RNP, Grace 101, Joemeek VC6Q, or VTB1

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Kelsey

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I am trying to set up a basic home recording rig. I'm using an IBM Thinkpad laptop with nTrack, and I've been surprised by the quality of the sound so far. I'm running my electric guitar through a Digitech GNX1 processor into the laptop line-in, using a HOSA cable with 1/4" TS jacks runnning into an 1/8" stereo jack. Now I would like to add a mic preamp to allow more options, including vocals, acoustic guitar, and mic'ing electric guitar amps (small tube combos). The music is mostly blues, but also some rock with blues/country/folk influences.

Which of the preamps listed in the subject line would be most suitable for this application? Is one of them easier to integrate into the setup I've outlined above? Do I need to add a hardware compressor, or will software compression be sufficient (I assume not)?

Thanks for your help.

RMK
 
thats a large price range, from $175/channel to $559/channel.....so of course some are gonna be better.....the Grace 101 and RNP would seem like the better choices, with bang for the buck going to the RNP sice its 2 channels......
 
Upgrade that HOSA cable before you do anything else. :D I think I can hear Bruce's footsteps already. :D
 
OK, so what cable would you recommend? And that still won't help me get a mic signal into my PC, so back to the original question.
 
Kelsey said:
back to the original question.
Click to expand...

I'd go with the Grace. That puppie will hold it's value while the other guys I'm afraid you can expect to be dropping their droors over time. Although the Joemeek just might be the ticket if gritty blues is your thing.
 
Well, I haven't heard the RNP yet, but overall I'd have to go along with the Grace as the best of that bunch. I've got one myself, and use it alongside preamps that cost 5 or 6 times as much. It definitely holds its own in a quiet, uncolored kind of way.

Scott
 
so you guys really think the grace is the shit? Even though it's only one channel, as opposed to the RNP's 2 channels, it's still worth paying double the price for it? It's that much better? (double the price cause they are the same price, but 2 channels instead of 1)
 
ambi, you may or may not be convinced that the Grace is the way to go, but remember that nobody here knows your music, or what your ears tell you is an optimal sound. Only you can answer that.


I'm not saying that asking advice is a waste of time, but if I were you I'd use advice and research to narrow the choice down to two or three units and then figure out a way to borrow or even rent them for a day so you can try them out in your studio with your voice, your guitars, etc. and then evaluate the results with your ears.

It's amazing how many people don't do that. I guess it may be partly economics - if the stuff is cheap enough it may not be worth the time and effort. But when you start spending $1000+ on a piece of gear, i'd definitely want to do some hands on comparisons between competing options.

Kind of like buying a car without test driving it first...

Of course, there are exceptions - sometimes you'll take a chance on a real bargain that might disappear quickly. Like if I saw an LA2A at a garage sale for $500...
 
I agree 100 percent, but unfortunatly i am in Canada. Not only that on an island that has shit for audio.
We have a big new long and mcquade store, but they don't carry much stuff because there isn't a huge market for it. I mean it's not a tiny island or anything, but still. I can go to Vancouver for stuff, but i can't just take a 2 hour ferry ride each way to rent gear for a day.

So i'm very limited. Also gear in Canada is about 1.5 or 2 times as much as it is in the US. I have no fucking clue why, i mean there is no body of water or extra shipping to do.
 
Thanks for the helpful replies. So the Grace 101 is the leader of the pack, with the VC6Q having potential for da bluz. It looks like I can get a VC6Q for under $350, whereas the Grace will cost over $550. I'm willing to go for the gold, but I want a pre that will work well for a blues-based style.

Would a compressor be necessary as an add-on with the Grace?

More important, are there particular mics that work better with one preamp or the other. The mics I'm considering most right now include:

Dynamics: SM57, MD421, SM7b (probably just 2 of the 3 for now).

LD Condensers: AT4033, AT4040, AT4047, BLUE Baby Bottle (just one of these for now).

Again, the main uses are for electric guitar, acoustic guitar, and vocals in blues-based music.

I think that one channel will work for me for now, as I can always add a second one later if necessary.

Thanks again.

RMK
 
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Kelsey said:
....I'm running my electric guitar through a Digitech GNX1 processor into the laptop line-in, :eek: using a HOSA cable with 1/4" TS jacks runnning into an 1/8" stereo jack...
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Er... do you intend to keep using the laptop line in to record through? If you do, don't waste your money on a Grace or anything else for that matter. Consider at least getting some kind of USB or firewire AD/DA interface as a MINIMUM before you get too far down the track. The quality of the convertors in a generic laptop soundcard AND the noisy electrical environment that conversion takes place in, is the almost WORSE THING you can do to your audio bar NONE!! ;)

You may not notice it with a heavily processed electric guitar but with a vocal or acoustic through a Grace you certainly will.

It will be like fitting pram wheels to a Porsche!!
 
