Scale to use in hard and alt rock soloing

[Elmo89m]

i am good at soloing in minor pentatonic and i am a good blues soloist. THis is funy to do but the music i write is alt rock influenced by bands like radiohead, Bush, smashing pumpkins. When i solo over the rhythm i write it just sounds laughable because it is so bluesy. What are some good scales to use for that alternative arty music sound, not bluesy.

 

[systmovadown]

plain minor....(aeolian)
i use it all the time for improvisations because it is so easy to mix with the blues/minor pentatonic scale.

there are so many variations - you can't just limit yourself to one scale

 

[metalhead28]

Learn the major scale (Diatonic) and as System said the Aeolian mode, also considered the natural minor scale for all practical purposes.

Depending on the type of chord progressions or voicings you use, you may find alot of satisfaction in learning all of the other modes as well.

 

[Cuzme]

Learn the major scale (Diatonic) and as System said the Aeolian mode, also considered the natural minor scale for all practical purposes.

Depending on the type of chord progressions or voicings you use, you may find alot of satisfaction in learning all of the other modes as well.

I'll echo that. Be comfortable both with the scales and arpeggios (135 as well as 1357) in all the modes.

The chromatic scale is great too, as long as you focus and lead into chord tones. For example, make up a scale like...approach each chord tone from a half step below: in the key of C...B, C, D#, E, F#, G, B, C...and try it going down but still approaching the chord tones from below...B, C, F#, G, D#, E, B, C.

Make stuff up. Try everything. Learn everything. Then, most importantly, forget everything and just play by ear! Much love,
Cuzme

 

[shaunp]

Be ready to experiment with keys a lot too, in addition to scales. I'll give an example so you can see where I'm coming from. I've noticed that many of my favorite Radiohead songs step outside of a single key into multiple keys throughout the song. Take Radiohead's Sulk from The Bends album, for instance. This entire part is a big section of the song but it doesn't fit into any single key. It goes:

D D(octave) Db(half-step down) A
D D(octave) Db(half-step down) A
C C(octave) B(half-step down) G
D D(octave) Db(half-step down) A

Music theory says that the 'D' riff is either in the key of D major or A major (because they're the only ones that have D and Db in them) but that the 'C' riff couldn't possibly be in either D major or A major (because of the C). So my way of looking at it says Radiohead changes keys here and the theory says it goes to either C major or G major (because they're the only ones which have B and C in them). You now have 4 keys to choose from for soloing/comping over this and can start experimenting with what the key of A major sounds like over the 'D' riff (hint - start on the D not the A), what the key of D major sounds like over the 'D' riff, etc. IMO, the theory helps out a lot and can help move your solos in the right direction just by giving you new keys (and more notes) to use. If you can look at a chord progression and tell which key (or keys) it is in then you've made a big step in making theory work for you and your solos. Eventually the right sounds should come out naturally after playing around with the right keys and extra notes long enough (that's my theory anyhow ).

If you want to look more into key changes so you can practice finding them in other songs or soloing across multiple keys, there are more changes in Radiohead's Sulk, in Beck's Guess I'm Doing Fine from the Sea Change album and in David Bowie's Space Oddity.

One thing to add, as everyone has pointed out, is that major and natural minor (a.k.a. Ionian and Aeolian) are very good scales to focus on. As it turns out, you can use multiple scales while staying in just one key. As an example, the C major scale has the same notes as the A minor scale. Both are in the key of C major, but they sound very different. Experiment with playing both scales back to back in a solo and you'll see what I mean. You can also stick with just one scale (i.e. major) in your solos and change keys once in a while to have some fun (if it jives with what the rhythm, bass, and vocals are doing, of course).

Cheers,
Shaun

 

[AlfredB]

if you aint very advanced in playing - stay in minor pentatonic - as this will allow you to solo over minor and mayor chords....

 

[Elmo89m]

could you explain that alfred..i think i know what you saying but could you elaborate also......with what you guys said about aeolian...when playing that lets say in C i have to start it at the sixth degree of C right....not at the c root?

 

[metalhead28]

No, if you want to play in C minor you'll be playing C "Aeolian", which is the sixth degree of the D# major scale (meaning it would contain the same notes as the D# major scale but start on "C"). Don't think of it that way though, just learn the scale pattern as it applies to the root note "C".
That would be the following intervals:
(W for whole step, H for half-step)

W-H-W-W-H-W-W

 

[metalhead28]

On a side note I'll mention that it is very beneficial to learn scales as intervals rather than just fingering patterns. It will help you to move along strings and thus move much more freely around the neck.

 

[Scottgman]

when playing that lets say in C i have to start it at the sixth degree of C right....not at the c root?

Metalhead gave you some good info.

It seems really confusing with all the scales and modes but it helps to remember they are all related and many are just the same notes with different starting points.

For instance, G major, E minor, and A dorian are all the same notes (one sharp: F#).

You should check out the following website if you never have before-- it is extremely helpful.

http://www.looknohands.com/chordhouse/guitar/index_rb.html

On the right-hand side, scroll down a little bit until you see Ionian. Ionian through Locrian are all the modes. Ionian is Major, of course. Aeolian is natural minor. I encourage you to explore them and see how they are all related. You can also click the little option buttons on top to switch between viewing the intervals and notes (really helpful!). I almost always have that website open when I'm working on a song or solo. It's even helpful when you are trying to suss out a song.