Review on Mix - Followed some nice opinions here

  • Thread starter Thread starter Johnny Belmont
  • Start date Start date
Great mix!

I don't have too many qualms with it. The production side of it was great. It sounds professional. It would be nice to hear some more harmony in the vocals, especially during the chorus. I hear some harmony parts, but I would add more in the beginning of the song.

Are those drums real? If not, great sound. There are a few parts that sound robotic, but that can also be really tight playing.

It'd be cool if you explained your process (Gear, DAW, Plugins, anything else)
 
Liked the arranging. Liked the recorded sounds. Solid performances.

Really like the part starting at 1:38.

Strongly dislike the forced bluesy grit on the vox. More practice? I'm inclined to think that guys who sing that way well, actually sing that way. I hear a lot of forced copycats...and it's irritating. Everybody wants that vocal sound. But if it ain't real, it's hard to take. I'd like to hear your voice.

I strongly dislike that contemnable, overused, progression that is most of this tune...that Grand Funk 'Heartbreaker' thing. Errrggggg.

Your arranging for texture and dynamics is real good; but y' gotta make some progressive progressions. A little listening and schooling: play some Mozart record.....learn and write the chord progressions in the pieces for a few weeks. That'll fix ya!
 
Liked the arranging. Liked the recorded sounds. Solid performances.

Really like the part starting at 1:38.

Strongly dislike the forced bluesy grit on the vox. More practice? I'm inclined to think that guys who sing that way well, actually sing that way. I hear a lot of forced copycats...and it's irritating. Everybody wants that vocal sound. But if it ain't real, it's hard to take. I'd like to hear your voice.

I strongly dislike that contemnable, overused, progression that is most of this tune...that Grand Funk 'Heartbreaker' thing. Errrggggg.

Your arranging for texture and dynamics is real good; but y' gotta make some progressive progressions. A little listening and schooling: play some Mozart record.....learn and write the chord progressions in the pieces for a few weeks. That'll fix ya!

Hi! Thanks for the "really honest" critique. That's what I wanna hear, good advices. So, I'm not really a singer, to be honest. I'm a Guitar Player. I mean, I used to sing Melodic and Heavy Metal, and done some backing vocals in Pop Rock bands. I just followed this path, because it's been hard finding musicians that wanna play self-made songs, not covers. So, I decided: I'm gonna do a whole Pop album by myself first, then I'm gonna find some people to play with, make a "band", and with the recorded stuff, try to find some managers, etc. This is the second song of this home-made "album", and I'm recording the third. If you go again to the link: http://www.soundclick.com/johnnybelmont , you'll see that I put my first song there. The first song (Bruna) is better, but I think you'll see an improve on the quality of recording and mix on the second song (Wake Up), comparing to the first.
That being said, it's true: I need to practice more, on Vocals, IF I really choose to sing. I think I haven't really found my "natural voice" yet, ironically. Thanks for complements or arranging, mix, etc. I wanted this song to be "simple" in chords, and have a more elaborated arranging. A Pop Rock song, with some Metal flavors. I mean, the song has the same chord progression all along, with a variation on first pre-chorus, then back to the same stuff, and only changes in the fast part that leads to solo. I just didn't understand what do you mean with "progressive progressions", or "Grand Funk 'Heartbreaker' thing". What I understood, is that I've got to make some changes in chords, not use the same stuff all along. Is that it? Can you tell me a bit more about it?

Thanks!
 
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I'd say about half the original songs posted here have that progression in it. It's like a default thing, when the creator needs some chords, but doesn't hear anything.

It'd be A- / G / F / E7...in A-.

I think, first, that you should really tell yourself that there's music playing in your head...and learn to listen for it, and capture it , before it slips away.

