Should Tab Sites Be Legal?

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  • Start date Start date

Should tab sites be legal?

  • Yes...I don't know what I'd do without them!!!!

    Votes: 175 85.0%
  • No...just go out and by the songbooks

    Votes: 15 7.3%
  • Not sure...

    Votes: 11 5.3%
  • What the heck are tabs???

    Votes: 5 2.4%

  • Total voters
    206
A bunch of bands have tabs of their songs on their own site. Take THAT MPA.

Do they think people will try to play themselves off as the original artists, passing other people's songs off as their own? I'm not sure why they decided to do this all of a sudden. I'm sure it's because they got bored of the p2p thing.

On the other hand, now that tabs are less accessable, artists will be putting out fewer cover songs, forcing themselves to write original music. Unfortunately, there will be an even higher abundance of bad songs out there. Eh, oh well.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/4508158.stm
 
tabs helped me immensely when i was first learning electric guitar. this makes me want to tab out every song i've ever written and put it online just incase somebody ever wants it.
 
TheRockDoc said:
The fact that songwriters and performers make millions has NOTHING to do with it. Just because someone makes millions doesn't mean that people have a right to steal from them.
The fact that millionare artists and publishers are trying to squeeze another nickel out of my pocket has EVERYTHING to do with it. Tablature is not stealing. You put out a song, someone interprets it and offers their version as help to others who are trying to learn it. GM or Ford don't get royalties when a person gets driving lessons. Nor do they get a piece of the pie when someone sells a used car privately. Webster's doesn't get a royalty when I teach my kids how to spell a word. It's completely ridiculous. For a millionare like Garth Brooks to try and squeeze more money out of his fans by by attempting to charge royalties on sales of used cd's would be stealing on his part if you ask me.
 
yes

My def. for a tab is :

A personal interpretation on a given piece of guitar/drum/bass.

----
Tabs could be compared to sharing (c) music.
But what the industry needs to do is understand that the digital world has already came and it already is big-and it will grow. Personally, i think that dist. companys will eventually downsize to a great degree (atleast)-and then become more based on live performences and more free acessable music.


after looking at that-it doesnt really make sence...i just mean that money will be made by live performences and thing should-and will eventually become free (tabs-recorded music-ect)
 
gbdweller said:
The fact that millionare artists and publishers are trying to squeeze another nickel out of my pocket has EVERYTHING to do with it. Tablature is not stealing. You put out a song, someone interprets it and offers their version as help to others who are trying to learn it. GM or Ford don't get royalties when a person gets driving lessons. Nor do they get a piece of the pie when someone sells a used car privately. Webster's doesn't get a royalty when I teach my kids how to spell a word. It's completely ridiculous. For a millionare like Garth Brooks to try and squeeze more money out of his fans by by attempting to charge royalties on sales of used cd's would be stealing on his part if you ask me.


defidentally well put!
 
Cardioidpotent said:
I personally don't give a rat's ass 'cause I can't read tab. :o

are you serious man-i hope you can read music.
 
gbdweller said:
Tablature is not stealing.

Right

gbdweller said:
GM or Ford don't get royalties when a person gets driving lessons. Nor do they get a piece of the pie when someone sells a used car privately. Webster's doesn't get a royalty when I teach my kids how to spell a word.

Ford would get a royalty, and give a royal ass kicking if someone said- here is the step by step plan for how to build your own Ford Taurus.

You teach your kid how to spell a word out of the dictionary, you're using it for what it was designed for. If you start selling your own version of Webster's, you've infringed a copyright.

Tabbing really isn't taking away royalties- and that is the problem. Garth Brooks didn't lose a sale on his record 'cause somebody want sto learn how to play his song. By rights, though, ASCAP or BMI could come in and collect royalties from the club owner that profits from the use of Garth's song- not including the shaking of his big fat ass all over the stage.

I have no problem with tab- but I also have no problem with someone making money. I do have a problem, though, with unnecessarily pinching pennies out of a guys pocket- particularly when they didn't even do a good rip off job :)
 
So seeing we're all in agreement, who voted "No?"

Tell us why...

incidentally, I have found some fantastically complex pieces of music tabbed free on the net that are absolutely 100% correct - although my usual experience is otherwise.

I actually bought the Led Zep Complete Guitar songbook about 25 years ago and learnt to play Rain Song from the official source, although I always knew it was wrong as the chord shapes represented didn't sound quite right although the notes were correct.

The book provided chord diagrams in standard tuning.

I learnt the correct way to play it from a free tab on the 'net a couple of years ago - it's in some obscure open tuning JP dreamt up and you can clearly hear that it is accurate - so the official song books aren't always correct either.

20 years playing a nasty of work like that the wrong way.... who should I sue? :p

Cheers
 
tabs arnt great from a drummers perspective like half the time they are rong or writin so its hard to understand i prefer sheet music it rules over tabs , and more importantly u can pick um bad sight reading technequeics
 
I don't really ever use tabs because I don't have to, but I know alot of other people are greatly helped by them, so hey, why not. I you want the full thing you're still gonna have to buy the songbook because tabs are pretty limited, but all in all, why not?
 
Armistice said:
it's in some obscure open tuning JP dreamt up and you can clearly hear that it is accurate

So what's the tuning, TabMaster?
 
teaching

For those who oppose free and legal tabs, why wouldn't it also be illegal for me to show a friend how to play a song I'd figured out by playing along with the CD? Is that copyright infringement?

Also, this seems counter-productive to me. Cover bands, even bad ones, only help promote the real artist. Back in college, my frioends and i enjoyed learning songs from bands we liked and teaching eachother. "Check it out, I just figured out 'Little Wing.'" "Cool, show me. Oh, and i just got that Lowest of the Low song." It seems to me that thias kind of behavior only helps the composer by spreading recognition and appreciation; I mean, you listen to a song on the radio, you might dig it, but spend a few house learning it, and you have a whole new level of appreciation.

