Rock 'n Roll's Forever

[Stevie_M]

Hey guys, new power ballad I've been working on. The song title says it all. Is it moving? Does it have balls? Is the mix quality professional sounding? Curious to know everybody's take on it, good and/or bad!

***VERSE lyrics incomplete - hence the scatting***

Stevie

 

[Stevie_M]

https://soundcloud.com/stephan-mathos/rock-n-rolls-forever3c2

New version, slightly shorter. Would love to hear some reviews of this!

 

[TripleM]

To me, the mix is over-done with effects. They're everywhere - reverb on the drums, chorus on the guitars, echo/reverb on the vocal. Everything is thick with effects. I'd take it all off.

I'd double track the vocal all the way through.

The distorted guitars sound thin and buzzy. Were they amp sims? Or a solid state amp?

The bass sounded OK. You could probably nudge it up a little bit.

The lead guitar sounded like an 80's hair metal band. It was very well played though.

The robot drums sound robotic.

 

[Mr Clean]

The first thing that struck me was the build up at 0.29 turns into an anti-climax when the Chorus starts. I was expecting something heavier and was disappointed.

I agree with TripM with regards to the fx and robotic drums. They're is a lot of stuff crammed into to this. The Axl Rose type vocal as well I didn't fancy much. Sounded very cheesy and cringe worthy.

It's all well played all round but it's very lacking of interest, for me. I got bored with the track before the first verse.

Having said that, I reckon a lot of people would like this. Especially those still sporting mullets and leather/denim jackets, thinking it's still the 80's.

Good job but not my cup of tea. That's my 0.2p worth.

 

[Stevie_M]

Triple, Mr. Clean,

Thanks for the critiques. True with all the effects, but the song just doesn't feel right without those guitar tones. Yes, I recorded using amp sims.

My intent was to make my own guitar tone, with a nod towards the trashiness of Jimmy Page's live sound. I am trying to achieve a "live" feel with this song...like you're listening to this in the arena with a lighter held up, hence a little drum reverb.

I TOTALLY get you with the annoying verse Axl rose vocals. They're actually unrehearsed since the verse lyrics haven't been written yet.

Yes the drums need a little more life. I'm going to fix that. I think they SOUND good though, even if the playing is repetitive. Am I off base with this?

 

[BroKen_H]

This is quite a good example of 70s 80s hair music. Including all the effects. They are pretty well overdone (especially the vocals). As a tribute to the 70s and 80s, you've got something going. Great performance.

 

[Schwarzenyaeger]

Lots and lots of effects. Almost reminded me some 90s experimental rock, not so much an 80s power ballad.
The drums are incredibly inoffensive. Listen to some of those HUGE drum sounds that power ballads have. The gated reverb on snares was a popular trick (listen to the Baywatch theme to hear that)
The lead guitar is completely drowned out in the reverb/delays whatever.
I also don't know why the vocal is panned to the left. The Axl Rose stuff sounds like you're mocking him. Your voice seems to clip at 3:07 when you say "broke up his band".

The chorus melody is nice but not really in the vein of 80s power ballads. It's too dark.

The playing is nice in general but the mix is quite cluttered. Dry it up a bit maybe.

 

[jimistone]

It's not bad, but just like has been said it's washed in reverb and effects. Also, the drums lack presence and punch. I think the performances are good if you dry it up a bit in terms of effects

 

[DogsoverLava]

Your enunciation on the word "Forever" is very problematic --- "Rock n' roll's for- ehhh YA var......" That's not good.

Way too much verb across the track - even for the genre -- drums particularly - cool though -- Did you mix this with headphones?

 

[Stevie_M]

Shwarz, Jimi, DogsoverLava,

I totally get that it's a very "wet" mix with effects, and reverb. You are totally right. I wanted to give the track a live feel type of ambiance - like you've got a lighter raised at the arena. Would you say the track's "wetness" is objectively degrading it, or is it still within the realm of stylistic choice? I mean, does it still sound...cool?

Dogs, my favorite critic, always good to hear from you! I mixed this on a pair of Yamaha nearfields, but with the occasional headphone mixcheck. You're the first person to comment on my vocal annunciation, but you're right. I actually intended the "for-ehhh YA var" because it was the only way to make the syllables fit the pocket! Is anyone else bothered by this?

 

[Schwarzenyaeger]

The syllables didn't annoy me.

It's too wet. It doesn't sound big, it sounds muddy and lost.
Really have a listen to some big 80s songs.

 

[DogsoverLava]

Shwarz, Jimi, DogsoverLava,

I totally get that it's a very "wet" mix with effects, and reverb. You are totally right. I wanted to give the track a live feel type of ambiance - like you've got a lighter raised at the arena. Would you say the track's "wetness" is objectively degrading it, or is it still within the realm of stylistic choice? I mean, does it still sound...cool?

Dogs, my favorite critic, always good to hear from you! I mixed this on a pair of Yamaha nearfields, but with the occasional headphone mixcheck. You're the first person to comment on my vocal annunciation, but you're right. I actually intended the "for-ehhh YA var" because it was the only way to make the syllables fit the pocket! Is anyone else bothered by this?

