ULTRA low input volume levels driving me insane! Please HELP!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Xpred
  • Start date Start date
Alright. I have a huge problem. I posted this on several forums, but I just recently found recording.org. Hopefully, I can post here and get some more input on my troubles:

COMPUTER SPECS:

1st PC:

P4 2.2 GHz w/ Intel 845E chipset, Gigabyte 81EXP mobo, Windows XP Pro w/ SP2, GF4 Ti4600, 1GB PC2100 DDR RAM, 80GB + 200GB HD, Onboard sound card: Creative SoundBlaster PCI128, Both an onboard FireWire card and another PCI firewire card (Both are VIA OHCI Compliant chipsets)

2nd PC:

AXP 2100+ w/ VIA KT400 chipset, Gigabyte GA-7VAXP mobo, Windows XP Home w/ SP2, GF4 Ti4200, 512MB PC2700 DDR RAM, 60GB + 200GB HD, Onboard sound card: Realtek AC'97, Both an onboard FireWire card and another PCI firewire card (Both are VIA OHCI Compliant chipsets)

EQUIPMENT:

1st Preamp: M-Audio FireWire Solo w/ latest drivers (don't have anymore)
2nd Preamp: PreSonus Firebox w/ latest drivers (current)
15' LiveWire Balanced XLR-to-XLR cable
Marshall MXL 990 Condensor Mic (vocal)
Marshall MXL 991 Condensor Mic (instrumental)

I have been using: GoldWave, Sound Forge, Adobe Audition

PROBLEM:

Very low input volume. This is indicated by the small amplitude readings (almost as tiny as a dot) when using a sound program. Input recording levels indicate at about 75% gain and a +12db boost in my PreSonus Firebox, levels were about -20db to -10db. This seems ALRIGHT for a low average to decent recording level, but seems unreasonable LOW for that MUCH gain and already a +12db boost.

SOLUTIONS TRIED:

-Phantom power is on. Normally the preamp is being bus-powered via 6-pin to 6-pin. If I plug in the adapter, it does nothing. The problem still remains.

-Updated all patches including sound, graphics, chipset, processor (etc). Double checked common OS settings like making sure input is the preamp and output is my onboard sound card.

-Tried the Windows XP SP2 patch that addresses FireWire speed issues (and other problems) with SP2 located at: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/885222. Still doesn't do anything.

-The preamp (whether faulty) has been ruled out, originally I tried using the M-Audio FireWire Solo and the low volume was also apparant. I then upgraded to PreSonus Firebox and this is where I am as of now. Still the same problem.

-I believe the XLR cable and mics are highly ruled out (although not fully 100% sure) because I tested the same products at two other places: @ GuitarCenter and my friends systems with the same equipment and the result was different at their place than mine. I used the same mics and cable.

-Called both tech support to determine the problem. As of current, I am still speaking with PreSonus TP to further test and rule out anything. Have been talking constantly for a week trying to get this damn thing solved.

-Bought a cheap Syba PCI FireWire card w/ again a VIA chipset to replace my onboard one. This allowed my IRQ to change (originally both my onboard FW card and graphics card were sharing the same IRQ-I thought this was problematic) to an independent number unshared by anything. Still the same problem.

THINGS TO CONSIDER:

-Tried everything on BOTH of my computers. They both seem to be doing the same. They are however, nearly identical. Both custom built with same BRAND of motherboard, graphics card, hard drives, just different models. Both have onboard audio and onboard firewire (different brands/models), and now both have non-onboard firewire.

-VIA vs TI vs other chipset FireWire card. I have been using only VIA chipsets. Maybe preamps in general not good with VIA? Because I have been using TWO preamps that did this. I haven't tried any USB preamps on either of my two computers

-Perhaps the MXL 990/991 mics just rather suck in general causing very low input? However, I have tested this out on two OTHER computers: 1). Guitar Center mac laptop running OS X and another laptop running XP SP2. It worked fine there. The levels were adequate.

-At 100% gain and even with a +12db boost, how loud I yell there seemed to be no clipping whatsoever. This is extremely bizzare and is a sign of a serious problem.
 
