recording schools

  • Thread starter Thread starter MCreel
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bennychico11 said:
I am one of those "school trained" guys that got a job a month or two right after school. I'm a Full Sail grad. And everyone I know who I went to Full Sail with also has jobs in the recording world.
So many people believe the old "everyone starts out as an unpaid intern fetching coffee," and I guess in some places it does hold true. But not always. Truthfully, people hire you on more because of your personality than your experience...experience is just a bonus. I know many people who don't get jobs anymore or get talked badly about because clients don't get along with them. Doesn't matter how long they've been in the business, your personality comes across more importantly.

If you and someone else are being interviewed for the same job, and you have the same determination, same personality....but YOU have gone to school and learned on the latest SSL console and know Pro Tools like the back of your hand, two things that the studio has...and the other person knows absolutely nothing about recording, who are they going to choose? True, a lot of studios don't have the room for new employees, that's just the business lately....but studios have to hire people at one time or another. One out of 5 studios might be hiring. I lucked out and found the one that did. In fact, the engineer I replaced told my boss that I had the knowledge and everything, just not the experience and my boss said "well, that he can learn as he goes." He figured that if I had enough smarts paired together with what I learned at school, that I could easily learn from situations that I came across on the job. And all of a sudden I became the audio engineer here.

So don't talk this bullshit that it can't happen, because it can. The old school mentality is that the only way to break in the business is to intern or spend lots of money on gear and teach yourself. But many people don't have the money to spend on gear (or don't do very well learning on their own) and would prefer someone who has 20+ years experience in the industry and the gear already there for them...to teach them.

A lot (almost all) of the schools do teach you experience. In fact they can teach you some of your first moments in recording. We were put through troubleshooting scenarios, we had bands come in and we recorded them, we had mixing sessions, we did ADR, foley and created sound effects for movies...we had actual lab tests where the instructors fucked something up on purpose so we could figure out what was wrong. All of this can and does happen in schools, and they still are considered just a trade school where you learn the basics to go out in the real world. I've known guys who've interviewed for jobs where the person interviewing them said "oh, I see you worked with an Amek console at school...we're installing one here next month, would you like to help us install it?" BAM, instant in.

MCreel-
If you do the school thing, and try and find a job out there...there will be these people out there that will snub their noses at you when they've seen you've gone to school. They'll think you're just some know it all punk kid and it'll be up to you to prove them wrong or to find another company who doesn't mind someone with already hands on and technical knowledge. You'll get both in school and I don't see one downside to that.
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Fullsailor? What did you think of Juan "Pericles" Covas for session? Also, I can never remember that guy's name in RMC. Well one of the lab guys anyway.

Tall guy, long white hair. Looks like a roadie for white snake. Good times, man.


I don't know, you might of had a different era than me. I guess I belong to the "newer" edition of Fullsail. Still, that experience goes without saying.

And only a fullsailor could relate to another. Kinda like the marines. :D
 
LeeRosario said:
Fullsailor? What did you think of Juan "Pericles" Covas for session? I can never remember that guy's name in RMC. Well one of the lab guys anyway.

Tall guy, long white hair. Looks like a roadie for white snake. Good times, man.


I don't know, you might of had a different era than me. I guess I belong to the "newer" edition of Fullsail. Still, that experience goes without saying.

And only a fullsailor could relate to another. Kinda like the marines. :D
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lol, I can't for the life of me think of who you're taklin' about :D
But I don't think I ever had a guy by that name. For session I had some short, young guy with a pony tail. Seemed pretty knowledgeable, but he was such a tool I couldn't stay awake in his class.

They've probably switched around guys since then. I barely remember any of the teachers' names anymore. But I think for RMC I had a guy named Howie. I'm not sure if he's there anymore. A lot of the students talked shit about him, I think mainly because everyone in the class tried to cheat on the final, got caught and flunked....but I found him to be a rather brilliant guy. Knew his shit and helped me many times over.


Let's see if you get this one, fellow marine....
are you a MIDI ninja yet?
:D ;)


---edit----
Oh wait, tall guy with white hair...glasses? Has a nose that kinda makes him look like a bird? Is that guy still there teaching labs?? Wow. If that's the same guy, I totally remember him. We used to call him bird man. Yeah, I never liked him.
 
bennychico11 said:
Let's see if you get this one, fellow marine....
are you a MIDI ninja yet?
:D ;)
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OH hell no. I had Steve Kane (really short tennesee guy) for Midi and completely clicked my teeth that month. I don't even rank close to cook in my MIDI skills.

