would be the vu meter reading at about 0 to +2? As much as your advice has helped me get a better sound on the VC1Q, it's still doesn't reach out and grab my voice like the VC3 does- it's so clear and tight compared to what I've been able to get out of the VC1. The VC3 makes sounds like "I" and "ah" just crisp with a tightness at the point of attack- all that said, the VC1Q is smoother and clearer perhaps, but I still don't have the control I have with the VC3Q. I guess this is just gonna take some time, eh?
 
wow, this thread is a gem! I just bought a second hand VC3 the other day and since I know next to nothing about compression etc I baically set the dials in exactly the same way as the instruction book suggested. This has given me the impetus to play around with the setting a bit and crank up that gain!!

Thanks guys

Jags
 
The ratio is fixed on both the VC3 and VC3Q, but it is floating ratio. What I mean by this is it never goes below the ratio of 3.5:1, but it will go out to 10:1 depending on the input it sees. This is why when you hit the input hard, it sounds better because the transients are spiking so the ratio increases automatically.

As for the VC1Q, just forget about the input meter. Switch the meter to gain reduction and use your ears, not the meter. Turn the input up as much as you can until you start to hear distortion, then roll it back until the distortion goes away, then bring up your output gain to make what ever recorder your using happy.

And yes, C7sus and I agree, use all Joemeek gear direct to your recorder. Do not use a mixer in the chain. Use the second output of the Meek to monitor with if you need, or use your mixer to monitor only, but do not send the output of the Meek into a mixer first. Right on C7sus!!

For the record, no photo-optical unit is the same. You can't match them in the manufacturing process, so a VC3Q can sound better than a 1Q, and it is easier to use, but the advantages of the VC1, or VC1Q are too good to resist.
 
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