Frankly, if I ever wrote a song that people actually wanted to learn, I'd offer to teach them myself, even if it only ever got played in dorm lounges (actually, with the amount of music college kids buy, that doesn't sound too bad!)
 
There are millions of guitar players around the world that are just beginners who need these tabs to learn and keep their intrest in the guitar. I for one know that without these tabs I would never be playing the guitar today.
I just don't feel that I'm stealing from these giant publishing companys because they also have an equal chance to create their own versions of the song. This is totally different from stealing mp3.
 
While most tabs are REALLY inaccurate, I have found some good ones. One guy had an EXCELLANT Dylan site that had very accurate tabs. I've played along with several Dyaln songs using his tabs and they were right on the money. He took the tabs down due to being scared of lawsuits. As far as Dylan is concerned, there ARE no good guitar books. All of them are flat out wrong.

I wouldn't feel as strongly about this if the real goal was to help artists, but the sad truth is that the music industry doesn't care about artist getting their fair share. The goal is simply money.

One of my heroes Robert Fripp has been dealing for years with the industry. He is strictly against bootlegging and such, but he feels (and I agree) that art and business are incompatible.

When you think about it, music as a commodity (in the modern sense) is very young compared to other arts. Book sales in a large scale is as old as the printing press, movies are new I suppose, but music has been around longer than almost any other kind of art if not the oldest. I realsize that previously music would be commissioned, but it wasn't controlled. Of course I don't think that was possible 150 years ago. The music business is less than 100 years old, and the business as we know it now is maybe 75 years old at them most.

So in other words the way that we consume music is very unnatural. I think that technology COULD allow us to revert to the days when we could experience music in a much more democratic fashion and at the same time have mass exposure. I'm not sure how or when, but I think this is what the industry is freaking out about. They are slowly losing control - and the public has an instinct to consume art in the cheapest and most ready way they can.
 
I think Tabs are and should be legal. They are educational tools. They are not promulgated to take someone's music. They are to teach how to use your instrument to create music. I personally have had excellent experiences finding accurate tabs. I use them quite a bit.

(1) Sometimes you'll hear something and say "How's he doing that??" Like the beginning to Mean Streets, for example. I look at the tab and then say, "Oh, that's what he's doing!" Give it a try and I've learned something. Seeing it on paper sometimes also makes it easier to see the theory behind the licks.

(2) I'm in a band that does originals and covers. If I need to learn a few songs before the next practice, tab can be the quickest way to get from point A to point B. With tab I can learn 3 songs in one night. Without tab, it might take me the week to learn one complicated song. I'm not a young-un with nothing to do once my homework is done. I only get a limited amount of time each week to devote to guitar, so I'd rather spend it practicing than rewinding over and over and over.

Yeah, sometimes you run into some bad tab. It happens and you just figure for that song you're on your own. But songbooks are expensive. I've bought quite a few of them, but they're of limited use. One doesn't usually want to learn every sing Rush song out there, but you might want to learn a couple of them. So you're gonna spend $30 on a Rush book to learn Spirit and Limelight? And I've bought books that are of limited use because they don't always tab out all the parts. Or they tab out some songs and only provide the chords for others. And I've paid money for this!!!

For the flip side, here's where it hurts the artists. If I can get tabs for free, why would I ever buy a published songbook? And the artists and music publishers and studios get royalties from songbook sales. By having tabs out there, theoretically, those sales will drop. I'm sure the MPAA is getting financially whacked by tab sites.

But, as with everything in the music industry, they're going about this all wrong. What they should do is follow the iTunes model. Produce ACCURATE and COMPLETE tabs for all parts of the song. Make them available in files that play through powertab or guitarpro. Provide performance notes, gear information, amp and effect settings. Make them available for a reasonable monthly subscription - say $10 per month. I'm sure people would pay $10 per month for professionally transcribed, accurate and annotated tabs. Win by the merits, not by saber rattling. Provide something of actual value.

But these are paper publishers trying to keep the digital world at bay.

I'm going to keep using tabs. I see nothing illegal about it. It's educational. It's fair use. And if my band plays a cover song at a gig, it means I've bought the song myself, and if someone hears it and says, "hey I like that song" and goes home and grabs it off iTunes, then the artist should be happy. But remember, the publishing association doesn't care a whit about song sales, they want the paper sales.
 
wagon wheels

When the automobile came out, I'm sure it whacked alot of wagon-wheel makers pretty hard. The smart ones re-tooled and started maing car parts, the dumb ones went broke.

Music publishers are the same way. Those that are trying to use lawsuits to close the floodgates on technology are getting hosed. Those that have re-tooled to use the new technology to continue making money are doing just that.

I like the idea of a professionally-published (and ACCURATE, PLEASE!) tab site where i can pay a buck a song or $10 a month. As long as some of that money goes to the composer, God bless 'em!
 
Mindcore said:
You mean someone else knows who LOTL are? Nice.. you must be from Toronto.

Are you kidding? My wife and I had our first dance at our wedding to 'subversives.'

BTW, I would love good tabs to subversives. I learned it in D, which sounds wrong when I play along with the record. Little help?
 
Personally I can read both music and tab, but I think tabs are a very usefull tool for anyone who is learning to play guitar, plus I've noticed that when I've gotten music books, the tabs I can get offline or more accurate. The convinience of being able to go on line look up a tab, and be satisfied with an accurate recreation of a certain song is something that should be legal to do.
 
sorry for the double post, but does anyone have guitar pro? That is a very usefull program to have for both inexperienced and experienced guitarist.
 
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