G
gibsonguy09
New member
Track Rat said:
Kurt cobain!!!
Today 5th April..............11 years ago.......Kurt Cobain "left" the planet........
Kurt cobain!!!
T
the edzell
New member
Well I have mixed feelings about Kurt Cobains contribution to music.
On one hand I was (and still am) a fan of some of the better hair metal bands but I don't think Kurt killed them off. The music sceen had been overrun with Van Halen / GnR / Pop Metal bands and while the some of the better ones survived most self destructed with member defections or putting out sub-par crap.
The world was waiting for something new and Nirvana was as the old saying goes luck is because preparation met opportunity. They were at the right place at the right time. But Hair Metal was on it's way out. If not them then someone else would have come around. (Jane's or RHCP maybe)
Now what I do like things changed around to focus more on songwriting and feel then on how many notes you could play. I couldn't get into a lot of bands because I couldn't (and wouldn't) play 132 notes consistantly. It was Ok not to write songs about sluts or even (gulp) not write a powerballad in D or G.
How much of this we can directly thank to Kurt and his influence is unknown. I just remember the first time I heard Nevermind. I knew I wouldn't be in the Nirvana generation but he had a few good hooks and a guitar tone that cut through the clutter of the over processed stuff that was on the radio.
IMO: it wasn't great, it wasn't bad, but it sure was different.
The big question is what would happen if he didn't die? Would he still be putting out new music or would he be playing some club with 20 - 30 year old fans milking teen spirit?
On one hand I was (and still am) a fan of some of the better hair metal bands but I don't think Kurt killed them off. The music sceen had been overrun with Van Halen / GnR / Pop Metal bands and while the some of the better ones survived most self destructed with member defections or putting out sub-par crap.
The world was waiting for something new and Nirvana was as the old saying goes luck is because preparation met opportunity. They were at the right place at the right time. But Hair Metal was on it's way out. If not them then someone else would have come around. (Jane's or RHCP maybe)
Now what I do like things changed around to focus more on songwriting and feel then on how many notes you could play. I couldn't get into a lot of bands because I couldn't (and wouldn't) play 132 notes consistantly. It was Ok not to write songs about sluts or even (gulp) not write a powerballad in D or G.
How much of this we can directly thank to Kurt and his influence is unknown. I just remember the first time I heard Nevermind. I knew I wouldn't be in the Nirvana generation but he had a few good hooks and a guitar tone that cut through the clutter of the over processed stuff that was on the radio.
IMO: it wasn't great, it wasn't bad, but it sure was different.
The big question is what would happen if he didn't die? Would he still be putting out new music or would he be playing some club with 20 - 30 year old fans milking teen spirit?
timmerman
-------------------------
Thank You ALL of YOU..............
Hello there and a big thumbs up to anyone of you for responding to this thread.
One of the reasons I opened this one yesterday was an announcement I heard on the radio, while I had my breakfast.
Another reason is that around June last year I open up a thread in the guitarforum about the "suicide" of Kurt, I closed that one because it was going funny [but I was new to the whole idea of forums so..............]
Yesterday I just wanted to see what I wrote: "Do we still listen to Nirvana, have thoughts about the music ect.
So partly I am surprised to see that Nirvana is still "alive" but then I am not and here is the reason:
My guess is that most people who responded so far are in the agegroup 18-40. Well so what Eddie? Kurt died in 1994, he was 27 at the time, anyone who is now around 18 was about 7 or 8 at that time, at an age where you are easily impressed. Did Nirvana impress young people? Yes they did, as Nirvana was probably the band who impressed the parents of the children I am talking about.
Children.................what do you mean Eddie? Well I teach guitar and I see a lot of the younger children being into Nirvana, just as their parents, but then their parents are also into the Ramones ect. But I think a lot of kids will go from liking Nirvana to the Ramones and other Punk or Rock acts. It is just a natural progression eh?
So the younger ones did get Nirvana from their parents, the ones who are now in their late 20s and 30s and up "grew" up with Nirvana, so obviously Nirvana spoke more to them as they came from a "similar background" timewise.
I myself am 38, same age as Kurt, and I did not get it when Nirvana hit the big time. At the time I was living in a shared house with people who were same age as me or just a little younger. The younger ones all like Nirvana [yes there was nothing close to them which sounded similar or tried to to same thing-----------------G 'n' R are not the same eh? they are conservative retro Rock act. Nothing wrong with that, but Guns did not speak to a generation about livestyles or...............like Nirvana did. Guns did open up Radio for harder Guitarbands to play loud again. Please let us not get to far into the comparison Guns/ Nirvana, because we cannot, they were both doing something different at the time]
Now I was 29 when I started listening to Nirvana, and did I like it................okay I listen to anything and appreaciate anything for its own value, because this is what you need to do as a musician, but Nirvana....................