I'm not gonna lie, I love sounds, but if I had to do what they do in MIDI everyday...I might as well do a part time as a heart surgeon. :D

At least that's how it's always felt to me. Oh, and if by Howie you mean tall chubby Howie? I remember having a Howie for Multimedia audio. The Tim Allen grunts would give him away. :eek:

Man, small world (or maybe homerecording gets alot more play than I thought :D)
 
Well I don't think I'd be anywhere near an SSL if I wasn't in school. I also don't think I'd be actually making a little money engineering if it wasn't for the connections I made at school. The year is looking promising for me I may even have some major clients this year. Thanks Houston Community College. :D
 
OH hell no. I had Steve Kane (really short tennesee guy) for Midi and completely clicked my teeth that month.
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Oh Steve Kane. I think he's in charge of the MIDI department. I never really knew him. Is the guy still there that teaches being a MIDI ninja pimp? He's a short dude (again, bad with names) who does high kicks....that and a friend of his who I think was his roomate at the time, tall guy, longish hair...I think his name was Jeremy but I'm probably wrong. He was a bad ass pianist and I caught some of his shows while I was down there.

Oh, and if by Howie you mean tall chubby Howie? I remember having a Howie for Multimedia audio. The Tim Allen grunts would give him away. :eek:
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hmmm, not sure if it's the same guy. He was kinda chubby, and had redish hair. Glasses too.

Man, I really need to work on my memory problems :confused: :o


Man, small world (or maybe homerecording gets alot more play than I thought :D)
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This is a pretty popular site. Although, it's odd that no one I know from my class is on here. I actually came across this site while I was down there.
Another HR member, jonhall5446 told me he was starting there soon.
 
bennychico11 said:
Oh Steve Kane. I think he's in charge of the MIDI department. I never really knew him. Is the guy still there that teaches being a MIDI ninja pimp? He's a short dude (again, bad with names) who does high kicks....that and a friend of his who I think was his roomate at the time, tall guy, longish hair...I think his name was Jeremy but I'm probably wrong. He was a bad ass pianist and I caught some of his shows while I was down there.



hmmm, not sure if it's the same guy. He was kinda chubby, and had redish hair. Glasses too.

Man, I really need to work on my memory problems :confused: :o




This is a pretty popular site. Although, it's odd that no one I know from my class is on here. I actually came across this site while I was down there.
Another HR member, jonhall5446 told me he was starting there soon.
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We got a hit! Steve is definitely heading up the MIDI department these days. The ninja isn't there, which is why I didn't completely catch on. BUT, there's this Alec guy that I'm sure equals his value.

You'd know him once you hear the "CHICKI POW POW" and "SHNONRONS". Also, he always showed up with a questionable metal thermist every morning. Some say coffee, others vodka, yet others said the devils blood. haha.

Well hey man, don't be a stranger. erosarioaudio@hotmail.com is a really good way to keep in touch (plus a good start). Also, I'm on here pretty occasionally. And if your friend ever needs help with the area, curiculum, whatever....send his ass my way. :)
 
LeeRosario said:
You'd know him once you hear the "CHICKI POW POW" and "SHNONRONS". Also, he always showed up with a questionable metal thermist every morning. Some say coffee, others vodka, yet others said the devils blood. haha.
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hahaha, that's him!! I totally remember the shnonrons now. Looks like he's gotten rid of the MIDI Ninja Pimp philosophy. Dude was a MIDI tech for Mary J Blige when she was on road. Cool guy.
:)

Thanks for the addy, I'll hit you up sometime.
Peace
 
Ford Van said:
I can assure you that recording school is NOT going to teach you a bit about fixing problems you will encounter while tracking/mixing.

If you want your best shot at a job in a recording studio, go to school to be a bench tech! Seriously, every studio can use an in-house electronics guy to troubleshoot and fix stuff.

