Small Studio Amp: Fender or Mesa?

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blackscot

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Pretty much what the title says.

This is for an ameteur's home (spare bedroom) studio. Needs are pretty basic. Some simple EQ, reverb, etc. in a small tube combo. Although some recording is done, probably ~10x as much time is spent playing live. I can't use high volume to create distortion though (without being evicted), so an overdrive channel is a must.

Price is "somewhat" flexible. I realize I need to pay for good tone, but I'm not thinking Rolls Royce, and don't want to overkill compared to what I really need.

I play a mix: 70's rock (both light and heavy), along with a little country, light jazz, etc.

I like what I've seen among the two named brands, just casually looking around the web. Any specific models you could recommend would be welcomed.

Thanks.
 
Really, it depends just how much overdrive you need. Fender will sufffice for smooth bluesy breakup, but if you want to get into metal-ish territory, you'll either need an OD or a Mesa (or something else similar).

At a glance, the Express 5:25 would seem to be a good match for your needs (switchable between 5 watts and 25 watts), but even five watts is pretty damned loud, and I wasn't as impressed with the amp as I was with its predecessors. That said, someone posted up some excellent sounding clips of an Express and a telecaster, and I have a feeling that one of these and anything with good singlecoils would be a good match for bluesier stuff.

That said, if you're into higher gain stuff, either the F-30 or DC-3 might be a better match. Both amps have phenominal clean channels, and gobs of gain to spare. The F-series is a bit crunchier than the DC IIRC (I haven't even heard a DC played in some time now), whereas the DC's are more of that "tradiitional" Mark-series Mesa metal sound.

Meanwhile, some of the small Fender tube stuff is quite nice. For the price I keep fighting the urge to buy a Blues Jr. It takes humbuckers well and gets into nice Santana-y territory as the drive comes up, yet will also do the traditional Fender clean.

Finally, how are you on solid state stuff? I'm usually not a fan, but I avsolutely adore my practice amp, a Tech-21 Trademark 30. It has JUST enough power to keep up with a moderate drummer, and while it's not quite as touch sensitive as my mesas (a Nomad 45 which you also mught want to check out, and a Rectoverb 50 which would be a bit less practical), if it was I'd be tempted to sell them and go with a Tech 21 rack setup. The thing kicks more butt than anything weighting in at like 18 pounds should. :D
 
Thanks -- I'll look into those models.

Sounds like in general the Fenders are more limited to the cleaner side? I definitely need to go at least into the "Santana-y" area, if not farther.

I've not liked the tone on any solid-states I've heard as well as the tubes. More harsh and sterile.
 
Try the Tech-21 stuff, then. I'm a total tube snob, have been for years, and I love the thing. :)

Fender's newer stuff (Hot Rod series and their derivatives) will certainly get you into Santana territory, especially if you hit it with something with humbuckers. If you need more saturation or crunch than that though, you'll either need an OD or something else.

What sort of sounds exactly are you after? Maybe a couple artists/albums?
 
I'm a big advocate for the Fender Super Champ XD.
15 Watts. Has reverb, bass/treb EQ, tons of different choices for overdrive channels, as well as clean.
It's a Hybrid. But it sounds better than anything I've played. At least better than the Marshall JVM all tube head I played the other day.
I love bluesy/creamy distortion, and this amp is great. But this amp also allows me to go all out metal if I'm feeling it, which I do every now and then.
That's my thought. It's cheap, sounds good, and you can get good tones at low volume. You could always go with the smaller version of the amp. It's called the Vibro Champ, it only has one channel though, and is 5 watts. I haven't heard what it sounds like though.

So yes.
+1 for the Fender Super Champ XD.
 
DrewPeterson7 said:
.....What sort of sounds exactly are you after? Maybe a couple artists/albums?
Click to expand...

Some of the more overdriven stuff actually includes Santana, along with Jethro Tull's Martin Barre and Pink Floyd's David Gilmour. I've also poked at Deep Purple and Black Sabbath a bit (I grew up in the 70's.....:o).

Cleaner side would include Gordon Lightfoot's Terry Clemens, along with a handful of classic light jazz/pop tunes.

I guess the Stevie Ray Vaughn material would be considered mid-range.
 
i'd have to also vouch for SCXD. it will work both for recording and live as you described.

Tech 21 stuff is great, including the Trademark amps (I had the Trademark 60), but for the price (and with a real tube power section) SCXD hits them below the waiste.

line-out on the SCXD is just VERY GOOD.

I also currently have Behringer v-tone boxes (gdi21, adi21 and bdi21 - all knockoffs of Tech 21 sansamps) - a very useful, apartment-friendly tool.
 
blackscot said:
Some of the more overdriven stuff actually includes Santana, along with Jethro Tull's Martin Barre and Pink Floyd's David Gilmour. I've also poked at Deep Purple and Black Sabbath a bit (I grew up in the 70's.....:o).

Cleaner side would include Gordon Lightfoot's Terry Clemens, along with a handful of classic light jazz/pop tunes.

I guess the Stevie Ray Vaughn material would be considered mid-range.
Click to expand...