I thought,:"Why did I not like this earlier?" If fact, I borrowed the two studio albums of one of my pupils, and she really liked them, I could see why-----the rebelious attitude, the sounds, the whole idea what it was about.
So I listened, but I thought again: "Kurt boy, why are you sooo sad, so messed up, so confused...................." I did not get that, you see, him being same age as me, there must have been so many opportunities for him for things to do and...........................yes the break up of his parents, it is a modern disease: I do not know anyone who has not parents who are not divorced, so yes there is something there, but still.....................
As Rokket said [he is 38 as well!!] the drugs did a lot, it influenced his state of mind and..............................
Really for anyone trying to understand Kobain [can we really ??] you could read his diaries and you will learn a LOT! The guy was obsessed with "making it" and also he was in LOVE with music..................it has been said before by some of you, if he would have lived longer we would have seen very different things from him, I even read a comparisson to Badly Drawn Boy, and yes I can see that....................again he is in his thirties and...............must be a generation X thing. But Bady has very different take on things.
Anyway, think we can all agree that Nirvana did a big shake up to the industry. Now in a way, that says more about the state of the industry than the quality of Nirvana. I also feel that generations after Nirvana [or Kurt] do not have that "rebellious" thing in them. The very fact that children grow up, and love the same music as their parents has something to do with that. My parents disliked anything Pop or Rock, they come from the 1940s 50s background [although they should have been into Elvis, but they just missed that!] whenever I listened to some music they asked me to turn it down, I also noticed that my friends had similar things with their parents...............of course, there is more going on eh? Background and...............a lot of other things, but again, I think the generation born in the mid to late 60 grew up with different norm and values: "Have to fight to whatever it is you want" ect. ect.
Have to be careful now, as it will get to long and too much into social and cultural issues, also a lot of younger people may feel I am getting against them because I feel they lack a certain kind of attitude. Well this is not the case, what is the case is that the tech. is responsible for changes in our attitudes and the choises we make, and since music is part of our lives, this all has an impact.
So once again Thanks so far, no I do not mean this is it, but I felt just writing a sort of round up so far, a summary if you like [playing teacher again ..............................
]
Eddie
Hello there and a big thumbs up to anyone of you for responding to this thread.
One of the reasons I opened this one yesterday was an announcement I heard on the radio, while I had my breakfast.
Another reason is that around June last year I open up a thread in the guitarforum about the "suicide" of Kurt, I closed that one because it was going funny [but I was new to the whole idea of forums so..............]
Yesterday I just wanted to see what I wrote: "Do we still listen to Nirvana, have thoughts about the music ect.
So partly I am surprised to see that Nirvana is still "alive" but then I am not and here is the reason:
My guess is that most people who responded so far are in the agegroup 18-40. Well so what Eddie? Kurt died in 1994, he was 27 at the time, anyone who is now around 18 was about 7 or 8 at that time, at an age where you are easily impressed. Did Nirvana impress young people? Yes they did, as Nirvana was probably the band who impressed the parents of the children I am talking about.
Children.................what do you mean Eddie? Well I teach guitar and I see a lot of the younger children being into Nirvana, just as their parents, but then their parents are also into the Ramones ect. But I think a lot of kids will go from liking Nirvana to the Ramones and other Punk or Rock acts. It is just a natural progression eh?
So the younger ones did get Nirvana from their parents, the ones who are now in their late 20s and 30s and up "grew" up with Nirvana, so obviously Nirvana spoke more to them as they came from a "similar background" timewise.
I myself am 38, same age as Kurt, and I did not get it when Nirvana hit the big time. At the time I was living in a shared house with people who were same age as me or just a little younger. The younger ones all like Nirvana [yes there was nothing close to them which sounded similar or tried to to same thing-----------------G 'n' R are not the same eh? they are conservative retro Rock act. Nothing wrong with that, but Guns did not speak to a generation about livestyles or...............like Nirvana did. Guns did open up Radio for harder Guitarbands to play loud again. Please let us not get to far into the comparison Guns/ Nirvana, because we cannot, they were both doing something different at the time]
Now I was 29 when I started listening to Nirvana, and did I like it................okay I listen to anything and appreaciate anything for its own value, because this is what you need to do as a musician, but Nirvana....................
I thought,:"Why did I not like this earlier?" If fact, I borrowed the two studio albums of one of my pupils, and she really liked them, I could see why-----the rebelious attitude, the sounds, the whole idea what it was about.
So I listened, but I thought again: "Kurt boy, why are you sooo sad, so messed up, so confused...................." I did not get that, you see, him being same age as me, there must have been so many opportunities for him for things to do and...........................yes the break up of his parents, it is a modern disease: I do not know anyone who has not parents who are not divorced, so yes there is something there, but still.....................
