The wonderful FD8

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JustinPlaysBass

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Hello everyone,

I'm in a band trying to record a demo with the FD8. Alot of you guys on here are really happy with yours. I think we could be happy with ours, but I don't know. You see, the drummer owned one because someone baught it for him years ago and he didn't know how to use it.

Okay, to the point. Here's what I think I've learned so far:

- You can only record 2 tracks at a time, unless you use an ADAT(which I know nothing about and don't care to spend money on).

- The pan controls actually have something to do with what track the sound winds up on. You have to turn it to L or R in conjunction with 1/L, 2/R, etc. That makes no sense at all to me, seems like a messed up way of doing things. But, that's cause I've only used a Tascam tape deck before so I'm probably an idiot with these things.

- I'm going to have to use a mixer for drums to get all my inputs. We have an old/not so great peavy PA mixer, and it gives us buzz when we hook it in to a jack. The buzz is not that bad on 7 or 8 with the little switch set to Hi.

Here's what I'd like to know how to do with the equipment we have or really cheap equipment to add on:

- Can I hook up all 8 inputs for the drums but record them all to like track 2/R for example? (we're really only using 4 drum mics, and we have a condeneser for cymbals so I probably need a good phantom power supply).

- Does the Normal or Mastering mode really matter? We need max disk space out of a 250 MB Zip disk. I'm assuming we're just going to hook the monitor out or stereo outs to my computer's line in and record it as a wav file using crappy ol' Music Match Jukebox.

- How can I get rid of that buzz from our Mixer?

Other questions will arrive, and I thank you all for your help. The more I get to play with it, the more progress we make.

I don't want to spend to much money, cause I'm planning on building a computer for personal use. I'll post that stuff on a computer forum sometime on this board.

As for now, you can all look at my bands Tascam recordings. I think we got decent quality on them for a tape deck. They're located at The Specifics music page. There are no drums except in the live recordings section due to us not having a drummer then. Anyway, if you're really interested you could find out anything on our site.

Thank you all for your help and patience to read this entire book I just wrote.

-Justin
 
I haven't used the FD-8, but I checked out the manual on the fostex website. You may want to do the same before you get into using it. Here is a link:

http://www.fostex.com/support/pdf/fostex/fd08/fd08_owners_manual.pdf

A PA mixer is intended for live performance, not for recording. You will have a very tough time getting it quiet. As far as buzzing goes, try to isolate the current that is going to it using a powerstrip with a surge protector (a cheap route).

A better way is to get yourself a good mixer meant for recording. Check out the Behringer mixers. You can get one for about $60 US. And the Yamaha MG series is pretty good, but will cost a bit more (the same one as the behringer will run about $80-90 US).

You want to record in normal mode. Mastering mode is for mixing down your tracks.


Hopefully an FD-8 owner will see this and give you further guidence. Sorry I wasn't much help...
 
Ah, that helped. I didn't really have a clue on the mixer/PA difference. I figure it's sending out some kind of signal that the inputs can't cope with. I'm using a line out on it though, so I was hoping that didn't send out any kind of power for speakers or what-not.

I've seen the manual, and it's really vague and bad just as I've read in these forums.

So, speaking of mixer's again...Do you know if there are any that I could use with an SIAB but would also offer interfaces for computer (USB2.0 or Firewire) for when I get a computer built? I guess you can set those kind of devices up to record track 1 from the mixer to track 1 on Sonar. That's for another board I know, I'm just trying to cover both at the same time if possible. I don't wanna waste money on one or another.

Oh, and do recording mixers come with Phantom Power for condenser mikes?

Thanks, you've been a good help to me already.
 
I'm almost sure that I can just use the mixing board on the FD8, then I just need a good phantom power supply or 2. If I'm right, then I can just select 2/R and put Pan = R and Monitor = Input and then all my mikes will record to track 2. I think That may be a good way around buying a mixer I won't use.
 
Okay,...

The 2-track simul-record/max limitation is one of the biggest limitations and downsides of the FD8. They should have made it more highly capable, because they could've. The DMT-8, it's predecessor, already recorded 4-simul.

The ZIP disc deal is sucky, at best. The best FD8 setup is to have the built in internal hard disc. I also have the FD4, that uses an external Syquest 230 HD cartridge drive, and it is just a hassle. It detracts from the "all-in-oneness" that a porta-format recorder should have.

The L/R-Even/Odd track assignment is pretty standard, even on Tascams, so it makes me wonder which Tascam you used? The MF-P01 or the Porta02? These Tascams are highly inadequate in features, like the bottom rung entry level recording device. All other Tascam Portastudios have that L/R-Even/Odd buss-track assignment scheme. Fostex was smart to stick with this for the FD8.

