Recording tone test

J

jordanstreet

New member
I just finished up an acoustic song
https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=314535

and am getting to work on a new project this time with a heavier feel and I've put in some time to try and get a good tones on all the instruments before I start recording. This is a sample of the song, i quickly layed down a section so I could have something to manipulate.

thoughts please :)
 

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  • jvm tone 2 (effects).mp3
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Hey man, two things on your mix:

1. Get rid of those drum samples, they sound too muffled and lifeless. If you want to have a killer song, spend some time programming MIDI with pencil, note by note, modifying the attack and release velocity as well as the quantization to have more swing and not a robotic track. I hear hi-hat to the left, is that what you intended? That means you're mixing the drums from the drummer perspective... not my style, I really prefer to hear the hi-hat to the right and the ride cymbal to the left along the low toms. Just personal taste.

2. Lead guitar tone is great, and I like the melodic approach. What is not working is the panning from the other guitars. Try panning hard right and hard left both rhythm guitars. if you feel that they're too apart, have a send from the track and pan it next to center to have a "ghost" track going on, just to cover some of the audio spectrum.

That's it, hope it helps.
 
Hey man thanks!

In regard to the drums, yeah I just threw in a random loop I had, I didn't really put in any time with it but I will do that and reupload it so you can judge better. And also yes I decided to mess with panning so I'm like well why not just set it up like a kit lol. I'm not sure if this is what you meant but I from the listeners perspective (in front of the kit) the hi hat would be on the right with the ride on the left like you said.

Thanks in regard to the lead tone. For the rhythm, I double tracked the part and panned them 55, 55 I believe. You think wider? Also in the final version I would play the rhythm part on the lead track at the beginning so you can actually hear it. Or are you referring to the rhythm parts including when the lead is over it?

I'll give what you were saying a try and reupload it.

Thanks for the tips man its much appreciated!
 
okay heres an update, I redid the drum parts and for the guitars I panned them harder (75 each) and added a pre-pan send to each which is on another track I have it in the middle turned down. I also eqed each of the 2 rhythm tracks inversely to a small degree to add some more variation
 

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  • jvm tone 2 take 2.mp3
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"Listener's perspective" is bullshit. There is no listener's perspective. The true listener's perspective is all drums centered in mono. From the audience, you don't hear the hats or ride from the right or left. They just come from the middle of the stage. Same with the toms and crashes. That sounds dumb on a recording though, so pan the hats and ride to opposite sides and be done with it. It doesn't matter which side you put them on. The only real perspective is the drummer's perspective because he's the only one that will hear the seperation from right to left. I personally prefer mixing using the "drummer's perspective" because I'm a drummer and that's how I hear it. But what about left handed drummers? Their "drummer's perspective" is the typical "listener's perspective", so what then? That's why it doesn't matter.

Your mix sounds okay. Guitars sound great. The lead could be a little cleaner in the low mids. The drums are robotic, but that's what you get with samples. They don't sound too bad though. Humanize them.
 
Thanks Greg I took all your advice in and made some appropriate modifications. I redid the drum kit too. Before I didn't really notice but SSD had like 2 snares and 2 bass drums going which imo made things a bit muddy. I created a kit from scratch which I think clears things up a good amount. I also humanized the pattern like you said. I guess I thought since it was from an actual drummer recorded through midi I wouldn't have to but it def helped some. Also I added some impulses on the guitars which I think give them a bit more definition. I'll reupload tonight for comments thanks again!

Dave, the speaker emulated output from my JVM205H is the core of the sound and I just slightly modified it with a little eq/compression. Also I added a bit of delay and reverb. Like I mentioned before I just added some IRs so youll hear the update soon.

Have a nice day all
 
Greg_L said:
(...)From the audience, you don't hear the hats or ride from the right or left. They just come from the middle of the stage. Same with the toms and crashes.(...)
Click to expand...

Greg, you have a point; being a drummer is another story, you know your stuff but.. my mind drives crazy when I hear hi-hat on the left, is like, "what's going on"? Besides that, remember that the panning of the different kit pieces respond to the fact that we need to assign each piece a space on the sound spectrum. A "mono" drum kit can sound great on a live situation but in a CD, it simply don't work.
 
killthepixelnow said:
Greg, you have a point; being a drummer is another story, you know your stuff but.. my mind drives crazy when I hear hi-hat on the left, is like, "what's going on"? Besides that, remember that the panning of the different kit pieces respond to the fact that we need to assign each piece a space on the sound spectrum. A "mono" drum kit can sound great on a live situation but in a CD, it simply don't work.
Click to expand...

I agree. I didn't tell him to go mono. I said....."The true listener's perspective is all drums centered in mono.......They just come from the middle of the stage......That sounds dumb on a recording though" My point was whichever side you put the hats on is fine. It doesn't matter at all. There is no right way to do it.

Still, the reason fake drums sound so fake is because they're too isolated. You never in real life hear a crash or hats all by themselves way to one side or the other. Crashes and splashes happening all over the stereo field with no bleed over whatsoever are a dead giveaway of programmed drums. Don't go crazy with drum/cymbal panning and it'll sound more real.
 
Alright I listened to the guitars again this morning and didn't like the impulses on the sound. I even took the preamp out of the head and tried them on that which would make more sense but still couldn't get anything sounding all that great. I feel as though I'm not going to be happy untill I mic the darn thing.

So here is an update with just the drums changed really
 

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