As Rokket said [he is 38 as well!!] the drugs did a lot, it influenced his state of mind and..............................
Really for anyone trying to understand Kobain [can we really ??] you could read his diaries and you will learn a LOT! The guy was obsessed with "making it" and also he was in LOVE with music..................it has been said before by some of you, if he would have lived longer we would have seen very different things from him, I even read a comparisson to Badly Drawn Boy, and yes I can see that....................again he is in his thirties and...............must be a generation X thing. But Bady has very different take on things.
Anyway, think we can all agree that Nirvana did a big shake up to the industry. Now in a way, that says more about the state of the industry than the quality of Nirvana. I also feel that generations after Nirvana [or Kurt] do not have that "rebellious" thing in them. The very fact that children grow up, and love the same music as their parents has something to do with that. My parents disliked anything Pop or Rock, they come from the 1940s 50s background [although they should have been into Elvis, but they just missed that!] whenever I listened to some music they asked me to turn it down, I also noticed that my friends had similar things with their parents...............of course, there is more going on eh? Background and...............a lot of other things, but again, I think the generation born in the mid to late 60 grew up with different norm and values: "Have to fight to whatever it is you want" ect. ect.
Have to be careful now, as it will get to long and too much into social and cultural issues, also a lot of younger people may feel I am getting against them because I feel they lack a certain kind of attitude. Well this is not the case, what is the case is that the tech. is responsible for changes in our attitudes and the choises we make, and since music is part of our lives, this all has an impact.
So once again Thanks so far, no I do not mean this is it, but I felt just writing a sort of round up so far, a summary if you like [playing teacher again ..............................
]Eddie
gvarko
New member
More BS...
It's one thing to play a song, what Kurt did was convey a song. He did this through emotion, pain, angst, heroin haze whatever you want to call it, when you hear Kurt play and sing it is pure emotion.
What some people consider a "musician" let's say someone like Satriani or Via, to me are completely sterile of emotion. Technically they blow me away, but emotionally I feel nothing.
Kurt can play 3 chords and sing 2 verses and you feel it through your entire being. Perhaps I am getting to deep. But I am a huge Nirvana fan and have every CD & DVD they have made, including bootlegs. You must see them live to truly appreciate them..
That said, IMO the new box set was dissapointing at best.
Rokket said:
It's one thing to play a song, what Kurt did was convey a song. He did this through emotion, pain, angst, heroin haze whatever you want to call it, when you hear Kurt play and sing it is pure emotion.
What some people consider a "musician" let's say someone like Satriani or Via, to me are completely sterile of emotion. Technically they blow me away, but emotionally I feel nothing.
Kurt can play 3 chords and sing 2 verses and you feel it through your entire being. Perhaps I am getting to deep. But I am a huge Nirvana fan and have every CD & DVD they have made, including bootlegs. You must see them live to truly appreciate them..
That said, IMO the new box set was dissapointing at best.
scottboyher
New member
gvarko said:
I agree with this!
gvarko
New member
Thank you...
I thought it was just me...
scottboyher said:
I thought it was just me...
D
dirtythermos
New member
donkeystyle said:
This is true, but their first album was Bleach. Nevermind - the first major label album - cost over $100K. I don't remember the exact number, but I want to say it was close to $200K.
tourettes5139
New member
gvarko said:
Me too!!
I personally love Nirvana, and the emotional impact was always the main message that came across in their music, not the playing or the performance. When you listen to one of Cobain's songs, you almost seem to forget about the music itself, and just feel the raw emotion of it all.
Rokket
Trailing Behind Again
gvarko said:
I agree, it does sound sterile. I don't understand or like any of Vai's solo work. Satriani was formulaic, and his style has been copied countless times. I've even heard home recorders posting Satriani influenced songs in the mp3 clinic.
To answer the question about learning all of his songs in one hour, I will admit, we didn't play them all the way through. We just figured out the verse, chorus, etc. and moved on to the next song. We discovered a pattern in his chord choices after going through Nevermind, and it made the rest easy.
Does that really make him a bad musician? No, not really. I can admit that. Someone mentioned Dylan, who I really never liked either, and his music was the same.
Does that really make him a bad musician? No, not really. I can admit that. Someone mentioned Dylan, who I really never liked either, and his music was the same.
I concede that he had a love for music and it came through in his performances. I think Nirvana on MTV unplugged was probably one of, if not the best, performances on that show (Eric Clapton is number one for me). Nirvana came out when I was still into heavy metal (Judas Priest era) and I wasn't impressed, I'm sorry. But that doesn't diminish his impact on music. And I may be the only one who didn't like them when they were hot, I don't know.
