The Truth Behind Hip-Hop

  • Thread starter Thread starter tone_aot
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Strip away the images of rap stars and just listen to the words. Forget about the beat. Is anything said on most rap these days helpful, insightful, positive, meaningful? No. All i'm saying is since we are makin music now, make your music meaningful in a good way.
 
tone_aot said:
Alright. So, why in the world would we make music that would influence somebody proned to that?
For the same reason we make horror flicks or documentaries about serial killers or real life police chases and stand offs....it's entertainment for most people...and encouragement for the criminally insane.

Unfortunately, most of those type of people aren't known about until they do something drastic...nothing we can do about that though.

And you can't blame that shit on Marilyn Manson, 2Pac or any other type of music or media. Blame it on the way an unsound mind processes that information....bad parenting plays a role too.
 
tone_aot said:
Strip away the images of rap stars and just listen to the words. Forget about the beat. Is anything said on most rap these days helpful, insightful, positive, meaningful? No. All i'm saying is since we are makin music now, make your music meaningful in a good way.

Again!!! I understand your intent.. And it is well placed.. but seriuosly..

Let's use an example..

If had no idea what cold water felt like.. How you know what "warm" REALLY is...

If a person only tries to express a "positive" thing in their music.. In my opinion, you are only getting 50% of everything music has to offer...

Dang.. Look at "The Blues", as a genre.. I suppose it's the devil too?
 
I can tell that everyone is kinda set in their ways and they don't believe anything i'm saying so i won't say anything else about this subject after this last post. All i gotta say is that since i've told you this you are responsible for it now. Some people might not have thought about how much power they have with their music. I can't make anyone choose how to live, but in the end people will wish they would have listened. Finished. Back to the beats!
 
stray411 said:
For the same reason we make horror flicks or documentaries about serial killers or real life police chases and stand offs....it's entertainment for most people...and encouragement for the criminally insane.

Unfortunately, most of those type of people aren't known about until they do something drastic...nothing we can do about that though.

And you can't blame that shit on Marilyn Manson, 2Pac or any other type of music or media. Blame it on the way an unsound mind processes that information....bad parenting plays a role too.


the best information in the thread..

well said Stray
 
peritus said:
If had no idea what cold water felt like.. How you know what "warm" REALLY is...
Great point P...that's the divine dichotomy...love/hate...good/bad....warm/cold...all couldn't exist without the opposite.

That's real powerful knowledge when you fully grasp it.
 
stray411 said:
Great point P...that's the divine dichotomy...love/hate...good/bad....warm/cold...all couldn't exist without the opposite.

That's real powerful knowledge when you fully grasp it.

Thanks.. now if I could only spell.. I'd be "better".. whatever "better" is... lol
 
tone_aot said:
I can tell that everyone is kinda set in their ways and they don't believe anything i'm saying so i won't say anything else about this subject after this last post. All i gotta say is that since i've told you this you are responsible for it now. Some people might not have thought about how much power they have with their music. I can't make anyone choose how to live, but in the end people will wish they would have listened. Finished. Back to the beats!

I'm finished preachin! Back to the beats
 
im out, Tone its nothing wrong with what you think on the matter..ever one has their opinion... i know you want to get the Holy Hip-Hop Movement started..it has been started and is a very slow process.. and yes they do have Gangsta Christian Artists that spread Gods work in Gangsta Lyrics..

talk to you all tomorrow..gotta go work on a few new beats..

be easy..peace
 
Make that fire gentlemen...

BTW, you got some serious heaters on your page man. Much respect...I don't think I've heard you're work before.

Yo BK we need to get up on the HR.com producer's page. What's up?
 
I'm down... I apologize for the rambling.. I'm dead tired and must sleep.. been up for way too long...

P.S. http://www.masonbetha.org/ hehe..

P.S.S. You gotta good head on your shoulders Tone.. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise... Life is a lesson.. class is in session.. and Perspective is EVERYTHING...

Okay.. I'm out..
 
I want to say this first and foremost, I respect your opinion, and your right to have that opinion. However, there are some things wrong with your arguments here.

"All heavy metal groups have satanic names and have bloody pictures on there albums and all that crazy stuff."

This isn't true at all! Sure, some groups have underlying satanic themes, and some have blatant satanic themes, but to say ALL heavy metal groups have this is just not well thought out.

You're arguments are filled to the brim with fallacies.

For one thing, your assertion that "As a result of gangsta rap, violence has taken over the streets with force." well this is a great example of the Post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy which basically says that if one event happens (the rise of gangsta rap), right before another event (the rise in violent crime) the first event must be the cause. It's an argument that isn't based in any sort of fact. Maybe the rise in crime caused the rise in gangsta rap.

You also state that if children listen to violent music they will be violent, which of course is also inherently wrong. You're using (to use a term coined by Stephen Colbert) truthiness, where you say something is true simply because you believe it to be true. There's no factual evidence to support this claim at all.



