"shimmy" on cymbals with SM57

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Chill

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I sampled a friend's kit recently. Mic'd with SM57. The drums and short cymbal sounds (hat click, tight hat, ride dome) came out great. The long cymbal sounds (loose hat, crash, ride...body?, and ride hit like a crash) have a good sound on the attack, but as they fade out they "shimmy" like a back-and-forth sound. I tried ramping up the gain a bit and moving the mic back to get more of a room sound than a close mic sound, but it didn't seem to help much and also introduced some noise.

Is the shimmy common with a '57 and cymbals? Will a condenser mic fix the problem?
 
i don't have this problem, but i don't close mic my cymbals. i use one condensor mic about the whole kit. maybe i'll try micing my crash with a 57 to see if i get the same effect. how was your mic positioned in relation to the cymbal?
 
a57 sounds like butt on cymbals, i'm not sure that thare's much you can do about it. :(
 
I had it aimed about halfway between the dome and the edge, at a 45 degree angle, about 2-3 ft away, up to about 5-6 ft with the gain turned up.
 
A few thoughts - if you're looking for a slightly "dirtier" sample sound, then I suppose the 57 might work... but yeah, if you're looking for good samples for a clean sound, you're gonna wanna use a condenser.

About the "shimmy" - well, I have a guess, but it depends on what the "shimmy" sound is like. My guess is that when you mic the cymbals like that, the cymbals are decently loose - when you hit the cymbal, the movement that happens (just the swinging of the cymbal) causes the mic to pick up a varying sound, depending on how it's aimed. If the frequency of the shimmy is about the same as the movement of the cymbal, that's what your problem is. So, that said, some solutions:

- You can tighten the cymbal onto the stand, which will reduce the movement. However, this actually can "choke" the cymbal sound, making it sound not quite as natural.
- Moving the mic around the room can definitely help, trying different places - often, when close-micing a crash, a lot of drummers have the mic under the cymbal - this might be something to try. Bottom line: close-miking a cymbal can be pretty hard.
- Depending on the degree of "shimmy", you may just decide to say that it's ok - when you're listening to a drumset, a lot times the "natural" sound includes just such a shimmy because of the way the cymbals move. You may decide it just doesn't matter.

There ya go - hope it helps. :)
 
Cymbals vibrate differently across the cymbal. In some cases you can actually hear alot of bass coming from them. I used SM81s and Rode NT5s for close micing cymbals a while back. A 57 probably wouldn't sound great anywhere on the cymbals, but if that is all you have, try pointing it straight down (perpendicular to the cymbal), as close to the center of the bell as you can. Try and make sure that the mic is 180 degrees from where the drummer is going to hit the cymbal.

Rides are difficult if they build up too much, a little felt can help that but if you are just taking samples the build up shouldn't be a problem. Don't even think about trying to close mic a china. Also, make sure the cymbals aren't moving when struck.

If you want a kind of cool effect, try holding the mic, hit the cymbal, then move the mic around the cymbal about 1/4 inch away.

If all else fails, an ECM8000 where-ever the cymbal sounds good in the room may be the best cheap way to go. I'm generally not a fan of behringer crap, but the ECM8000 is hard to beat for $50. I wouldn't put one of these right up against the cymbal though.
 
I tried the 57 on axis under the dome on a small stand under the cymbal. Still about 3-4 ft away, and that definitely reduced the shimmying sound, although it was still there...also tried an MXL990 condenser a few feet away and that helped a bit more.

But I also listened closely for that sound while doing the second set of samples, and the shimmying in the sound really is there, it's just less in the room. Maybe the condenser from more like 10 ft away would help reduce it more.

Thanks for the tips!
 
I would try placing the mics directly above the crashes aiming down and directly at the center (not too close). IMO because of the rocking motion of the crashes it keeps a more even sound.
 
Sound like it could also be a really bad phase problem. Are you using more than one mic? If so, what is the placement?
 
rcarden2 said:
Sound like it could also be a really bad phase problem. Are you using more than one mic? If so, what is the placement?
Click to expand...

Exactly what I was thinking. If you're using more than one mic, I'd read up on the 3:1 rule regarding overheads or any other mic's you're using. Check out some info on mic placement. Try google, or search this message board. Good luck.
 
Condenser Mic !!!

dude r u nutS !?!?!?!? condenser mics are evn more sensitive, your gonna get even more sounds, maybe that shimmy is becuz ur hittin a ride like a crash that must sound awful, and have you seen how thick rdies are thats gonna ring like crazy of course
 
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