Recording with a TV present...

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The T

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Okay so bear with me, sorry if this isn't exactly the right website to post this sort of thing, but I figured I'd give it a shot...

I'm trying to do some live commentary of video games with a group of people. We thought the Blue Yeti would be good for picking up a group's audio. However, even on the Cardioid setting... and no matter how much we lower the TV's volume, it picks it up a great deal.

Obviously we need the TV's audio so that we can hear the game we are playing.

I've tried things like hanging a blanket behind us to try to absorb any audio being reflected on the back wall, and putting a box around the microphone, but it doesn't seem to change much. Granted, the box was only cardboard but it was just a small test... I had seen things like "soundproofing" boxes to put around the mic to help, and I wanted to get an idea of if that would have any effect. And I'm guessing not...

Anyone have any thoughts at all on this sort of thing? Was the Blue Yeti just a bad choice? Is there some other choice that would work for this kind of situation?

Thanks at all for any sort of support.
 
Question. What angle do you have the microphone sitting at? Do you have the top pointed straight at the tv or do you have the top pointing straight up into the air. Not trying to suggest anything just trying to start from the basics
 
Straight up into the air, so that the part we're supposed to be talking into is facing us. It's on the Cardioid setting, so it shouldn't be picking up anything from the sides/behind it. And before you ask, yes it is facing the right way! :P
 
Are you willing to spend some money?

I can only see a couple of solutions.

The first is to take the TV output into a headphone splitter and let the players listen on a bunch of closed cap headphones.

The other is to ditch the Yeti entirely (and using a single cardioid mic in an untreated room to pick up multiple sources is likely doomed to failure anyway) and let the "inverse square law" work for you. Get as many cheap over-ear cardioid headset mics as you need up nice and close to the players mouths, then into a cheapie Behringer mixer. I know there are some very inexpensive over ear mics out there but have no personal experience of that end of the market.

Or, for best results, combine the two ideas.
 
So these would be microphones that go on your head but don't actually have headphones attached to them? I guess it is an idea...

My biggest reason for going with this is that I A. didn't want to deal with the trouble of buying/using a mixer, and that I didn't want to have to wear headphones while doing the recording, since it makes talking to each other feel sort of unnatural, when you're hearing someone (and potentially yourself?) in your headphones. Plus they definitely get uncomfortable after long stretches of time.

The personal use earless mics might help with that but it also seems... I don't know.

The other side of it is I'd really rather not go through the trouble of returning the Blue Yeti if it can be avoided.
 
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<Puts on best Scotty voice> I cannae change the laws of physics, captain.

A single cardioid mic is not the best tool for recording a bunch of people sitting away from it, even without the TV and even if your room was acoustically treated. The Yeti is designed to give best results from a single angle and maybe a foot away from the mic. (Or for things like choirs in a nice environment of course.)

Add in the problem of the TV noise and you'll either have to compromise on quality or on your methodology. If the headphone idea works for you, don't forget you can get single cup headphones or just push one side back to hear each other. You'll still have the problem of people being "off mic" though unless you sit on each other's laps.

You have the wrong tools for the job and no amount of mincing words is going to change your hammer into a saw.
 
Are there ANY sorts of room microphones at all that would be suited for this, in terms of picking up sound from one area but not picking up to the TV background? To be honest, I'm not SUPER picky on having it be super high quality audio, really...

Failing that, any suggestions for a cheap over-ear mic that I could preferably use without having to do the TV-out-to-headphones option?

And by the way, thanks so much for this!
 
The T said:
Are there ANY sorts of room microphones at all that would be suited for this, in terms of picking up sound from one area but not picking up to the TV background?
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Not really. A directional mic's rejection of sound happens most strongly at exactly the angle specified (180° for a cardioid pattern) but it drops off away from that angle. The rejection only applies above some cutoff frequency. Since much of the TV's sound is bouncing off the ceiling and walls it finds its way into the front and sides of the mic anyway. About the best you can do with any mic in the room like that is to reduce the bleed somewhat.

Reducing distance is the solution, either from the speaker to the ear (headphones) or from the mouth to the mic (headset mics).
 
So I guess going back to my original concern; would creating some kind of soundproofed box (like this: harlanhogan.com/images/portaboothFullFront.jpg ) have any effect on at least dampening the bouncing a little bit? It doesn't have to be perfect; it just has to be good enough that, if we are talking that the TV audio is more or less drowned out by our talking, and when we aren't talking it has to be low enough that it could easily be noise gated. (My first recording had issues where the TV was as loud as us sometimes...)

And as far as a mixer goes... I'm totally clueless on where to even begin with a mixer/how to buy one/what to look for/how they work. So if anyone has any suggestions there too...
 
I would get a headphone splitter amp (Behringer makes a good one for like $20) and a bunch of iPod earbuds with 3.5mm to 1/4" TRS adapters. that way it wouldn't sound super weird talking to one another and you'd still be able to use the Yeti. That's honestly your best bet.

That box you're thinking about building isn't a terrible idea, but I think it'd be a bit awkward trying to get everyone to be picked up by it. I'm assuming there's more than 2 of you, and if you had a box like that you'd all more-or-less have to be able to see the mic to be picked up adequately. Granted you could put it farther away closer to the tv but then the tv might be picked up more. I still say go with my recommendation!
 
Ehh, I don't like the earbud ideas just because I find them extremely uncomfortable to wear. I'm also assuming that, this idea would be just to have the game audio go in the earbuds while we just try to talk loud to hear each other? Not super ideal...

