Song Formats

J

JaQsonA1

New member
I have a question about song formats. i really dont want all of my songs to have the same format but its challenging to me to come up with a different format. this is usually how my songs flow

Verse
Chorus
Verse
Bridge
Hook(sometimes its the same as the chorus and sometimes its not)

I was wondering what are some of the formats you all use for your songs? I went to this site and the author said every song should have 2 verses, a B section, bridge, chorus(hook). i m not sure if this is the same thing as a channel i know some people have a part after the chorus and they call it the channel is that what he means? the B section= channel?
 
A very common 'format' nowadays is...

Intro.
Verse 1
Pre-Chorus
Chorus (Hook)
Verse 2
Pre-Chorus
Chorus (Hook)
Bridge
(Key change) =>
Chorus (Hook)
Outro.

HB16.
 
Ah Ha

I have written a song with a pre-chorus but i really didnt know what to call it. its a part that is connected to the chorus in the beginning but not in the hook. thanks human that helps!
 
That's it - if you listen to some of Max Martin's stuff ( his site is at http://www.maratone.se/ ) written for the Backstreet Boys, you'll see what I mean. "Drowning" is a good example, though I don't think Max Martin actually wrote that. The Pre-Chorus in that song is very clear because of the change in vocalist.

Note: You can't actually listen at http://www.maratone.se/ - Max is soooh successful - Britney songs & all that - that I guess they don't think it's necessary! ;)
 
or

you could try a totally different structure and see if that turned your crank. listen to some wackier bands that build songs differently. maybe
 
one i like to do (with rockier tracks)

intro (quiet)
chorus (loud!)
verse (quiet again)
bridge (medium)
chorus (loud)
very short instrumental part (or loud version of intro)
verse 2 (medium)
bridge (medium)
chorus (here we go again!! and we dont look back either - keep loud to finish)
guitar solo
chorus (maybe repeated)
out (not a lame-ass fadeout either)

hmmm looks crap looking back on it, but it kinda works great as alternative to the intro, verse, chorus, verse, chorus, etc

cheers
 
i feel like i m stuck

human i m gonna listen to the songs you suggested and brummyi m gonna try that format that you gave me. i just wrote another song and i keep falling back into that same boring format-

verse
chorus
verse
chorus
bridge
chorus (hook)

i think its because of the music that i am listening too has the same format. topolino what do you mean by wacker bands? what are some more ideas for a outro other than a fade out? sorry for sounding like a amatuer but i am really tired of this rut of redundancy. thanks for all your help.
 
i know it sounds obvious, but seriously, depending on what youre using to record, if youre using a sequencer like logic or cubase, etc, etc, then just backup your song, and rearrange the parts. not to sound good, but just to play with to get a feel for it.
the tune that ive posted on here too for feedback was pretty much like that - i stuck in possibly the worst string section in the living history of string sections just to see how it would work, then swapped things around here there and everywhere, just to see how it would work. when youre happy, just re-record over the dodgy bits and re-mix. seems to work anyway. if it doesnt, it'll probably give you an idea for something totally new anyway...
 
in terms of outros, depends on what type of music you do.

what i mean is just trying to think of what you'd do live rather than just pulling the volume faders down slowly at the end.
if ive got distorted guitars for example, ill cut the drums out and let them guitars ring out til they quit, perhaps letting feedback creep in slightly off them. i like the quite rough endings like that. if you wanna finish in style (well, my own taste), then i sometimes just let all the guitars ring out to the same bar, then after one quick upward strum, ill just mute the guitar so everything cuts at the same time.
basically, just dont do the commercial cop-out way of lowering the faders to 0 at the end of a tune, just to me sounds crap.
as i say though, totally depends on your style of music etc as to what will actually work
 
what I mean by wackier bands... well, now you pin me down. I guess Pink Floyd, Radiohead, Tool spring immediately to mind. Many of these bands' songs do not follow a typical chorus-verse-chorus-repeat-as-necessary type of approach.
 
dont be put off by the verse-chorus-verse-chorus format either.

many bands pull this off over and over and over - the beatles, guns n roses, suzanne vega, the darkness, soul asylum, metallica, etc, etc. i think it can come down to what you DO with the verse and chorus that can make the difference - dynamics, etc. for example, listen to 'perfect' by 'simple plan'. they go the other way, and go quiet for the chorus on that. then other bands go into double time or half time for the chorus, etc. loads of ideas can take you right away from the traditional format (but actually keeping it there as a guide)
 
Also try experimenting with key changes and unexpected chords every now and then. When a minor is most expected (in your ears the first or second time you play it) do a major of the same chord instead. Many great, great songwriters have successfully used this trick to let the song float in an interesting new direction without it being something bad or something totally out of bounds. Only your ear can judge if thats outta bounds or interesting :D
 
I try to write songs with the idea that I only do to the song what needs to be done. It's good to try to do new things to make things intresting but if you have to force it it probable wont work. This especailly true with lyrics. If you only have one verse and thats all you need then don't put two more verses in to fill space just use one verse. THis is what i try to do and if it ends up v c c then so be it. if not thats good to
 
You might also ask yourself if transitions are happening well. And what is a verse. How about the formats of traditional rhyme schemes? Try a tag.

One of my favorite formats that I've never made work again is this:

Intro(vocal and kinda sounds like a chorus but, is not)
Interlude
Verse
Chorus(kinda sounds like one but, not really)
Interlude
Verse
Chorus
Interlude(last chord changes to transition into the bridge)
Bridge
Outro(same as intro)

The interlude seems to serve as a musical hook without words.
 
some of my favourite bands (my fave genre is usually psychrock) generally follow the standard verse chorus verse formula, although sometimes this works out to poem prose poem, or story nonsense story. and they generaly eschew the standrad solo or bridge and instead insert a completely different song (and then go right back to finishing the first one).

try listening to os mutantes, legendary pink dots, apples in stereo, syd barrett, olivia tremor control, les claypool, tom waits, old pink floyd
 
Here's the more common structures I'm familiar with. Certainly there are variations to these, especially in more progressive popular music, but incorporating various formats in your writing allows for interesting variety. At least that's what I like to do. (Although in the examples below use v=verse, c=chorus, etc, some use a=verse, b=can be chorus or bridge depending on the order in the song.)

vvvvv: All verse structure, where the title/hook is usually in the last line of each verse. A lot of popular 60s folk songs are like this. Dylan did it a lot).

vvbv: Similar to above, except that a bridge is added. A bridge may be music only, or also have a lyric. It's mostly used to breakup any potential monotony in the music, and/or, reveal the 'payoff' for a 'story song'. A variation of this structure is to repeat the bv part again.

vcvcvc: Verse/chorus structure, where the title/hook is usually in the chorus, and often repeated two or three times (to drive it in the memory of the listener so they'll know what song to ask for when they're in the store). A lot of straight-ahead rock use this. Sometimes chorus music (or a variation of it) is added as an intro.

vcvcbc: Same as above, except a bridge is added for the reason stated in under the 'vvbc' structure.

There are others depending on the style of music, but these will allow for good variety in songwriting. As for the term "channel" that you mentioned, I've personally never heard of it. Lastly, the term "stanza" can refer to a block of text, eg. a verse, a "couplet" can be two lines of a song. There are lots of other terms.

Hope this helps. If I'm wrong on any of this, someone please straighten me out :).

Cheeky
 
aaahhh so many great idea's, i have recently started listening to some of the music that was written back in the day just to get some fresh ideas. i m really liking the vvvv format because i can use that for songs that are strictly for soloist. i have wanted to do this for a while but i didnt know how and make it interesting at the same time.
 
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