Chordal progressions are beautiful things. They are the underpinning to all or any emotion and impact in a song. The classical composers were absolute masters of the art of uniting and crafting interesting and emotive chord movement....leaving the listener to guess the next chord half the time, and throwing a curve the other half. [as all interesting composition does....a psychological thing, dealing with a happy medium between frustration [listener never guesses right] and boredom [listener always knows what chord will follow]

Without knowing all the formulas, conventions, theory, and assorted science of tone organization, I think you can fast-track your mind into hearing more progression possibilities, when composing, by listening to, and simply identifying chords-of-the-moment in classical pieces. It opens the ears. And from your piece, which is creatively arranged, I'd say it's a weakness that, if worked on, would drastically improve what you arrange. "Progressive progressions" : not boring....tripping up the expectations of the listener sometimes. Like Mozart, and others.

[classical listening...Bach, Mozart...is a great way to absorb the art of composition and arranging. Listen attentively for use of dynamics, unison, harmony, texture, melody....not just hear it, but listen and catalog in your mind. Round out the effort by listening to big band jazz...pop of all types........metal...anything....and listen for the same concepts used in everything you listen to. They're universal to all music of merit and interest]

I know what you mean by 'finding' your voice'. I played mostly cover music for decades...always inflecting the ways of the original singers. When it came time to sing my own, I'd have to imagine the performer I was duping. Still an effort to find mine. But the forced rasp thing is definitely not your voice. Maybe relax, and stop trying so hard...like you're singing the tune to the fellas as you arrange it at a rehearsal. It'll come...and it will be better than what you try hard to create. Trust youself. You're good enough. Good pitch control, etc.

Gonna listen to your other song....

Rock on!

ps..ever hear of a band call "Yes"??

The players were fantastic. Heavily steeped in classical, jazz, rock, blues; and their songs were showcases of arrangment and progression genuis. The early records..."Yes Album" " Fragile". Wakeman, Bruford, Howe, and the bass guy who I can't name at the moment. Good schooling! Not to copy, but to analyze.
 
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Just listened to the second song. The chords at 1:36 and 2:49, and the dipsy-doodle in the second cycle of the bridge were the only chords I didn't successfully predict in the tune.

Again, interestingly arranged; and, again, some creative changeups in the progressions are the big possibility for kicking your compositions up several notches!
 
Great mix!

I don't have too many qualms with it. The production side of it was great. It sounds professional. It would be nice to hear some more harmony in the vocals, especially during the chorus. I hear some harmony parts, but I would add more in the beginning of the song.

Are those drums real? If not, great sound. There are a few parts that sound robotic, but that can also be really tight playing.

It'd be cool if you explained your process (Gear, DAW, Plugins, anything else)

Hi! Thanks for the good words. I wanted to put more backing vocals, harmonies, thirds, fifths, but I thought: "This song, specially the chorus, is already full of stuff, harmonies in chorus will just make it blurry." In verses, that would be a nice thing, maybe I'll do it.

So, for the process, it'll be a long text, and I can't remember exaclty everything I used, but I'll try to explain it briefly. You were right, drums are not real. As a matter of fact, NOTHING is real, except for all Guitars, and, of course, Vocals. I wanted to see people's reactions, before telling those instruments were VST. I play the Guitar, that's my instrument. I can sing, play bass, and keyboards, but I'm not an expert in those instruments. I put in the same link: http://www.soundclick.com/johnnybelmont , the song I recorded before "Wake Up", named "Bruna". In that song, I played real bass guitar, not Virtual Instrument. If you hear it, you'll see (I think), that I improved the mix from one to another, and see why I chose to use more VST now. I'm far away from having a Top-notch equipment. But I try making the best I can with my poor equip. What I used:

Behringer Xenyx 802 mixer. The audio interface (sound card) used was Creative Audigy. All Guitars and Vocals went through this mixer and then to the audio card. The Daw used was Sony Acid Pro 7.

So, for Vocals:
I used a Shure SM-58 Mic, pluged on mixer, going through audio card. The plugins: Waves De-esser, Waves X-Noise, Trident A-Range, Sony EQ, SPL Vox Ranger, Tube Tech Compressor CL-1B, Stillwell Verbiage Reverb on all vocal tracks, Adverb reverb on more sustained stuff, Nomad BT-Tempo Delay on other sustained vocal stuff. For backing vocals, added Nomad BT-Oilchan Echo and Waves Doubler. On final vocal before fast solo, used Waves Super-Tap and Classic Delay Freeware (KJAERHUS Audio).