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Well, since I don't have a mic preamp, I can't tell how it will sound with a mic, but it sounds good with the direct input from the GNX1 or a CD recorded with nTrack. There is very little background noise or distortion, unlike the soundcard in my office Dell desktop. Mind you, this is not a cheap laptop -- and one advantage of a well-designed laptop is that all wiring is very short. I thought about a USB device like the Aardvark USB3, but I'm leary of the technology, and my tests so far indicate that the internal soundchip in my laptop is OK. What USB device would you recommend?

I understand that there isn't much sense in buying a preamp that is overkill for my application, but I would like something with a future that will grow with me as things progress. With that in mind, would the RNP, VC6Q, or VTB1 make more sense than the Grace? And given a particular recommendation for a preamp, what mics would be most suitable?

Thanks for your help so far -- please keep it coming.

RMK
 
Well if you can afford a Grace AND a good soundcard, microphone, cables, monitors etc then get a Grace.
 
So even though the Grace and the RNP are about the same price, but the grace is only 1 channel, you'd still recomend it?
To have 2 channels of grace it would be DOUBLE the price of 2 channels of RNP, And it's not "cheap" even for a single channel.

If you don't need to do any stereo recordings i guess it's cool. But i hear them both as being very highly regarded. And it doesn't seem that the Grace is THAT much better. It is very very transparant, i hear almost to a fault. What goes in is what you hear. On vocals it will be very unforgiving and very true. I've heard the word "window" used to describe it.
 
I am not the smartest man on mic pres...so I will stay out of that for now.

But for mics.....

Every guitar player MUST own either a 57 or 58. I hapen to like the 58, but most will say 57. I say get a 57. AT makes some good rip-offs. My 58 is called an ATM41a. They are not rip-offs in that they are cheeper, they are the same price. They just have a better frequency responce or something in that they don't mess-up the bass.
 
Grace 101

I have the Grace 101 pre-amp and the AT-4040 LD Condensor Mic. I recently got them and have only had time to do some vocal tests so I don't have any sound clips to share. This is what I noticed when compairing the Grace to my Mackie pres using the AT-4040 in both cases.

I recorded the same vocal passage of a song using both pre-amps with the AT-4040. When I soloed the vocal and did an A/B compairison the differences did not immediately jump out at me, I could tell the Grace had more definition but I was beggining to think that the slight difference wasn't worth the cost. Then I mixed each vocal in with the rest of the song, at this point the difference was very evident. The vocal passage recorded using the Mackie pres, for lack of a better term, just got lost in the rest of the music. On the other hand the Vocal track recorded on the Grace stood out with plenty of definition. It was quite amazing to me, I definately think the Grace is worth the money, but having not heard the RNP I can't say which is better.

I would like to say another thing about the Grace, it is built like a tank. It's heavy, solid metal construction makes me think quality just looking at it.

Hope that helps some
 
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I've used all of these but the Joemeek.

I think the VTB1 is a small step up from the Audio Buddy/Mackie crowd. I think it'd probably get the job done for most home recordists. That said, I have yet to hear a song tracked through one that I've liked.

Here's a review of the VTB1:

www.piemusic.com/mp/vtb1.html

The RNP is impressive as a DI and as a mic preamp. It's got a nice color to it. It's compared favorably to the couple of pro preamps I've been able to compare it to.

Here's a review of the RNP:

www.piemusic.com/mp/rnp.html

I've heard a few projects tracked through it that I love.

The Grace 101 is the thing if you want "realism." It can be a little too real for me at times but it puts a better image in the monitors than the RNP. Even so, we've tracked people through the Grace and then switched over to the RNP because there wasn't a match between source, mic and pre and the end product was better than it would have been through the Grace.

Steve
www.piemusic.com
 
Steve,

Thanks for your reply. It was very helpful. I have already read the reviews you listed, and I found them helpful, too. I have really enjoyed reading the info on your website. THanks for your efforts.

Bob
 
i demoed the grace and i own the RNP.

i would have bought the Grace but i NEEDED to have 2 channels and i couldn't afford the Grace 201.

i also own the tascam 428 USB mixer which i have connected to my dell inspiron 8100. its a great unit that hasn't given me any trouble (since i upgraded to XP SP1) BUT i still wish it had a firewire option because i think the firewire technology is both simpler and better from an architectural implementation standpoint; however, given that the 428 doesn't record more than 4 tracks simultaneously USB vs. firewire doesn't matter.
 
crosstudio said:
i demoed the grace and i own the RNP.

i would have bought the Grace but i NEEDED to have 2 channels and i couldn't afford the Grace 201.
Click to expand...

A pair of Grace 101 mic pres makes more sense for most project studios than a 201. Most of us can live with wall warts, 1/2 rack space and incredibly real sound. For those who want no wall wart, a full rack space and incredibly real sound there is the 201.

Steve
www.piemusic.com
 
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