"The pastor said that if you really listen to the words of a lot of songs and really evaluate what's being said, you'll notice how satanic things are." You can find any message in anything if you look hard enough. How do you think the KKK finds their "facts" about anyone other than whites in the bible. They do what they do "for Jesus" (who quite obviously wasn't white), and was a Jew. I'm not trying to compare you to the KKK because obviously you're coming from a good place, trying to make things better, but like I said, you can find anything you want to in other things if that's what you're looking for.



While I respect your beliefs and faith, to say "This is not a myth or something false, God is real. The devils attacks on the world are real. Look for yourself." also isn't rooted in proven fact. The only place we can "look" for this is in the bible, or Christian literature which is obviously biased.


"If you held the cd up to a mirror and read it, you cursed your soul. 10 million copies of that cd were sold. Many lives destroyed" I'd like to see proof of these lives that were "destroyed" because they read the back of a cd in a mirror. Do you have specific examples of people who have said "Reading the back of the Bone Thugz cd in a mirror destroyed my life." I doubt it.


"It used to be unheard of a elementary school kid bringing a gun to school. Where did they get the idea from? Either a movie, TV show, or somebody saying "imma shoot dat &#*($&*#(&$*(@&#*(4738924789"!! " I'd like to see proven facts that the Columbine kids went in and shot all those kids because of music. There's no fact in this...at all.

"I got a cousin who lives and breaths gangsta rap and stays in trouble all the time because he wants to be like the people he see's on the videos." He's told you this? He's said "I get in trouble a lot because I want to be likt eht guys in the video?" Just wondering.

I listened to Snoop, and Dre and Cypress Hill when they came out...I was in 7th grade. I've never killed anyone. When I was a kid I was listening to The Beatles (happiness is a warm gun is a good example of a violent song), Johnny Cash ("I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die), Marilyn Manson (who has violence all over the place in his songs), old blues songs that talked about beating up their wife, and killin people, and meeting the devil at the crossroads. I've never hurt anyone in a violent way. I've never killed anyone, I've never shot anyone, stabbed anyone, nothing. How do you explain this? Your argument asserts that all kids who listen to violent music will become violent. Well....I listened to it, and I still do, and I'm not violent in the least.


"Alright. So, why in the world would we make music that would influence somebody proned to that?" Why do preachers preach hate speech to influence to hate people? I mean, the church does this all the time. Not every preacher does it (obviously), but there are a lot of them. Blow up abortion clinics, hate gays, etc etc etc, it's all there man. Don't even get me started on supposed "righteous" men and their molesting of children. In a supposed "peace minded" religion that says "love they neighbor", and no one can pass judgment but God, there isn't a lot of love for one's neighbor, and I see a whole lot of judgment passing. I'm not trying to bash your religion, or anyone's religion for that matter, I'm a big fan of people having beliefs and faith in something, but this happens. The retired pastor at my parents church said that he hates gays and thinks they should all be dead because "God hates gays." I'm not making this up. I've seen preachers advocating and defending abortion clinic bombers saying they're "doing god's work by punishing these sinners." Without examples of that one, I'm not presenting a very good argument I know, but I've heard it I just can't think of which show it was on. It was Larry King, or one of those types. Sorry, I don't have the backup for this particular tidbit.



I do want to say that your underlying message is great. Violence is bad, kids killing kids...or anyone killing anyone for that matter...is bad. I hear that. It's just the way you go about it that's not working. Your argument is filled with holes, and biases that can't fly in a logical argument trying to bring about change. You need revamp your argument with some proven facts and come back at us. I'm always open to having my mind changed about things, but the argument has to be sound, which (I'm sorry to say) your's aren't.


Keep up your message though, violence is not cool and I wholeheartedly agree with you there.



I know you said you aren't posting about this anymore, but I'd like to hear what you think about these points I've brought up. If you're so inclined.
 
Hey wakeupbomb, it's funny how you went through and analyzed almost every word i said. If people did that to everything you said, you would have alot faults pointed out about you. I never said my argument was perfect. I'm just starting to attempt to spread what i learned and i typed it in a hurry. I know you want to prove a point but i think it is ridiculous to go through and analyze every word someone says because people aren't perfect and all arguments are going to have holes. If i would have spent 10 days on it people would have found something wrong. Maybe i wasn't clear enough. I'll try to sum it up in a better way.

Violence has been around for a long time. True statement. The level of violence has boiled down over many years, but it seems like it is slowly rising again. There are lots of reasons for this, not JUST gangsta rap. When i say gangsta rap, i'm talkin about rappers that gloryify violence as something that is good and normal. This doesn't include every rapper that may be labeled gangsta. I'm trying my best to make sure i get this right this time:) As far as the black community goes, alot of things have contributed to how black youth are behaving now. Could be parenting problems, bad influences, desire for money, etc. Endless possibilities. What i'm trying to say is that when some rappers glorify violence as if it is okay, "some" people will take that and run with it. They might have already had that kind of heart, but they just needed something to egg them on. Even though i read back over my stuff and it seems this way, i didn't intend to say that music is the only way someone can kill someone. That's just the way that particular guy explained it. Not my words. Do i believe someone can kill with a clear head? Yes. Some people believe they are doing the right thing by killing people and they have no regrets afterward.