For the electric guitars:
I used a fender mexican strato, with a Line 6 Spider II 212 amp. For the pedals, I used a Boss BCB-60, that contains: Boss DD-3 (Delay), Boss CS-3 (Compressor), Boss SD-1 (Overdrive/Distortion), Digitech Metal Master (Distortion), Digitech RP-50 (for tremolo) and Marshall Jackhammer (Overdrive/Distortion). The connection was: Guitar -> Pedals -> Amp -> Mixer -> Sound card. Every Guitar in the song was recorded with Boss CS-3 Compressor pedal already On. Every clean guitar was recorded with the Boss pedal Delay effect already On. For distorted solos, besides Boss Delay e Boss Compressor Already On, I used Boss SD-1 as a booster to Digitech's Metal Master, using four pedals together in chain. On a clean guitar that enters right before song's chorus, I used the RP-50 tremolo's effect. For clean guitar chords (except tremolo), I used Dimarzio Super Distortion and Fender Strato pickups. For Crunch Guitars, I used Dimarzio Super Distortion pickups only. For solo guitars, I used in some, the Dimarzio Super Distortion, and others, HS3 Humbucker pickups. And, for tremolo guitar and the clean solo guitar at the end, I used Dimarzio HS3 Humbucker pickups. All clean guitars and solos were recorded using the Two Speakers out (Left and Right) of the Amp, going into the mixer. Heavy Chord Guitars (Crunch) were recorded differently. I first recorded two channels at the same time, using Boss SD-1, one channel using Shure SM-58 without the ball recording one of the speakers, and the other speaker using the Direct out Line. Then, I recorded two more channels using the same stuff, but now with Marshall Jackhammer. Since my soundcard doesn't have two inputs, I recorded the double guitars, panning on my mixer, one to the left, and the other to the right. Then, in my daw I separated left from right, making four tracks. With these four channels, I mixed each one individually first, using Amplitube X-Gear VST plugin with all packages, chosing four different amps. Then, I put the two first channels and panned all the way left, and put the other two all the way right, making them sound like Two Guitars. After this, just used Sony EQ on them. For other guitars, no virtual amps, the plugins I used: Redline Preamp, Tube Tech Compressor, SPL Twin Tube, SPL Vitalizer, Trident A-Range, SPL Full Ranger, Waves Meta-Flanger (The Phaser on clean guitar verses), Softube Tube Delay (Just on first crunch guitars of the song, that preparates drums), BBE two timer (after final solo), Transiest Shaper (Schaack), BBE Green Screamer, and Sony EQ.

The bass:
I used Reason's Electric Bass Refill (with Fender Precision Finger virtual bass), always Rewiring and making MIDI tracks directly in ACID. Used Amplitube Ampeg SVX package, for Bass. Also used plugins SPL Transiest Designer, SPL Bass Ranger, Sony EQ, Tube Tech CL-1B, Voxengo LF Max Punch, Waves C4.

Acoustic Guitars:
I used the Music Lab Real Guitar VST, making one channel with "Finger" for verses and two different channels with "Pick", for everything else. Other Plug-ins: Voxengo LF Max Punch, Tube Tech, SPL Vitalizer, Trident A-Range, Transiest Shaper, Sony EQ.

Drums and Percussion:
I used EZdrummer, with Pop Rock, Latin Percussion and Drumkit From Hell expansions. For Electronic Stuff, and also the first "bomb" effect on song, I used some Drums that came with Reason. On beginning, there's an Electronic Drum, another phasery drum, and an electronic Cajon, all from Reason. In the first solo after the chorus, and at the end, I used one of the electronic Drums together with EZ Drum, to cause a different effect. Plug-ins: Voxengo LF Max Punch, Transiest Shaper.