Last edited:
Xpred said:
I haven't tried your solution yet Bull, but I figure it wouldn't be too useful because I wouldn't have sound playback regardless if somehow it magically worked or not.

Why would you not have playback? Have you plugged your speakers into the Firebox? Can you play na mp3 and hear anything?
 
My onboard sound card is what I plug my main speakers into because they're my computer soundcards. So if I disable my onboard sound card, I wouldn't be able to play anything back.
 
Don't use your onboard soundcard!!!!! That's why you got the Firebox! I'm pretty sure the Firebox has much better D/A conversion than your onboard soundcard. Plus you'll have problems with trying to record on the Firebox while listening to already-recorded tracks throug the onboard (their clocks aren't sync'd up)

Go into your BIOS and disable your onboard sound, and plug your speakers into a line out on your Firebox. You should have no problems routing all sounds (including the Windows sounds) to the Firebox.

Xpred said:
My onboard sound card is what I plug my main speakers into because they're my computer soundcards. So if I disable my onboard sound card, I wouldn't be able to play anything back.
 
Hmm... sounds like a good plan. However, I need to buy a 1/8" to 1/4" converter/adapter. Anyone know of any high quality ones?
 
gordone said:
Don't use your onboard soundcard!!!!! That's why you got the Firebox! I'm pretty sure the Firebox has much better D/A conversion than your onboard soundcard. Plus you'll have problems with trying to record on the Firebox while listening to already-recorded tracks throug the onboard (their clocks aren't sync'd up)

Go into your BIOS and disable your onboard sound, and plug your speakers into a line out on your Firebox. You should have no problems routing all sounds (including the Windows sounds) to the Firebox.



I tried telling him this long ago... he refuses to disable the thing... I continued troubleshooting with him even though I think it is a multiple soundcard problem.
 
Xpred said:
My onboard sound card is what I plug my main speakers into because they're my computer soundcards. So if I disable my onboard sound card, I wouldn't be able to play anything back.

The whole point of shelling out 2 or 3 c notes on a nice unit like the firebox is so you can ditch that filthy onboard piece of crap. Trust me, you will be able to hear playback through the firebox
 
Alright Bulls, I did it.

I went and disabled my onboard sound card. I then bought a 1/8" to 1/4" adapter so I could plug my 2.1 speakers (it has a 1/8" aka 3.5mm jack) into the Main 1/2 OUT of my preamp. Two problems come up.

One is the actual main problem. Again, with this, there was no difference in volume input. Still very low. The other problem is that since I only plugged into my speakers, it was just mono and only on the LEFT side (I plugged into 1.L, there was also 2.R). My speakers are just one cable too, I dunno how I would be able to make it on both speakers with stereo again.

But anyways, yeah... I ruled out my onboard soundcard with that solution now. Any others? :confused:
 
Just for poos and giggles...

As long as you have the onboard shut down, pop a CD into the tray and see what sound you get out of the Firebox across the Firewire connection...

Might plug the speakers into the headphone out for the time being... In order to get the 2 - 1/4 male into 1 - 1/4 stereo female you may have to get the required plugs and a soldering iron and make what you need. Then again there might be an adapter out there already.

--
Rob
 
Yeah you need a 1/8" stereo to 2 x 1/4" mono cable. I have a 1/8" to 2 x rca cable, so you should be able to pick up something from radio shack. Or just use the headphone out like Crash says in the meantime.

So when you plug in your mic, and wind up the preamp, can you hear it out of the speakers/headphone? Can you get the red light to clip?

Also in your s/w, Adobe or whatever, you have selected the Firebox Left 1/2 as your input device, right?
 
Bulls Hit said:
Yeah you need a 1/8" stereo to 2 x 1/4" mono cable. I have a 1/8" to 2 x rca cable, so you should be able to pick up something from radio shack. Or just use the headphone out like Crash says in the meantime.

So when you plug in your mic, and wind up the preamp, can you hear it out of the speakers/headphone? Can you get the red light to clip?

Also in your s/w, Adobe or whatever, you have selected the Firebox Left 1/2 as your input device, right?