As far as gangsta rap goes, certain particluar rappers like to glorify premarital sex, disrespecting women, and alot of other stuff that shouldn't be said. Different people live different ways, but i don't think that kind of stuff is good for young influential minds to listen to. They hear it and think that is the way to be cool. I know yall see how everytime a rapper wears a new style, everybody has to buy them clothes. I know. I've done it myself! I'm not perfect. People want to have the tightest car, the brightest bling, and all that unimportant stuff. There is more to life than materials. I know yall know that. But, these young folks are getting taught the wrong lesson about life and they are listening. I don't like when i hear about Gangsta christian rap. It's just christian rap. There's nothin gangsta about being a christian.

I shouldn't have said all heavy metal groups in that statement. That was a biased statement and i apologize for that. Alot of them do, not all. Also, i'm not saying that if all children listen to violent music they will be violent. But it sure doesn't help them at all to hear it. A big reason for even music like that being created is because morals and values of the past are gone. When i was a little kid, i told my momma i was gonna cuss her out if she didn't shut up. I will never forget the face she made! I wanted to hide because i knew i was about to get slapped into the next century! Why did i do that, influences. Most kids are easily influenced.

I think that preacher you are talkin about shouldn't have ever been in ministry. It's people like that that corrupt the worlds view of christianity. People say they are christian, but they act just like the world. If the church would stand up and act right, people would have a better repect for the church. It makes sense. Why would a sinner want to be a christian if he sees that the christian does the same stuff?

As far as my cousin goes, i don't have to get him to tell me that's why he gets in trouble. Everyone in his house will tell you the same thing. He sits there and watches videos for hours trying to copy moves. He plays the same song 50 million times. He likes to go with the crowd. It's people like him that get caught up in glorified violence. I can't give you proof because you don't know him but i got plenty of people that will tell you the same thing!

I hope i cleared some things up and made myself NOT look like a fool. After reading back over my post, i noticed why i had so many negative replies. I made too many generalizations about groups of people. It seemed like i was stereotyping. I didn't mean it that way. But, i will not apologize for saying that there is a God and there is a devil. I don't know about no horns and pitchfork, but there is a devil. That's my belief. Lucifer was the chief musician in heaven. God created him to make music. Lucifer was the one to usher in the presence of the lord. When he realized what great power he had through music, he tried to take all of God's glory for himself. That's why God cast him down to hell. I don't expect everyone to feel the same way that i do. Thanks for everyones input.
 
stray411 said:
Make that fire gentlemen...

BTW, you got some serious heaters on your page man. Much respect...I don't think I've heard you're work before.

Yo BK we need to get up on the HR.com producer's page. What's up?


so what you want to do..let me know so we can see what we can get started..
 
Look at the work of this evil Mos-lem Tyson:

Praise Be to the Lord of the world

Praise Be to the Lord of the world

Praise Be to the Lord of the world

Praise Be to the Lord of the world

A clot of congealed blood,
Sperm cell to the ovary, my conception pure poetry,
Written before words would ever pour from my lips anointed


Now THAT'S Satanic.

Plus those ******s with Attitude, N.W.A.; they were soooooo disgusting and obscene. Look at this line that's against Christ's message:

I still express, yo, I don't smoke weed or sess
Cause it's known to give a brother brain damage
And brain damage on the mic don't manage - NUTHIN
but makin a sucka and you equal
Don't be another sequel.. {Express yourself!}


But the worst of all is that evil and horrible misogynistic, murdering thug Too-pack Shak-oor. Just read this absolute evil gangster satan rap:

Pour out some liquor and I reminsce, cause through the drama
I can always depend on my mama
And when it seems that I'm hopeless
You say the words that can get me back in focus
When I was sick as a little kid
To keep me happy there's no limit to the things you did
And all my childhood memories
Are full of all the sweet things you did for me
And even though I act craaazy
I gotta thank the Lord that you made me
There are no words that can express how I feel
You never kept a secret, always stayed real
And I appreciate, how you raised me
And all the extra love that you gave me
I wish I could take the pain away
If you can make it through the night there's a brighter day
Everything will be alright if ya hold on
It's a struggle everyday, gotta roll on
And there's no way I can pay you back
But my plan is to show you that I understand
You are appreciated


I hope that all of you people can come to the light and see true salvation...
 
Now that's just stupid. Every artist has atleast one good song. I could find plenty of stuff from nwa or pac that is bad. I like pac. Don't get me wrong. But that's just ignorant the way you put that together. I have a long fuse but i hate sarcasm.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top