Keyboards, Piano, Cellos and Violins:
I used Bome's Mouse Keyboard, with my PC keyboard, and played simulating a Midi Input on the program. The Connection was: My Pc keyboard -> Bome's Mouse Keyboard -> Passing Through Midi Yoke -> and recording Midi on Acid. I used some Vst's: True Piano, Reason Korg Triton Refill, Reason Roland Fantom Refill, Garritan Groffiler Cello, Stradivari Violin. Other Plugins: Stillwell Verbiage, ESP Uni-Q, Waves C4, SPL Vitalizer, Sony EQ.

For mastering, I used the Limiter:
PSP Xenon.

Well, I think this pretty much covers it all. Thanks.
 
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Just listened to the second song. The chords at 1:36 and 2:49, and the dipsy-doodle in the second cycle of the bridge were the only chords I didn't successfully predict in the tune.

Again, interestingly arranged; and, again, some creative changeups in the progressions are the big possibility for kicking your compositions up several notches!

Thanks for all the good advices and insights. I've heard Yes, classical stuff, and lots of classic arrangements in Melodic Metal. But, I've never listened Yes and Classical Music with "paying attention" ears. I'll listen to chord progessions. Thanks!
 
Fabulous arrangement Johhny. The PSP Xenon limiting is a bit much - it's clipping my system, although I guess this is the norm nowadays. I thought the leads in spots could come up/forward a tad they weren't in line with the rest of the tune. But overall I think you've got a pretty decent mix going...:D:):D:):D
 
Fabulous arrangement Johhny. The PSP Xenon limiting is a bit much - it's clipping my system, although I guess this is the norm nowadays. I thought the leads in spots could come up/forward a tad they weren't in line with the rest of the tune. But overall I think you've got a pretty decent mix going...:D:):D:):D

Thanks! I was actually wondering about volume. Maybe I'll turn down a little. What do u mean by "leads in spots"? (vocals? guitar solos? something else?) Sometimes I don't understand some terms, 'cause I'm from Brazil.
 
Hi! Thanks for the good words. I wanted to put more backing vocals, harmonies, thirds, fifths, but I thought: "This song, specially the chorus, is already full of stuff, harmonies in chorus will just make it blurry." In verses, that would be a nice thing, maybe I'll do it.

So, for the process, it'll be a long text, and I can't remember exaclty everything I used, but I'll try to explain it briefly. You were right, drums are not real. As a matter of fact, NOTHING is real, except for all Guitars, and, of course, Vocals. I wanted to see people's reactions, before telling those instruments were VST. I play the Guitar, that's my instrument. I can sing, play bass, and keyboards, but I'm not an expert in those instruments. I put in the same link: http://www.soundclick.com/johnnybelmont , the song I recorded before "Wake Up", named "Bruna". In that song, I played real bass guitar, not Virtual Instrument. If you hear it, you'll see (I think), that I improved the mix from one to another, and see why I chose to use more VST now. I'm far away from having a Top-notch equipment. But I try making the best I can with my poor equip. What I used:

Behringer Xenyx 802 mixer. The audio interface (sound card) used was Creative Audigy. All Guitars and Vocals went through this mixer and then to the audio card. The Daw used was Sony Acid Pro 7.

So, for Vocals:
I used a Shure SM-58 Mic, pluged on mixer, going through audio card. The plugins: Waves De-esser, Waves X-Noise, Trident A-Range, Sony EQ, SPL Vox Ranger, Tube Tech Compressor CL-1B, Stillwell Verbiage Reverb on all vocal tracks, Adverb reverb on more sustained stuff, Nomad BT-Tempo Delay on other sustained vocal stuff. For backing vocals, added Nomad BT-Oilchan Echo and Waves Doubler. On final vocal before fast solo, used Waves Super-Tap and Classic Delay Freeware (KJAERHUS Audio).