Hmm. The heavier stuff you're mentioning there is pretty grungy and lo-fi in tone, I'm wondering if maybe a Mesa wouldn't be the way to go. Maybe a small tube Fender and a decent distortion pedal?
 
You say you play `70's rock? Most of Layla was recorded with an old tweed Champ.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
I've got a lil Epi Valve Special but I haven't tracked with it yet.
My neighbors don't give a rats ass about too much noise so I use my Super Twin....
 
Thanks for all the replies.

I looked at a Blues Junior at Guitar Center yesterday. Nice little unit.

I'm also intrigued by the Super Champ. What's up with "hybrid" designs?
 
blackscot said:
Thanks for all the replies.

I looked at a Blues Junior at Guitar Center yesterday. Nice little unit.

I'm also intrigued by the Super Champ. What's up with "hybrid" designs?
Click to expand...

Typically, they stick a single tube in the preamp, mate it to a solid state power section, and double the price relative to the nearest comparable solid state option because, well, ZOMG, T00bZ1!!11!

Personally, I think it's a gimmick - to put out any sort of preamp gain, you need more than two gain stages (three to four, sometimes five or more depending on the amp, is the norm for a modern cascading gain preamp), and a single 12AX7 is at most capable of two stages. That means if you plug into a hybrid amp and hear more than the slightest of crunch from the preamp, a significant part of your distortion is coming from transistors anyway.

I'm not saying solid state distortion is necessarily a bad thing, just that I don't think adding one or two tube gain stages really justifies the price increase. Dollar for dollar I'd rather have a Marshall MG at half the price of its AVT cousin.
 
Thanks for the edification.

ETA -- Hmm then.....some of these other small Fenders -- although all tube -- appear to have only a couple of pre tubes.
 
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I'm an exceedingly easy-to-please person, but I love my Tech 21 GT2, though it is a little noisy.

For that matter, I hear that the Behringer (GASP!) ripoffs are a huge value and can convincingly mock the GT2's/etc.
 
I'm hard to please, but I just shelled out for a new Fender Jazzmaster Ultralight head & cab. Small, light, and the tone kills. It sounds like a Fender, despite not having tubes (which contributes to its lack of bulk).

I've always played tube amps, not because of any commitment to that technology, but because the tube amps always sounded better than solid state. A couple of years ago, when I started downsizing my gear, I got rid of my '63 Ampeg B15N (100 lb, 40 watt) and replaced it with an Ampeg B100R, solid-state but with the Ampeg sound.

That led to me taking the plunge on the JM, which I had to order through my dealer. I had read all the reviews I could find, and they all praised the sound and light weight.

Now I've got one, and I'm a believer. I compared it head to head with my all-time favorite tube amp, a '67 Fender Super Reverb that sings, and the JM only lost out on comparing the digital reverb to the Super's good old Fender spring tank -- and that's probably debatable among different players. The Normal channel is sweet and clean, and the Drive channel offers very controllable distortion.

Its only fault is that it's pricey. They go for $170 street, but I was able to trade in some other gear so I wasn't out that much cash. The amp comes with a gig bag for the 7.5 lb head and the foot switch and cables, and the speaker box weighs 17 lb, due to a neodymium magnet in the speaker.

This is the last amp I'll buy, unless something happens to it; in that case I'll get another one.
 
blackscot said:
Thanks for the edification.

ETA -- Hmm then.....some of these other small Fenders -- although all tube -- appear to have only a couple of pre tubes.
Click to expand...

...and they're pretty low gain. Three 12AX7's for a one channel amp would give you four gain stages (the first two tubes) and one tube for phase inversion. That won'd give you the Black Album rhythm sound, exactly, but it'll give you moderate smooth saturation.
 
The Randall RM20 is always worth considering in these situations. It is a great sounding, very versatile little amp. Buy a Blackface module and you have a great Fender sound and a Top Boost for a Vox sound, etc. You choose.

Tiny Terror is cool too but it basically does one thing.
 
I third the Super Champ XD. I've owned many of the lower end modelers and after the honeymoon was over they just didn't cut it. I heard the SCXD and knew. I still have it and love it. I did swap out the 12AX7 with a triple mica NOS tube. Made its overdrive a little smoother. Finding a good sounding crunchy and distorted sound is tough on the lower end but this amp does a reasonable job of it. My favorite pedal for crunch and distortion is the MXR Distortion III. It not metal destruction though. Just good solid respectable distortion that mimics authentic. It took some time to train my ears to know what to listen for so now when I hear distortion I know right away if its a good simulation of the real thing. Most pedals and modelers just don't cut it. The SCXD and the MXR Distortion III are very close to the real deal in my book.
 
Traynor YCS-100

3 independent channels, each has its own gain and fx loop and tone knobs. switchable 30 or 100 watts, made in Canada, can get it new for maybe $850. I think Traynor does great clean, and it loves pedals. Stick some alnico high power speakers on it and you'll be screamin all night long with your axe grinder!

For about $500 the YCV20WR is a nice two trick pony amp!
 
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