Hardly anyone's gonna get the FD8 and then pop further for an ADAT I/O capable mixer, but Fostex made a bunch of them, starting with the VM-200, up to the VM-800. Again, having to use an external mixer to get the FD8 above 2-simul-max recording limit sucks, outright. As above, it also takes away from the "all-in-oneness" that a porta-format recorder should have.

What else???

The Mastering 1 mode, I believe is what it's called, is fine. I believe that's "normal" mode, but don't use the "econo" mode, because sound quality suffers at the expense of maximizing disc space. I'd have to check the manual to verify the "master/normal" terms, exactly, but "normal" should be adequate. As long as the display says 16/44.1, you're okay.

I dunno what else, but despite it's limitations, the FD8's a pretty good unit, & blows away the likes of the MR8 & VF80. As I don't record live groups very often any more, the 2-record-simul limit is not a huge problem. YMMV.;)
 
I just used some crapy 4track tape deck. Like the porta02 or whatnot. I figured I'm just a tard with that.

Am I doing that right though? I set the Monitor section to input on the input/line knob, and I put pan to the corrisponding track like 1/L = Pan L. I can adjust the pan after I record, like during mastering/mixing?

Thanks. I'm not putting it down, but it is kind of limiting. To be honest, for free use or gift...it's pretty sweet. Thanks again.
 
The Monitor section is independent of the L/R assign buss during recording.

Mixdown after recording is another process altogether, where PAN is used.

Otherwise, you're getting the basic ideas. ;)

I would have liked to see the FD8 as a more capable unit, but it's not. It's pretty good, for what it is. :cool:
 
I'm gonna give a Berhinger a try. That'll be best I think. Then I'll get some phantom power and mic preamps. Thanks for your help. We made alot of progress on the FD8 last night.
 
hey bro im using the fd-8 also on a slim budget and ive figured out a few things
- you can plug 8 channels into the mixer and record it all down onto one track, it does it automatically. most people call this "bleeding" which is bad but ive learned to turn bad into good. i use three drum mics and run them into three inputs and have the bleeding mix it down to one track.
- i would recommend getting some sort of cheap mic pre amp like the audio buddy or something just for some extra oomph and phantom power.
- yes fostex is insane the panning thing is still confusing to me. i know that if you try to pan say 2/R to the left it just cuts out in the stereo mix. im trying to figure this out too.
- i use a jaz drive and that has a lot more space than a zip drive. i use mastering mode to record but id say for you to use the normal mode to make sure you can fit all the tracks on it. but depending on how many tracks you are doing, maybe you can get away with using mastering mode.

good luck! im happy other people are using the fd-8
 
Monitor Problems

Also on the FD8, whenever I'm recording I'm fine about adjusting the monitor volume of previously recorded tracks to play along to, but how do I adjust the volume of the track im recording coming through my headphones?!

The normal Input/Track knob doesnt make any difference. The headphones are obviously coming out of the headphone output so its not a case of me listening through the wrong output.
 
???

surfmaster said:
...- you can plug 8 channels into the mixer and record it all down onto one track,... most people call this "bleeding" which is ...
Click to expand...
That's a "feature" of the design, otherwise known as "bussing".


surfmaster said:
...- I use three drum mics and run them into three inputs and have the bleeding mix it down to one track.
Click to expand...
Eh,... that's all good, but it's called "buss/track assignment".


surfmaster said:
...- yes fostex is insane the panning thing is still confusing to me.
Click to expand...
Insane? I guess all the dozens & dozens of other mixers and porta's must be based on this "insane" approach, and all gear manufacturers must share this "mass insanity". Anything that's above the "tech" of the Porta 02 and MF-p01 will have this design. (Excluding the Tascam DP-01 & Fostex VF-Series). Be thankful you have that "insane" FD-8, because it's better. Trust me on that.

surfmaster said:
...- i know that if you try to pan say 2/R to the left it just cuts out in the stereo mix.
Click to expand...
That's normal. If you pan right, the sound goes to the right.


surfmaster said:
...- good luck! im happy other people are using the fd-8
Click to expand...
Yeah, me too. Good luck. ;)
 
tomraffe said:
Also on the FD8, whenever I'm recording I'm fine about adjusting the monitor volume of previously recorded tracks to play along to, but how do I adjust the volume of the track im recording coming through my headphones?!

The normal Input/Track knob doesnt make any difference. The headphones are obviously coming out of the headphone output so its not a case of me listening through the wrong output.
Click to expand...

Eh,... it's a relative difference.