Yes I can hear everything fine, but no clipping on the red light. The software is already set to Firebox 1/2.
 
okey guys i think i got some answer...but not sure wtf is going on....

i just got the firePOD..and this is what i discovered....

firePOD has 8 inputs...first 2 are awsome .... real sound...fantastic GAIN ... exactly what u wannn...but from 3-8 sounds comming extreamly low...even tho putting everything FULL VOLUM / gain or what ever u can say...

and this is what i discovered...the first 2 input is known as INSTRUMENT INPUT, so its for guitar and bass..and rest 3-8 is LINE input..

so there is 2 type of input INSTRUMENT (which is AWSOME) and
LINE input whiich sucks bigtime...fucking annoying shit....
:( soz 4 my language duddes...but im also frustated now...this is what i posted in another forum.

and this is from the FIREPOD FAQ site:
Q: Why is the ¼” input on preamps 3-8 lower than the ¼” input on preamps 1 and 2?A: On the front panel of the Firepod you will find 2 instrument inputs (channels 1 and 2) and 6 line inputs (channels 3-8). The line inputs for channels 1 and 2 are on the back of the Firepod. The following info describes the difference between instrument and line inputs:



INSTRUMENT INPUTS (only Channels 1 and 2): The ¼” TS connector on channels 1 and 2 are for use with an instrument (guitar, bass, etc). When an instrument is plugged into the instrument input, the microphone preamplifier is bypassed and the FirePod becomes an active instrument preamplifier.



LINE INPUTS: These ¼” TS connectors are for use with sources that are in some way preamplified, so there is less gain with these inputs than with instrument inputs. The following devices would use line inputs: drum machines, CD players, outboard mixers/consoles, most keyboards, etc.


+========================================================+
hi there...2 u all...i really need some advice from u all....pls help me out.

me and my friend had spent loads of money to make a home studio for our DEATH metal band..and we kinda got everything now.

here how we r facing trouble.

we got a MAC and CUEBASE SE3 Full version (purchased).
and i have a massive KIT...below is the pic
IMG_0004.jpg


we bought the firepod, thinking that 8 mic in put simultaniously will help us to record my drumming, so i bought 8 mics aswell.
1 for BASS
1 for Snare + Hi hat
2 Overhead
3 Toms
1 Ride + X-Hihat (its not in da pic cause i purchased the X hihat after i took the pic)...lol

now thats 8 mics for capturing the Drum sound.

as some of u may have kno that out of 8 inputs in FIREPOD 2 are instrument input so the sound comes loud...and very nice

but from 3-8 are line inputs...and its very low sound...but i was wondering if we can get sound like instrument input in all inputs..:(

we failed to solve this issue...so PLEASE HELP ME>>>

tell me what i can do to boost up the 3-8 this 6 inputs gain....???????

i will be really appriciate if u all help me out in this...

tell me any tips i can use or another device to boost it up...anything...

ill b anxiously waiting for ur replyies...

CHEERS!!!:)
+========================================================+
 
xtron said:
okey guys i think i got some answer...but not sure wtf is going on....

i just got the firePOD..and this is what i discovered....

firePOD has 8 inputs...first 2 are awsome .... real sound...fantastic GAIN ... exactly what u wannn...but from 3-8 sounds comming extreamly low...even tho putting everything FULL VOLUM / gain or what ever u can say...

and this is what i discovered...the first 2 input is known as INSTRUMENT INPUT, so its for guitar and bass..and rest 3-8 is LINE input..

so there is 2 type of input INSTRUMENT (which is AWSOME) and
LINE input whiich sucks bigtime...fucking annoying shit....
:( soz 4 my language duddes...but im also frustated now...this is what i posted in another forum.

and this is from the FIREPOD FAQ site:
Q: Why is the ¼” input on preamps 3-8 lower than the ¼” input on preamps 1 and 2?A: On the front panel of the Firepod you will find 2 instrument inputs (channels 1 and 2) and 6 line inputs (channels 3-8). The line inputs for channels 1 and 2 are on the back of the Firepod. The following info describes the difference between instrument and line inputs:



INSTRUMENT INPUTS (only Channels 1 and 2): The ¼” TS connector on channels 1 and 2 are for use with an instrument (guitar, bass, etc). When an instrument is plugged into the instrument input, the microphone preamplifier is bypassed and the FirePod becomes an active instrument preamplifier.