Hi Steve. I do think that your use of 'verb here does serve to distance the tracks - so if you wanted that verb you'd need to also find away to really make the tracks sound bigger and more upfront - here there's a lack of clarity and power that dilutes the track - I'm thinking Def Lep Hysteria production or Boston 3rd Stage production as a reference... those albums and instruments still sound huge with heavy verb/delay.

As far as singing goes - I've been cutting vocals this past couple weeks for a track I'm developing at .org - and have become very conscious of vowel sounds and vocal articulation - found some issues in my own singing. There's some really good stuff out there on the web that discusses this with some listening exercises and some actually singing suggestions to avoid what are generally considered problematic vowels. For myself I'm trying to avoid sounding like I'm singing in Swedish... I'm not Swedish. The "For -ehhh YA var" sounded Swedish or Danish to me and just pulled me out of the vocal as a listener (but I'm a bit sensitive to that right now because I'm dealing with some of the same stuff myself).

I'm like to know myself how to achieve that heavy verb/powerful tracks mix -- maybe others can suggest some specifics.

 

[Schwarzenyaeger]

Came back here to say that I've had the chorus stuck in my head after listening to the song twice.

It's catchy.

 

[Mickster]

I think the mix is ok except for the vocal track. You wanted a sort of wall of sound kind of thing going on for the instruments and that's fine...........not my taste but not offensive. However........for some reason the vocal processing is just not good. It kills everything else and overpowers any other decent tracks. It rattles around in my head. I'd do it over and keep it a little drier. The drums are so so and could use a little push too. Just my 2 cents. Thanks for the listen!!

 

[Bubba po]

The result of the over-effected mix is that everything sounds incredibly "middly" and thin, with no real weight in the bottom end. Are you aware that the vocal isn't centred? Was that a conscious decision, because it sounds weird to me, especially to have it all the way through.

 

[Stevie_M]

I think the mix is ok except for the vocal track. You wanted a sort of wall of sound kind of thing going on for the instruments and that's fine...........not my taste but not offensive. However........for some reason the vocal processing is just not good. It kills everything else and overpowers any other decent tracks. It rattles around in my head. I'd do it over and keep it a little drier. The drums are so so and could use a little push too. Just my 2 cents. Thanks for the listen!!

The result of the over-effected mix is that everything sounds incredibly "middly" and thin, with no real weight in the bottom end. Are you aware that the vocal isn't centred? Was that a conscious decision, because it sounds weird to me, especially to have it all the way through.

Are you guys referencing the verse vocals with this? Because I just winged the verses and blindly gave them reverb just as a placeholder until my lyricist finishes writing the actual verse vocals. For the CHORUS, do you guys feel the reverb sounds good? I can understand narrowing the verses as per the standard formula (narrow verses, wide choruses).

I checked the mix and all the vocals indicate dead centered. I apply some stereo widening to the vocals, but I personally can't hear any egregious panning going on. Anyone else notice?



I rendered a sample vocal with minimal reverb for comparison...Call me crazy but the dried vocals just don't feel right. They feel narrow and small. Does this minimal reverb sound BETTER to anyone?

 

[NotThatBright]

I checked the mix and all the vocals indicate dead centered. I apply some stereo widening to the vocals, but I personally can't hear any egregious panning going on. Anyone else notice?

Certainly not egregious. It still sounds panned to the left, but I don't find it to be a big deal (I'm listening with earbuds).

I rendered a sample vocal with minimal reverb for comparison...Call me crazy but the dried vocals just don't feel right. They feel narrow and small. Does this minimal reverb sound BETTER to anyone?

The one with minimal reverb sounds better to me, though I may not be your target audience... I don't care for much '80s cock rock, with two exceptions... The Vinnie Vincent Invasion album with "Boys Are Gonna Rock" on it, and the theme song from the movie "Shocker". When I was in junior high I dated a girl who had the soundtrack from Shocker on cassette, which I promptly stole. This song actually sounds like it would fit right on it.

The playing and the singing all sound really good to me. Can't say I'm crazy about the song, but I imagine people into the genre would be.

 

[BroKen_H]

I know some here will say I over advise the use of this technique, but it is effective (especially when experimented with) on making things sound CLEARER, instead of muddier when doing wall of vocals. Google New York compression. Get the technique down and then apply it to EQ and to adding reverb to the voice. If you're doing dual performance and then paralleling a heavily compressed, an over-eq'd and a highly reverbed track (and be careful what order you do them!) to each performance, you get the wall of sound 8 voice strong sound with only a double performance. Each part is mixable into the whole, each part adds it's unique tone.

 

[Bubba po]

I checked the mix and all the vocals indicate dead centered. I apply some stereo widening to the vocals, but I personally can't hear any egregious panning going on. Anyone else notice?

Put some headphones on. The vocal is way over to the left. Unless my headphones are buggered, which I don't think they are.