Tonelab or mic an 8" spkr?

[guttapercha]

Hey all,

I've been using a valvetronix ad15vt with the 8" speaker for recording (mic'd with a 57) and while I'm very pleased with the clean and mild-grit sounds, harder sounds come across very nasally. I'm hypothesizing that this is primarily due to the 8" speaker. Specifically, I am trying to get an 18W Marshall sound ala AC/DC for a particular song. Obviously there is the mic variable too....

Anyway, I'm looking at the Tonelab - there are plenty of them going cheaply on ebay, and it would certainly eliminate the mic variable.

Does anyone have experience with this thing or alternatively, micing tiny speakers. I have listened to all of the mp3s on the vox site, but they are not representative of what I'm going for, nor is it likely that they are realistic portrails of what this thing does in the real world (ie they're an advertisement).

Thanks/rock on

JD

 

[antichef]

I've got the AD15VT and haven't been able to do much with the stock speaker. I've replaced it with several other 8" speakers, and just about all of them sound better -- my favorite is a Weber Alnico Signature 8. If you change the speaker, be sure to use an 8 ohm replacement (or actually, just make sure it's the same rating as the original -- I think it's 8) - I have no idea what would happen if the impedance was mismatched, but I wouldn't want to find out. I also took the back plate off the amp to reduce the bass boominess. Generally, I don't think there's much problem recording an 8" speaker, provided it sounds good. I got a good track on one using a Shure SM 81 small diaphram condenser.

I also have the Tonelab SE -- my son and I each got half of it for each other for Xmas, and I haven't had the chance to record with it yet, so no help for you there. We've plugged it straight into a monitor (KRK Rokit 5), and found the result to be good, so that bodes well, I suppose. I can say that it does provide a *lot* of functionality over the AD15VT.

One other thing I've done with both units is to replace the stock 12AX7 tube with a 12AT7. In both cases, doing so reduced noise and produced a sound that seemed less synthetic to me. *It also probably voided the warranties.* On the AD15VT, I've tried a whole bunch of different 12AX7 tubes, including a couple of nice NOS units, but the 12AT7 takes the cake for some reason. I hesitate to make a claim like this without being ready to back it up with some sensible reasoning, but in this case I just have to say it sounds better for some reason. (BTW, I tried the 12AT7 approach to my "toob" microphone preamp, but there was no improvement).

 

[Double]

I had a ToneLab SE for about a year but gave up on it. When I auditioned the ToneLab I also had access to the POD XT (I think that is what it was, it was the newest version anyway) and the Behringer rack job. The ToneLab beat them all. After a year of using the ToneLab I still found that micing a small tube amp (In my case a Fender Princeton Reverb) was the best. If you can, use a small tube amp and mike it with a Shure SM57 (Closed Miked) and a Condenser (about 2 to 3 feet from the speaker) you will never go back to a modeling system.

 

[guttapercha]

Hmm. It's tempting to try and get the AD15vt to sound better from what I'm reading here from you guys. It's a great little amp for the money, but like everything else, it has its shortcomings. Maybe I'll hack into it a bit and add that other mic in the room.

 

[NRS]

I had similar findings with an AD50VT combo I borrowed for a while: Great cleans and decent mild overdrives but anything beyond that just got muddy and seemed to lack the tight focused definition I was after.

As for the Tonelab, I think the it sounds much better than most modellers direct but still prefer to run mine into an amp and mic it. In fact, some of the best tones I've gotten from my TL so far was when running it into a small Dean Markly 40watt bass practice amp that had an 8 inch vintage bass speaker. I easily got excellent ACDC and EVH overdrive out of it but what I had to work with that an ADVT combo didnt was the TL's pedal drive section and cab simulators plus the 4band bass amp EQ to put the exact curve I wanted on the 8" speaker. These little extras made all the difference.

That being said, I think possible speaker replacement was good advice and a PA or bass speaker may even work better than a guitar one in a speaker of that size to extend your low end and give your little combo a much bigger amp sound. Just make sure the speakers high end frequency specs roll off in the proper 4-6khz range to be suitable for guitar. You may also want to snoop around some VOX forums and see what people are using as replacements.

First step though, I would try a few different distortion pedals with it or even distortion and EQ together as an alternative to channel switching. You can at least do that for free at your local music store and try dozens of pedals where as speaker replacement can become costly trial and error process if your not sure exactly what your amp needs.

 

[guttapercha]

First step though, I would try a few different distortion pedals with it or even distortion and EQ together as an alternative to channel switching. You can at least do that for free at your local music store and try dozens of pedals where as speaker replacement can become costly trial and error process if your not sure exactly what your amp needs.

That's for sure. The price on that speaker is $35 plus shipping - 1/4 the price of the AD15 combo. I have an old Boss BE5 lying around (cheap multieffector from the early 90s) that had a decent "Overdrive/Distortion". I suppose I can mess with that a bit before shelling out more dough. I'd would love a boutiquey 18W, but I have to be realistic financially.