Recording With Compression........opinions please ??

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Ethan Winer said:
Recording with compression is old school, and these days it's better to record straight and add compression and most other effects later when mixing. In the old days of analog tape, the limited dynamic range required compressing when recording. If a singer got too loud the tape would distort. And if they were too quiet on a soft part and you raised the volume (or added a compressor when mixing), then you'd also raise the tape hiss enough to be bothersome.

These days even 16-bit recording is 20-30 dB quieter than the finest analog tape recorder. So there's no need to compress when recording. As Boulder said it's not outright wrong, but why risk recording a "squashed" sound that can't be undone later? If you want to hear the compression as you record, which is a good idea, simply patch it into the playback path rather than the record path. This gives you the best of both methods: you hear the compression but don't actually commit to it.

--Ethan
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I'm sorry but I disagree with Ethan's statement entirely. I have chosen to continue to record in the analogue domain for years and compression is not used to prevent 'tape distortion'. It is primarily utilised as an insert effect to smooth vocals. Limiting is used, but only in order to prevent clipping at the board, where most distortion occurs. Tape, when over-saturated, results in a physical phenomenon known as tape compression.
 
Just record in as normal then you can controll or adjust the compression afterwards. If you do it on the way in then you cant adjust it later.

Ive never heard of anyone doing that before even in the past.

My advise is to get as hot a signal in as you can without clipping. If you use the compressor as a limiter on the way in to stop clipping then I would advise you to just switch to 24bit recording and turn off the compressor.
 
Recording at 24 bit is NOT going to prevent clipping with hot signals.....bit depth has nothing to do with signal level management.
 
I don't own an outboard compressor but if you do it after it's recorded you don't need to be dissapointed later that you have used to much compression in the recording stage.
 
This has been trudged through, over and over.

2 points:

If someone does not have experience with, nor own quality outboard gear, then you probably should never use compression on the way in.

If you do, and wish to experiment with a good compressor, then by all means, do it. But if you are using it as a limiter, well, you have already failed the first point.

I don't think any experienced engineer is necessarily using a compressor on an input chain, for control of signal level. Not in the digital realm anyway. I wouldn't. It is a character thing, that adds to the performance IMO. Nothing more. Like a preamp that colors the input signal. Same kind of feel....
 
The only things I'll consider compressing while tracking are vocals and snares. To me they are the recording wild cards.
 
Johnny Nowhere said:
I have chosen to continue to record in the analogue domain for years
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Sure, but this discussion is about digital recording in a DAW program.

compression is not used to prevent 'tape distortion'. It is primarily utilised as an insert effect to smooth vocals.
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Compression and limiting (same thing, different degrees) are used as both a tool and an effect. As a tool it prevent overload distortion; as an effect it makes volume levels more uniform and increases sustain on things like bass.

Tape, when over-saturated, results in a physical phenomenon known as tape compression.
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Tape "compression" is a misnomer. It's really distortion, or soft-clipping. Pure compression doesn't add distortion unless both the attack and release times are fast. Tape "compression" always adds distortion. Harmonic distortion isn't necessarily a problem, but whenever you have THD you also have IMD, and the unrelated sum and difference frequencies are not usually wanted.

--Ethan
 
Paralysis by analysis
philbo said:
There are great arguments to be made for both sides of this issue.

One that hasn't been brought up: Limiting your options can be an artistically freeing experience. DAWs have given people unlimited options, allowing decisions to be put off indefinitely, or at least until you eventually forget what the option was. My thinking is that this can kill the groove. At times it is useful to commit to a sound from the beginning and run with it before the artistic urges are buried in the technology.

A lot depends on the hardware you have available too. If you have low-end gear, you might be better off using ITB compression. If you have a great compressor, give it a try & see if it works! Ultimately that is the very best way to see if it works for you and your gear and your client (or your music).

As a number of people mentioned, you can always mult the signal into 2 tracks and only compress one of them, keeping the uncompressed one as a safety copy.
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grimtraveller said:
Sounds like the title of a cool new wave album.............but what does it mean ?
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It means what this thread is doing. 110 posts of differing views and no end result.

The irony is that there doesn't need to be an end result. People can use whatever technique they like. Sometimes it is better to just do it, rather than debate endlessly seeking validation.
 
gecko zzed said:
The irony is that there doesn't need to be an end result. People can use whatever technique they like. Sometimes it is better to just do it, rather than debate endlessly seeking validation.
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Yes...thank you.
That was/is the point I was making in the "24-16 bit..." thread....that looking for and proving some indisputable fact...is almost irrelevant. Just do it...use whatever puts you in your comfort zone.

Awhile back an old forum friend from another website (he sadly passed away a few months ago) who had a lot of studio background and knew his shit, was talking about the whole analog/digital...blah, blah...thing with me, and as I was mentioning my tape SOP, he started with the "Well, I use to, but now I just use a DAW" kind of reply...and then I said something about how tape felt comfortable to me, moreso than anything about sound quality or whatever...and he immediately said, "Ah, I totally get that about staying in your comfort zone".

What works for you is more important than why it works or how it works or how many other things work better for other people...etc...etc....
So...if you like to tab on a little compression while tracking, and you like the result....go for it. :)
 
Nope...try again.
Explain how using 24 bits means you will not clip the input, therefore you don't need a comp....
...that's what you said earlier.

You have to go a little deeper than simply Googling for your answers and your audio knowledge.
 
Firstly i dont know why anyone would compress at the input stage.
I dont know the reason he is. at a guess I would say mybe he thinks it wukk orevent digital clipping or something like that. So if that is hs problem, then sampling at 24 bit will give more headroom, thus the digital clipping wont happen, and he will keep a clean signal. The only advantage to 24 bit recording
 
So, are you claiming that 0dBFS is different in a 24 bit system than it is in a 16 bit system?

Hint: the concept of headroom involves both upper and lower levels....
 
Redlad_ said:
Firstly i dont know why anyone would compress at the input stage.
I dont know the reason he is. at a guess I would say mybe he thinks it wukk orevent digital clipping or something like that. So if that is hs problem, then sampling at 24 bit will give more headroom, thus the digital clipping wont happen, and he will keep a clean signal. The only advantage to 24 bit recording
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Well...you not understanding why anyone would want to use a comp at the input stage is your own limitation, and that by itself doesn't make it a negative approach.

And again...using 24 bits does NOT...NOT...NOT....change the input level, therefore it doesn't prevent clipping.
The difference between 16 and 24 bit is the size of the S/N ratio.
If you send a hot enough signal to a 16 bit converter and clip it....that same signal will also clip the 24 bit converter.
 
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