Room treatment questions

[Nightfire]

Ok, after getting quote for Auralex and 703 I have determined that it is not within my college fund possibilities to get any sort of room treatment.
My question is, is there anything else I can do? I have 2 rooms that I can use for vocal tracking, one is a small concrete floor and poor insulation room that we use for a natural "cooler" in the basement, and the other is a bathroom.
I understand that I either want a nice natural reverb, and if thats not possible a room thats as dead as possible. The bathroom seems to have a nice 'verb in it, but almost too much. The little cooler room seems to be pretty dead. Would it be best to throw as much carpet as possible into the small cooler room and use that?
Dont laugh, Im working with what I can here.

Mike

 

[pandamonk]

I would avoid the carpet idea. Surely you can gt a bunch of rigid fiberglass/703 or something. I mean, it's £28($50) for 10 4'x2'x2" knauf rocksilk batts here, and the US is usually a good bit cheaper. 10 would certainly help a great deal. You don't need to cover the whole room. You can make gobos to place round the sound source, or treat a couple walls/ceiling.

 

[Nightfire]

No, 703 will cost me more than that due to shipping. No local company can get it for me. Went down to my local hardware stores and they do not have rigid fiberglass either, only Roxul (which I am assuming is like rockwool). If I can make frames and put Roxul in it and maybe put them on caster wheels that would probably help. I'll put up a quick sketch on here of the area Im currently using with measurements. It's a very odd shape so Im not sure where to begin putting room treatment, thats why I figured I could use the bathroom or the cooler room for tracking.


Mike

 

[pandamonk]

No, 703 will cost me more than that due to shipping. No local company can get it for me. Went down to my local hardware stores and they do not have rigid fiberglass either, only Roxul (which I am assuming is like rockwool). If I can make frames and put Roxul in it and maybe put them on caster wheels that would probably help. I'll put up a quick sketch on here of the area Im currently using with measurements. It's a very odd shape so Im not sure where to begin putting room treatment, thats why I figured I could use the bathroom or the cooler room for tracking.


Mike

Are you from Canada? I think Roxul might be a Canadian subsiduary or Rockwool. Roxul seem to have pretty good coefficients. RHT 40 seems to have the best coefficients, but any rigid would be fine.

 

[tarnationsauce2]

You asked for cheap, I'll give you cheap.

Keep in mind that while this may be better than no treatment at all, it's nowhere near the sound of proper treatment. However, I do know that you can get "OK" recordings with the following el-cheap-o treatment method.

All you need is lots of blankets / sleeping bags, T-pins, and maybe a mattress or two. Heck the beanbag chair and som pillows too! Remember, you want soft and fluffy things for absorption. Hard, flat surfaces reflect sound.

Simply hang the blankets and sleeping bags over the walls and windows using the T-pins. T-pins are cheap, strong, and don't put as big of a hole as a nail or drywall screw would.
And if you have a mattress or few, use them in corners and/or as temporary wall partitions.

 

[andyhix]

Yep, like tarnation said, get cushions and mattresses. Troll your local underpasses, and steal a few urine-stained mattresses from the hobos. Or I suppose you could check the local thrift stores and garage sales, for slightly less urine-stained options. Anything relatively dense and cushy will help your cause somewhat.

 

[pandamonk]

You asked for cheap, I'll give you cheap.

Keep in mind that while this may be better than no treatment at all, it's nowhere near the sound of proper treatment. However, I do know that you can get "OK" recordings with the following el-cheap-o treatment method.

All you need is lots of blankets / sleeping bags, T-pins, and maybe a mattress or two. Heck the beanbag chair and som pillows too! Remember, you want soft and fluffy things for absorption. Hard, flat surfaces reflect sound.

Simply hang the blankets and sleeping bags over the walls and windows using the T-pins. T-pins are cheap, strong, and don't put as big of a hole as a nail or drywall screw would.
And if you have a mattress or few, use them in corners and/or as temporary wall partitions.