For the electric guitars:
I used a fender mexican strato, with a Line 6 Spider II 212 amp. For the pedals, I used a Boss BCB-60, that contains: Boss DD-3 (Delay), Boss CS-3 (Compressor), Boss SD-1 (Overdrive/Distortion), Digitech Metal Master (Distortion), Digitech RP-50 (for tremolo) and Marshall Jackhammer (Overdrive/Distortion). The connection was: Guitar -> Pedals -> Amp -> Mixer -> Sound card. Every clean guitar and distorted solos were recorded with the Boss pedal Delay effect already On. On a clean guitar that enters right before song's chorus, I used the RP-50 tremolo's effect. For clean guitar chords (except tremolo), I used Dimarzio Super Distortion and Fender Strato pickups. For Crunch Guitars, I used Dimarzio Super Distortion pickups only. For solo guitars, I used in some, the Dimarzio Super Distortion, and others, HS3 Humbucker pickups. And, for tremolo guitar and the clean solo guitar at the end, I used Dimarzio HS3 Humbucker pickups. All clean guitars and solos were recorded using the Two Speakers out (Left and Right) of the Amp, going into the mixer. Heavy Chord Guitars (Crunch) were recorded differently. I first recorded two channels at the same time, using Boss SD-1, one channel using Shure SM-58 without the ball recording one of the speakers, and the other speaker using the Direct out Line. Then, I recorded two more channels using the same stuff, but now with Marshall Jackhammer. Since my soundcard doesn't have two inputs, I recorded the double guitars, panning on my mixer, one to the left, and the other to the right. Then, in my daw I separated left from right, making four tracks. With these four channels, I mixed each one individually first, using Amplitube X-Gear VST plugin with all packages, chosing four different amps. Then, I put the two first channels and panned all the way left, and put the other two all the way right, making them sound like Two Guitars. After this, just used Sony EQ on them. For other guitars, no virtual amps, the plugins I used: Redline Preamp, Tube Tech Compressor, SPL Twin Tube, SPL Vitalizer, Trident A-Range, SPL Full Ranger, Waves Meta-Flanger (The Phaser on clean guitar verses), Softube Tube Delay (Just on first crunch guitars of the song, that preparates drums), BBE two timer (after final solo), Transiest Shaper (Schaack), BBE Green Screamer, and Sony EQ.

The bass:
I used Reason's Electric Bass Refill (with Fender Precision Finger virtual bass), always Rewiring and making MIDI tracks directly in ACID. Used Amplitube Ampeg SVX package, for Bass. Also used plugins SPL Transiest Designer, SPL Bass Ranger, Sony EQ, Tube Tech CL-1B, Voxengo LF Max Punch, Waves C4.

Acoustic Guitars:
I used the Music Lab Real Guitar VST, making one channel with "Finger" for verses and two different channels with "Pick", for everything else. Other Plug-ins: Voxengo LF Max Punch, Tube Tech, SPL Vitalizer, Trident A-Range, Transiest Shaper, Sony EQ.

Drums and Percussion:
I used EZdrummer, with Pop Rock, Latin Percussion and Drumkit From Hell expansions. For Electronic Stuff, and also the first "bomb" effect on song, I used some Drums that came with Reason. On beginning, there's an Electronic Drum, another phasery drum, and an electronic Cajon, all from Reason. In the first solo after the chorus, and at the end, I used one of the electronic Drums together with EZ Drum, to cause a different effect. Plug-ins: Voxengo LF Max Punch, Transiest Shaper.

Keyboards, Piano, Cellos and Violins:
I used Bome's Mouse Keyboard, with my PC keyboard, and played simulating a Midi Input on the program. The Connection was: My Pc keyboard -> Bome's Mouse Keyboard -> Passing Through Midi Yoke -> and recording Midi on Acid. I used some Vst's: True Piano, Reason Korg Triton Refill, Reason Roland Fantom Refill, Garritan Groffiler Cello, Stradivari Violin. Other Plugins: Stillwell Verbiage, ESP Uni-Q, Waves C4, SPL Vitalizer, Sony EQ.

For mastering, I used the Limiter:
PSP Xenon.

Well, I think this pretty much covers it all. Thanks.

WOW! Well thanks...
 
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