To start, your input level should be set and optimized to drive the track with the correct level. Then, you vary the CUE track's volume to accommodate the "live" track/input. It's not that you turn the "live" track up in the monitors, but you turn the CUE tracks down.

;)
 
What do you call the cue track?

Also its the live track being too loud thats the problem rather than the previously recorded track (which is too quiet). Im recording drums so could do without them coming through my headphones at all. Presently, I cant hear what im playing along to over my drums.
 
tomraffe said:
What do you call the cue track?

Also its the live track being too loud thats the problem rather than the previously recorded track (which is too quiet). Im recording drums so could do without them coming through my headphones at all. Presently, I cant hear what im playing along to over my drums.
Click to expand...

The "Monitor" section is the "cue" section, or tracks in the "monitor" are "cue tracks".

Ok, fair enough. You have to boost the Monitor section as loud as it will go, and get some decent isolating headphones.
 
surfmaster said:
...i know that if you try to pan say 2/R to the left it just cuts out in the stereo mix. im trying to figure this out too.
Click to expand...

Maybe I misunderstood this sentence on first reading, but the answer's the same: You have to come to terms with Pan, L/R-Buss and Track-Assign function through panning. Your explanation and terminology is such that it's a confused statement that has no real answer.


surfmaster said:
...good luck! im happy other people are using the fd-8.
Click to expand...
Yes, and I'm happy too. The FD-8 is really a technically superior unit to many of the newest breed of 8-trackers out there,... once you get used to all the "insanity" behind the design. ;)
 
tomraffe said:
I have, on both accounts. Not to worry.
Click to expand...

Ok,... then maybe running the Monitor (external) feed through a reciever or stereo amplifier might give your phones a bigger boost of volume,... and that may help. Alternately, you could try to play softer, if that fits the mood. ;)

Playing/dubbing drum tracks & not being able to hear the monitor in the phones is a very common problem. Same thing for me, really, but you have to adjust and use any extra boost you can find,... (amp/reciever/headphone amp, etc). ;)
 
thank you for correcting me on everything reel person

ive only been recording for a few months now so its good to learn essential things like what you have said. thanks a lot.
 
The FD-8's really the bomb!

When recording drums, it's not necessary to feed the drum mix into the monitor or headphone mix. The drums usually carry acoustically, quite well enough.

Best of luck, & if you have any other questions, just ask! ;)
 
It's been a while

I'm happy to report that I'm making leaps in understanding the FD8. I've bought a Behringer mixer with phantom power. We're using good equipment now, well, for the price that is. Everything is going pretty well, I'm just having to deal with miking drums...which is a MONSTER! We've had some success with it, but when recording all other parts we've adjusted EQs here and there and all that. Just so everyone is proud of me, or maybe so others can learn too, here is what I've learned:

1) They all tell you to be patient, and they're right. Even though it sucks sometimes, it is always better to quit when you're getting frustrated. You'll do so much better later.

2) When miking drums, it's a good idea (as we're using a pretty small room), to run wires to mikes under the door and then adjust your levels on the mixer. That should be obvious right? :)

3) Try everything you can think of, even if it's stupid. You'll often stumble across neat things. Don't complain if it takes a little more work to set up too, it's totally worth it if it works.

FD8 things that may help you guys:

1) The pan thing isn't confusing at all. If you want it to record to track 2...put which ever input your using in the R position on the pan (any of them...1-8, the only thing that directs which track is going to be recorded is the little button). So, any of the L tracks...turn pan to the L position while recording, you can pan it later durring mixdown.

2) If you're recording a track while listening to other tracks, select the "mon" position on the about the master fader. Turn all monitoring tracks to the off position. Adjust the nobs accordingly for volume. If you want to hear yourself, you have to turn the nob to the input on the track your recording on, NOT track#. This will keep that track isolated during recording, otherwise you're going to be recording all the tracks onto that one track and it's going to sound absolutely terrible!

3) When mixing or just listening, use the stereo output (RC cables) and put master cue on the "L/R" position. You then use the faders for volume on each track, and the EQ actually does EQing! That was confusing to me, and I'm assuming that people often run into monitoring problems. All tracks should be cued to the "track#" position.

4) It's worth buying a mixer even though the FD8 has EQ nobs. The phantom power is useful for condenser mics...actually neccessary! It's so much better for recording drums.

5) Use 2 tracks from a mixer for drums. Use stereo miking. Trust me. Read some of the drum forums. I have one running there, and someone gave me a good miking technique there.

I doubt this was helpful because my rhetoric is not all that great. I'm just excited to be making progress, and we all like to share that with each other and help everyone.

I like the FD8 a lot more now.
 
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