This will certainly suck out all the highs, leaving the lows to boom. I'd suggest if you're gonna use blankets etc, place them round the mic, and as thick as possible(fold into at least quarters). Don't put them all over the walls. Place like so... I used cymbal stands, but you'd be better using mic stands etc.

 

[Nightfire]

Allright thanks a lot for the help. Yes Im from Canada, and I could afford Roxul and making my own frames. I figure I can make my own "booth" around the mic with enough frames. Ive been recording with a dynamic mic so far cuase of the poor acoustics.
So, blankets, carpets and matresses will suck out the highs (thanks for the pics by the way). So how can I reduce the lows?
Am I right in assuming that if my room has poor acoustics and poor reverb I would try to make it as dead as possible?
Another thing to mention, I mix in a corner as well and I can only us PC speakers and headphones so everything is less than ideal.

Thanks,

Mike

 

[pandamonk]

Allright thanks a lot for the help. Yes Im from Canada, and I could afford Roxul and making my own frames. I figure I can make my own "booth" around the mic with enough frames. Ive been recording with a dynamic mic so far cuase of the poor acoustics.
So, blankets, carpets and matresses will suck out the highs (thanks for the pics by the way). So how can I reduce the lows?
Am I right in assuming that if my room has poor acoustics and poor reverb I would try to make it as dead as possible?
Another thing to mention, I mix in a corner as well and I can only us PC speakers and headphones so everything is less than ideal.

Thanks,

Mike

Well we all have to start somewhere. Emm to tame the bass beast, you need thick, dense, absorbent material. You can place 4-6" rigid fiberglass, rockwool etc. across a corner and get decent low freq absorption.

 

[Nightfire]

Until I get my own place my conditions will pretty much stay this mediocre. Lotsa noise in the basement and dont wanna fork over the money for a condensor if I will have too much background noise. I will however invest in some monitors soon if I find a good second hand pair at the pawnshop.
Heres a quick diagram, the live room is a little bit longer (heightwise when looking at the picture from the top) than its shown. The drums arent in the corner, but pretty close.
Im thinking put Roxul in corners behind the comp (where the drums are and where the wall spikes out funnily) and then a make-shift booth with blankets in the "live room", or in the washroom or cooler. Sound good?

Mike

 

[pandamonk]

This is what I'd suggest. And have some gobos around the mic in the cooler/wash room.

 

[homestudioguy]

Ok, after getting quote for Auralex and 703 I have determined that it is not within my college fund possibilities to get any sort of room treatment.
Mike

Thick Curtains may help to some degree.
Have you considered getting an sE Reflexion Filter ($299 US)?
http://www.seelectronics.com/rf.html
For a "cheap fix" you could buy just three-2" 2X4 panels of Owens-Corning 703 http://www.atsacoustics.com/cat--Raw-Sound-Absorption-Materials--102.html and do 3 DIY copies of this: http://www.realtraps.com/p_mondotrap.htm
then place them behind/around your mic as needed!
Good Luck!

 

[pandamonk]

Thick Curtains may help to some degree.
Have you considered getting an sE Reflexion Filter ($299 US)?
http://www.seelectronics.com/rf.html
For a "cheap fix" you could buy just three-2" 2X4 panels of Owens-Corning 703 http://www.atsacoustics.com/cat--Raw-Sound-Absorption-Materials--102.html and do 3 DIY copies of this: http://www.realtraps.com/p_mondotrap.htm
then place them behind/around your mic as needed!
Good Luck!

Realtraps have their own version of the sE Reflexion Filter, which seems to be much more effective. But yeah, Nightfire can get roxul from a local supplier, which is as good as 703, to make absorption panels.

 

[Nightfire]

Homestudio guy, I cant buy from the States cause by the time it's here I will have paid triple (customs etc. its ridiculous)
Pandamonk, that setup makes sense, I see what I can do as far as shifting things around etc.
I'll get some roxul and make some frames on caster wheels.

Thanks,

Mike