If I have offended anyone, I am sorry. My views probably didn't belong on this thread, and it's too late to delete my posts. If you love and respect Kurt and his music, then accept my apologies for being narrow minded and cynical.
timmerman
-------------------------
Learning the Songs.........Not Being Impressed and Comparisons to...............
Aaagh, well I did not get it too when why were hot...........................
Also learned the songs very quickly [Had to because of teaching, but I did enjoy learning them ] and I was impressed how simple but effective they were. Lots of powerchordriffs, but still................they have their place
In 1993 I can remember reading an interview about Pat Metheney and he said that he did not get the "Nirvana Hype"..............his words were something like: "Every ten years or so a similar band comes along and does the same thing, Nirvana to my ears are not that different from the early Yardbirds and some of the garagerock of the sixties" .......................
Well do we believe Pat made a point there? I think he did, but I have to say, Nirvana's influence will stay, but part of it is the mediahype and youthculture and young people having a need for a rolemodel.
I enjoy how some people go from the Nirvana discussion into people like Vai and Satch...............well you may know that I dig these players, but I also happen to like Kurt. I really believe that you cannot compare any of these people as they all try different things, even Vai and Satch are different, Satch is much more a "songguy" and his sounds and phrases still develop.................
Okay I know it is all about taste and probably patience and willingness to try to understand what a certain artist or band is trying to do. For some of us it may be as simple as: "if it does not touch my soul I will not investigate it.........." well that is fair enough eh? Others though will try to get what is going on, just for sake of understanding and personal growth.
Far to deep that last phrase but allas that is the nature of the beast 
Eddie
Rokket said:
Aaagh, well I did not get it too when why were hot...........................
Also learned the songs very quickly [Had to because of teaching, but I did enjoy learning them
] and I was impressed how simple but effective they were. Lots of powerchordriffs, but still................they have their placeIn 1993 I can remember reading an interview about Pat Metheney and he said that he did not get the "Nirvana Hype"..............his words were something like: "Every ten years or so a similar band comes along and does the same thing, Nirvana to my ears are not that different from the early Yardbirds and some of the garagerock of the sixties" .......................
Well do we believe Pat made a point there? I think he did, but I have to say, Nirvana's influence will stay, but part of it is the mediahype and youthculture and young people having a need for a rolemodel.
I enjoy how some people go from the Nirvana discussion into people like Vai and Satch...............well you may know that I dig these players, but I also happen to like Kurt. I really believe that you cannot compare any of these people as they all try different things, even Vai and Satch are different, Satch is much more a "songguy" and his sounds and phrases still develop.................
Okay I know it is all about taste and probably patience and willingness to try to understand what a certain artist or band is trying to do. For some of us it may be as simple as: "if it does not touch my soul I will not investigate it.........." well that is fair enough eh? Others though will try to get what is going on, just for sake of understanding and personal growth.
Far to deep that last phrase but allas
that is the nature of the beast Eddie
gvarko
New member
Missing the point...
I brought up Satch and Vai only because when the topic turns to technical prowise on the guitar most people consider them god.
I think the comparison is perfect because when was the last time you heard anything from Satch or Vai on the radio? Hell, I couldn't even name one song other than Satch Boogie between the 2 of them.
Nirvana songs are still in regular rotation on most radio stations. There must be a good reason for that.
Also, I don't think anyone really considers Kurt much of a role model considering the way his life ended up.
BTW - I was not at all into Nirvana when they were at their peak. I was more into Metallica and metal stuff. It's only now, years later that I have started to truly appreciate their work. My one regret was not seeing them live when he was still alive.
timmerman said:
I brought up Satch and Vai only because when the topic turns to technical prowise on the guitar most people consider them god.
I think the comparison is perfect because when was the last time you heard anything from Satch or Vai on the radio? Hell, I couldn't even name one song other than Satch Boogie between the 2 of them.
Nirvana songs are still in regular rotation on most radio stations. There must be a good reason for that.
Also, I don't think anyone really considers Kurt much of a role model considering the way his life ended up.
BTW - I was not at all into Nirvana when they were at their peak. I was more into Metallica and metal stuff. It's only now, years later that I have started to truly appreciate their work. My one regret was not seeing them live when he was still alive.
S
Sanjanjoseph
New member
scottboyher said:
i do but i dont. kurt and the rest of the band were amazing. but if you got a collection of all their songs and played them all in a row things would sorta come together. but theres no doubt that they were amazing. my faveorite nirvana song is about a girl.....
whats every one else's faveorite? hmmm?
¤
-=¤willhaven¤=-
New member
Kurt Cobain. Great songwriter... total idiot.
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