As far as getting everyone around the box... 3 people can definitely fit on the couch that it sits in front of, so really putting the loudest person a bit off to the side, to me, doesn't seem like it would affect much. I guess I am more worried that it isn't going to dampen the sound as much as I want it to, and that it will have been a waste of money...

So I'm really learning towards personal mics for everyone at this point. I am so lost with buying an amp though. They mostly seem really expensive and don't have the kind of inputs on them I need, I think? I don't know...
 
I tried something like that and it did not give the desired quality level...

Any suggestions back on the headsets and mixer alternatives?
 
The T said:
Ehh, I don't like the earbud ideas just because I find them extremely uncomfortable to wear. I'm also assuming that, this idea would be just to have the game audio go in the earbuds while we just try to talk loud to hear each other? Not super ideal...

As far as getting everyone around the box... 3 people can definitely fit on the couch that it sits in front of, so really putting the loudest person a bit off to the side, to me, doesn't seem like it would affect much. I guess I am more worried that it isn't going to dampen the sound as much as I want it to, and that it will have been a waste of money...

So I'm really learning towards personal mics for everyone at this point. I am so lost with buying an amp though. They mostly seem really expensive and don't have the kind of inputs on them I need, I think? I don't know...
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There's like a billion different sets of earbuds, so I'm sure you would find at least one pair comfortable. But it seems to me like you are quite set on the box, so do the box.

Personal mics would be better but I took it that you didn't want to spend a whole lot. As for "buying an amp," what are you talking about? Do you mean an audio interface?
 
Er whoops. Yeah I meant mixer, not amp, which I guess would be the same as an audio interface?

I've looked around online and Everything I find about mixers is totally confusing. I have no idea what half the input formats on them area, and they just aid it has "6 inputs" without really going into any detail at all.

And similarly for the earsets. The 1 or 2 cheap ones I could find have weird adapter formats, and I can't find any others that aren't several hundred dollars.
 
You may be stuck with headphones for each member of your group. It has been said already that you cannot change physics to make this work.

If you have an audio output from the gaming machine/TV you are playing on, you could route that to a mixer that you are using to record to as well. Sorry, but until you make a judgement call as to what you are willing to do here, there is not much more to offer.

Any given mic will not fix the situation. Headset mics might help, but you will still need a mixer for multiple people. Then you need to get them all into an interface that is capable of getting it all together. Not going to be cheap in any case.


CHEAP: If your TV has a headphone output or audio output of some kind, then just run a headphone amp that will send to each guy. Then use the mic you have without the TV messing with your sound. Otherwise you are looking at a bunch more investment into playing video games.
 
Hi, yes, I've read the other people's posts in the thread who have already said the same things and I definitely understand it already.

I am at the point now where I need information on how to buy a mixer, and why the listings for mixers are so confusing and hard to read, what I'm looking for when I buy one, etc. as well as buying earset microphones. Most of my experience with headsets are the USB kind, so I don't know even what formats I should be looking for/why there are different formats.

The reason your "CHEAP:" method above won't work, as I've mentioned, is if we are routing the game audio into our ears, we can't hear each other.
 
That is where a mixer would give you the ability to have the 'tv/game' audio available to you, while giving you the ability to choose what audio you send. Again, this is not necessarily a cheap endeavor.

I am not sure that I am the one to give you direct options, as this is not something I am familiar with. I don't wish to give advice I am not competent in giving. :)
 
The T said:
Hi, yes, I've read the other people's posts in the thread who have already said the same things and I definitely understand it already.

I am at the point now where I need information on how to buy a mixer, and why the listings for mixers are so confusing and hard to read, what I'm looking for when I buy one, etc. as well as buying earset microphones. Most of my experience with headsets are the USB kind, so I don't know even what formats I should be looking for/why there are different formats.

The reason your "CHEAP:" method above won't work, as I've mentioned, is if we are routing the game audio into our ears, we can't hear each other.
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I can't help you with the earset mics, but I can tell you you don't need a mixer. You're going to want to buy an audio interface instead, which will let you record the mics and tv all as separate tracks and balance them later. Most likely the mics you'll end up getting will have XLR, so look for a good audio interface with at least 3-4 XLR inputs (or however many you see yourself expanding to in the future), 1 TRS or RCA input (for the game sound), and you'll be good to go. I'd personally recommend getting a Tascam us-800, which has 6 combo jacks (meaning XLR or TRS input) on it. Unfortunately Tascam no longer produces them as of the last year or so, but you should be able to get a good deal on a used one. I'm looking at one on Ebay right now that's Buy It Now for $140. Seems a little high to me though.
 
The T said:
The reason your "CHEAP:" method above won't work, as I've mentioned, is if we are routing the game audio into our ears, we can't hear each other.
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I'm sorry but every day many thousands of people in broadcasting with an earbud or headphone in/on one ear and the other either not pushed in/put on or a specialist bit of gear with only one ear anyway. It's not the problem you make it out to be. You could mix and match earbuds and headband/closed cup headphones with a headphone splitter depending on personal preference.

If you do this and keep trying to use the Yeti, the key thing is to get the mic as close to everyone as possible while maintaining an even distance...AND keep everyone in front of the mic. As soon as you move to the side or back of the mic, pick up is greatly reduced.

The personal mics and mixer solution would still be best but I'm backing away from it a bit since you have no experience with even simple mixers. I'm also hedging slightly on the mics because I could find you some in the UK but don't know what's available in the US.
 
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