Upgrade to vocal path - RNC or Envoice or Green5 or ...?

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coloradojay

coloradojay

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My current signal chain:

Vocalist:
-Golden Voice somewhere between Stevie Wonder and KC+Jojo (no joke)

Vocal mics:
-Marshall v67
-Octava 319
-Shure Beta 87

Mic Pre:
-DMP 2

Compression:
-Behringer Composer

D/A:
-Tascam US-428 converters 48khz @ 24 bit to Sonar

What is the weakest link?

I am tracking an outstanding vocalist, which has got me now considering spending some money [I don't have] to improve my signal chain. So far, for the scratch/dry run tracks I've recorded his voice with no compression, and because he is so hugely dynamic (whisper to wail) and he definitly needs some for tracking. The v67and Beta87 currently the mics of choice for him, but we may use the Octava for some backup vocals/harmonies. Right now, my only hardware compression is a Com-poser.

Here is what I'm currently thinking:

At least get an RNC- this would get me some compression that is regarded as pretty transparent while tracking

OR (in the $450ish used range) a channel strip

-Envoice (maybe with A/D option)
-Comp seems to get decent reviews
-Pre often gets "transparent" label
-Converters possibly better than Tascam's???

-Focusrite Green 5
-Seems to get good reviews overall
-Has well regarded compressor
-Has usable "musical" EQ
-Possible secondary uses for mix "processing" one channel at a time for compression or eq

I've also considered a meek strip, but since it's got the connotation of "colored" I'm a little hesitant to consider it until I've got at least 1 good "transparent" path. The DBX 376 has crossed my mind too, but I haven't seen any glowing reviews on them (and it is tube).

Would the compression in the Mindprint or Focusrite be at least as good as the RNC? Would either be even better than the RNC?

Will the step up from the DMP/RNC to the Focusrite or Envoice be big enough to hear with these low budget mics?

Is there a better upgrade path I'm not considering here that I should be (maybe some other brand of channel strip, or a low end tube mic like MXL, Rode, or SP (to be run through the Com-poser, or RNC)?
 
Why not just stick with what you have until you can afford something really nice, like the Safesound P1.

www.frontendaudio.com

Anything else you might be looking at probably won't be that significant of a step up.
 
Hey Chessrock, thanks for the reply.

I honestly had never even heard of the Safesound strip. I scoped out the other threads and listened to the comparison warhead posted on nowhere. There was something I liked better about crispness of the Speck 5.0 on the male vocal sample, but it seemed a little too essy. Would you say the Speck is little colored compared to the Safesound? The speck is out of the pricerange and doesn't have compression/limiting, so I'm only asking this to try to get an idea of comparison.

Both snare and overhead tracks on the P1 were my favorite for those clips by far (with my gear/ears). Smooth and real- not tinny or muffled.

What's the advantage of it having a "multiple side-chained compressor" (in the p1)? Other than one less cable hop, what does this buy me that I don't get with the RNC? Or do you just like the limiting and compression on the P1 better in general? I'd still really like to hear a comparison of the RNP/RNC to the P1. Ozraves mentioned he might do one at some point- you out there Oz?.

Do you think having the built in expander is an advantage that sets it apart from other channel strips? How often would you really use an effect like that? (or maybe a little bit all the time?)

I suppose de-essing, and EQ can be handled with plug-ins for now, but they seem to be popular features in vocal strips. The Green5 has a variable-frequency high-shelving filters- I've got to guess that de-esses. The envoice de-esses too. Vocals are really my target for this next purchase so that's why I'm kinda lookin into strips, but the P1 sounds pretty choice.

Thanks in advance for any other ideas you feel like sharing on this.
 
Come to think of it the headphone monitoring sounds like a cool and usable feature too...
 
That's a lot of questions. :D I'd recommend asking Warhead about it. info@frontendaudio.com He's pretty helpful and easy to talk to.

I never really got a chance to play with the expander section, but man is that compression and limiting ever good.
 
chessrock said:
That's a lot of questions. :D I'd recommend asking Warhead about it. info@frontendaudio.com He's pretty helpful and easy to talk to.

I never really got a chance to play with the expander section, but man is that compression and limiting ever good.
Click to expand...

OK, I'll condense it to one more question (mulit-part :D )

You think the compresser/limiter is a step up from the RNC, but the RNC isn't really much of a step up from the composer? Correct me if I'm misreading that...

Thanks,

J
 
I don't know, man. Just try it out. It rocks. :D Does that help? (Hint: the limiter smokes)
 
No, actually it only complicates things, being that it's a 4th choice! :(

Now it's either proceed with the com-poser, be low-budget and add an RNC, or flip a coin for the safesound or the green5 strip, since I probably can't really go wrong there with either one of those.

Thanks for the tip and sale link. I don't think I'm going to be able to audition any of these side-by-side anywhere, so I'm just going to have to pick a budget, make a guess, and give it a try.

Peace out,

J
 
It's going to depend on what your priorities are, for the most part.

The Safesound doesn't have EQ. On the other hand, the Focusrite's compressor, while certainly usable, is going to be nowhere in the same league as that of the Safesound (or the RNP, for that matter) -- and no limiter, either.

So between the Safesound and the Focusrite, it should be a pretty straight-forward choice depending on which is more important to you -- the EQ or the compression/limiting.

As for the RNC, you need to consider how important the addition of a peak limiter would be. Overall, the compression will probably be similar, but the peak limiting on the Safesound is just out of this world, whereas the RNC doesn't have one.

Of all of your choices, the Focusrite will probably offer the most features in one package . . . while the Safesound is probably the most user-friendly and most professional-sounding of the bunch.
 
That sounds like a good summary. Extra respect your way for taking the time to converse even though we've bumped heads in the past.

I'm still torn as to what to do. The safesound seems choice, but it's another step up in money I don't really have to spend, especially considering I'm still using budget mics.

I've read some people say the RNC is somewhat useful for limiting, even though I know it doesn't have a limiter per se. It's interesting to hear that you feel like the P1 and even RNC would both outperform the compression in the Green5.

It seems like they didn't make too many, and the Green line is not very well-known, but probably at least a step up from the Platinum stuff from what I can gather.

Anyone else got any input on the upgrade?
 
After much thought, I ordered an RNC and a Kiwi mic cable from Humbucker. Really my top priority is getting some clean compression while tracking these vox right now, and while the com-poser would work, I trust the RNC will be a worthy improvement.

It will be interesting to see if the Kiwi will make a any difference over the cables I'm using now too.

That P1 still looks sweet though... Maybe after tax returns...
 
Hey, any time you can replace something with a Behringer logo . . . chances are strongly in your favor that it would be a good move.

And hey, I didn't realize we butted heads in the past. In that event, I take all my advice back, ya prick. :D :D :D he he.
 
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