I don't pretend to be an expert. I've written a fair number of songs - some truly cruddy and a few fairly decent - and only recently have begun to make an effort at getting decent recordings of them. I have found to most difficult part to be - and the part where most of us fall down - is doing the hard, grunt work of forming the initial inspiration into a well formed, polished and unified whole. Most of us get lots of ideas - I have cassette tape after cassette tape filled with them - but actually forming these tidbits in something tangible and cohesive enough to legitimately be called a "song" is where the real struggle is and that is the real work of song writing. I have some songs on garageband.com and have reviewed a ton of the songs on there. So much of the time the songs you're reviewing are, essentially, halfbaked - meaning that, while the writers may have had an interesting idea, they didn't follow through with the very difficult work of turning into something solid. They didn't ever work out the transition from the chorus to the verse or they had a real nice chorus idea, but just threw some crap on the front and called it a verse. That cliche about 10% inspiration and 90% perspiration is definitely true. I have only recently begun developing the discipline to look at my songs really critically and recognizing what is strong and what is weak and not being willing to settle for a weak chorus because the verse is good or vice verse. Anyway, these are my thoughts.
songwriting thoughts
- Thread starter BillyKid
- Start date
Dougie Johnson
New member
Hey BillyKid:
I know exactly what you are talking about.
I have written over 300 (!) songs, but have finished about 200 of them the way I actually want it to sound from start to finish, and of those have recorded about 50 of them.
It really takes discipline to see a song through to its intended finish. And when you are doing all the instruments & writing by yourself, it's amazing that you ever get more than a dozen or so songs recorded good enough to play to even your friends.
I tend to not "hop around". I will start with a melody or lyric in my head, and hold onto it like a pit bull until it is a complete, recorded song. I will not work on anything else until this is done. It keeps my inspiration & focus on the integrity of the song.
DJ
I know exactly what you are talking about.
I have written over 300 (!) songs, but have finished about 200 of them the way I actually want it to sound from start to finish, and of those have recorded about 50 of them.
It really takes discipline to see a song through to its intended finish. And when you are doing all the instruments & writing by yourself, it's amazing that you ever get more than a dozen or so songs recorded good enough to play to even your friends.
I tend to not "hop around". I will start with a melody or lyric in my head, and hold onto it like a pit bull until it is a complete, recorded song. I will not work on anything else until this is done. It keeps my inspiration & focus on the integrity of the song.
DJ
Billy- I think your right on with the half-baked comment. But I think this is partially a product of the affordability of recording gear. It used to be that recording was so expensive, people would spend a long time preparing before they went into the studio.
These days, you can write a song and have it recorded before lunch. While I like the songs that come to me quickly, that only happens maybe 10% of the time. The rest are constantly being worked on for up to a year. Sometimes I wish people would take a little more time before it becomes concrete.
Jeff
These days, you can write a song and have it recorded before lunch. While I like the songs that come to me quickly, that only happens maybe 10% of the time. The rest are constantly being worked on for up to a year. Sometimes I wish people would take a little more time before it becomes concrete.
Jeff
Billy:
My first songs (which I wrote about two years ago) sound terrible to me now, and if I compare them to my new ones, I definitely notice that I have been improving. I'm convinced that it's not only talent but a big amount of self-critics that brings you forward. I bought a book about songwriting some months ago. These books don't turn you into a hitwriter, but it helped me a lot - my songs are better structured and more commercial now, commercial in a positive meaning - easier to listen to, not too overloaded with lyrics and melodies. It's not enough to write just from the heart in my opinion - you have to write for the listeners too.
Anyway - I share your point of view, and the recording part is the hardest!
smirky
My first songs (which I wrote about two years ago) sound terrible to me now, and if I compare them to my new ones, I definitely notice that I have been improving. I'm convinced that it's not only talent but a big amount of self-critics that brings you forward. I bought a book about songwriting some months ago. These books don't turn you into a hitwriter, but it helped me a lot - my songs are better structured and more commercial now, commercial in a positive meaning - easier to listen to, not too overloaded with lyrics and melodies. It's not enough to write just from the heart in my opinion - you have to write for the listeners too.
Anyway - I share your point of view, and the recording part is the hardest!
smirky
jimini2001
New member
i sit and play my guitar and i begin to hear a melody.then the work starts.i go back and listen to some of those old tapes and some times more comes to me.sometimes i wonder whats wrong with my mind.recording is the easy part.sometimes the muse is with you,sometimes you are on your own.it is a lot of work either way
LI Slim
New member
So BTK, you know what to do........ Now, ...
I once heard Nick Lowe in a radio interview. He said that when he writes a song, after it's "finished", he locks himself in a room and plays it maybe a hundred times, which kind of gives the song a life of its own. (In this counterintuitive way he gains a more objective perspective about the song.) Then later he comes back and works on it some more until it's really finished. Of course, pop or Jazz (I'm contrasting with classical) songs don't ever have to be static. Using the "life of it's own" analogy, songs can always grow and evolve. Look what, for example, Bob Dylan and the Dead did with their songs over the years.
-Slim
I once heard Nick Lowe in a radio interview. He said that when he writes a song, after it's "finished", he locks himself in a room and plays it maybe a hundred times, which kind of gives the song a life of its own. (In this counterintuitive way he gains a more objective perspective about the song.) Then later he comes back and works on it some more until it's really finished. Of course, pop or Jazz (I'm contrasting with classical) songs don't ever have to be static. Using the "life of it's own" analogy, songs can always grow and evolve. Look what, for example, Bob Dylan and the Dead did with their songs over the years.
-Slim