LINE INPUTS: These ¼” TS connectors are for use with sources that are in some way preamplified, so there is less gain with these inputs than with instrument inputs. The following devices would use line inputs: drum machines, CD players, outboard mixers/consoles, most keyboards, etc.


+========================================================+
hi there...2 u all...i really need some advice from u all....pls help me out.

me and my friend had spent loads of money to make a home studio for our DEATH metal band..and we kinda got everything now.

here how we r facing trouble.

we got a MAC and CUEBASE SE3 Full version (purchased).
and i have a massive KIT...below is the pic
IMG_0004.jpg


we bought the firepod, thinking that 8 mic in put simultaniously will help us to record my drumming, so i bought 8 mics aswell.
1 for BASS
1 for Snare + Hi hat
2 Overhead
3 Toms
1 Ride + X-Hihat (its not in da pic cause i purchased the X hihat after i took the pic)...lol

now thats 8 mics for capturing the Drum sound.

as some of u may have kno that out of 8 inputs in FIREPOD 2 are instrument input so the sound comes loud...and very nice

but from 3-8 are line inputs...and its very low sound...but i was wondering if we can get sound like instrument input in all inputs..:(

we failed to solve this issue...so PLEASE HELP ME>>>

tell me what i can do to boost up the 3-8 this 6 inputs gain....???????

i will be really appriciate if u all help me out in this...

tell me any tips i can use or another device to boost it up...anything...

ill b anxiously waiting for ur replyies...

CHEERS!!!:)
+========================================================+

Indeed... but my main question is regarding mic inputs 1/2.
 
xtron said:
we bought the firepod, thinking that 8 mic in put simultaniously will help us to record my drumming, so i bought 8 mics aswell.
1 for BASS
1 for Snare + Hi hat
2 Overhead
3 Toms
1 Ride + X-Hihat (its not in da pic cause i purchased the X hihat after i took the pic)...lol

now thats 8 mics for capturing the Drum sound.

as some of u may have kno that out of 8 inputs in FIREPOD 2 are instrument input so the sound comes loud...and very nice

but from 3-8 are line inputs...and its very low sound...but i was wondering if we can get sound like instrument input in all inputs..:(

we failed to solve this issue...so PLEASE HELP ME>>>

tell me what i can do to boost up the 3-8 this 6 inputs gain....???????

So you're plugging the XLR connections into the firepod? And you've turned on phantom power?
 
Man... too bad this problem sounds more complicated than nasa technology at this point (after reading the whole thread).... You wouldn't happen to live nearby (lol)? Sounds impossible to cure over a forum to me.... And honestly, there is most certainly a simple explaination for your volume problem... I would bet money...
 
1st PC:

P4 2.2 GHz w/ Intel 845E chipset, Gigabyte 81EXP mobo, Windows XP Pro w/ SP2, GF4 Ti4600, 1GB PC2100 DDR RAM, 80GB + 200GB HD, Onboard sound card: Creative SoundBlaster PCI128, Both an onboard FireWire card and another PCI firewire card (Both are VIA OHCI Compliant chipsets)

2nd PC:

AXP 2100+ w/ VIA KT400 chipset, Gigabyte GA-7VAXP mobo, Windows XP Home w/ SP2, GF4 Ti4200, 512MB PC2700 DDR RAM, 60GB + 200GB HD, Onboard sound card: Realtek AC'97, Both an onboard FireWire card and another PCI firewire card (Both are VIA OHCI Compliant chipsets)

Now... one step at a time... Tell me the brand name and model of each PCI FIREWIRE card (there's one in each PC, correct?).....

Next... Tell me which are you connecting to (I forget if you said this already), the onboard FIREWIRE connection, the PCI FIREWIRE card, or have you tried both on both PCs?

Also... Since I am unfamiliar with you particular interface.. Is it bus powered (aka no power cord to the wall)? Or is there a wall wart for you to connect?

And you might read this thread just for giggles....

Lemme know bro... :rolleyes:
 
xtron said:
okey guys i think i got some answer...but not sure wtf is going on....

The answer you, xtron, seem to be looking for is 6 channels of microphone preamp....

Something like this maybe...
 
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