No matter how much schooling you have in recording, you will still have to start out as an apprentice. As an apprentice, you will never touch the console, except to pick up coke cans and coffee cups, and maybe zero it out after a mix. You will seldom do anything more than move a mic a few millimeters, wrap up cables, fetch drinks for the engineer/artist, be the gofer for lunch/dinner, and have to clean up the puke in the bathroom (if you are lucky) from the lead singer. If you are really lucky, you might get to drive the hookers back to their place! ;)

Seriously, I am not talking out my ass about this. The studio I work at turns down at least 1 request a week for people that want to apprentice for free! We are too small to deal with that crap (we tried...it just doesn't work out so well).

Your best experience in recording will be to buy gear and use it. This isn't rocket science by any means. To learn how to be a good engineer, you simply have to engineer! You WILL NOT engineer much going the school route.

Most of the job of the engineer is making decisions. Decide where in the room to set up this instrument. Decide which mic will achieve the production sound the producer (who might be you!) wants on that instrument. Decide if that instrument sounds the way it needs to so you can achieve the production sound you are after. Decide if little problems in the tracking are going to hurt the production down the road. Decide if a certain preamp/compressor should be used. Decide if something NEEDS eq or not, and which eq, and how to eq it.

On and on and on the decisions go. There are VERY FEW "rules of thumb" in audio, because each band is different, and what you need to do to achieve a great sound for them changes with the artist. ONLY experience will guide you! Simply, you have to mess up a lot of audio before you can start being able to approach a production and get it right in the beginning.

School will teach you NONE of that. I know so many "school trained" engineers that can't get a job because they can't produce results, because they lack real world experience! There is little you will learn in school that will make you a good engineer, and what little they do teach that will help you is easily learned on your own through reading and/or experimentation.

Again, your money will be spent MUCH better buying decent gear than throwing it away at a school.
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Yes there are some crappy programs out there, but not all of them suck. There are a number of very good programs.

I'm about a month away from graduating from a 2 year AAS program, and would have never done it any other way. Just from the freelance gigs I've picked up now because of that, I'm doing OK and not out of school yet.

From day one you are in one of the 10 on-site studios, working on real world situations, with engineers and producers who are very much still working in the industry. Most have at least a gold record to their name.

They teach you the nuts and bolts of recording at first, and after that is straight recording and mixing on your own. From the amazing gear I've been able to use there, I have been able to walk into any studio in this town and operate the room without an assistant.

If I had just dumped all of that money into a Pro Tools rig and some hardware, I'd still be sitting in my living room tinkering around with it, and having no idea how to run a large room.

If school isn't your thing, that's cool. However, the right program can give someone a huge head start.
 
You'd know him once you hear the "CHICKI POW POW" and "SHNONRONS". Also, he always showed up with a questionable metal thermist every morning. Some say coffee, others vodka, yet others said the devils blood. haha
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Oh dear god...FullSailers...I didn't know any of us hung out on this board. when did you all graduate? what are you all doing in the industry now?
 
...

I graduated from Berklee College of Music (Boston, not related to Berkley, CA)

I can tell you that I learned alot while there. You benifit from gigging around town, in addition to class time. It's a fantastic college, worth it for the experience gained. You do learn how to troubleshoot and how to operate in a professional way. The biggest thing is the contacts. With people like John Massenberg, Victor Wooten, etc. around, you can promote yourself through networking.

Then intern somewhere, or just intern if school isn't your thing. If you don't know your way around a studio it will be hard, but possible as long as you ask questions. I hate answering intern questions sometimes, but I remember that they need to learn. Keep a level head about it.

It's amazing what you can learn in Nash, NYC, or LA at a studio. They all want interns, so being one isn't hard, staying one can be. Work hard and you'll do well. :D :D :D
 
Blue Groove said:
I graduated from Berklee College of Music (Boston, not related to Berkley, CA)

I can tell you that I learned alot while there. You benifit from gigging around town, in addition to class time. It's a fantastic college, worth it for the experience gained. You do learn how to troubleshoot and how to operate in a professional way. The biggest thing is the contacts. With people like John Massenberg, Victor Wooten, etc. around, you can promote yourself through networking.

Then intern somewhere, or just intern if school isn't your thing. If you don't know your way around a studio it will be hard, but possible as long as you ask questions. I hate answering intern questions sometimes, but I remember that they need to learn. Keep a level head about it.

It's amazing what you can learn in Nash, NYC, or LA at a studio. They all want interns, so being one isn't hard, staying one can be. Work hard and you'll do well. :D :D :D
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Thanks. I'm actually heavily looking into Berklee. Its expensive, but its actually less than I'd pay in OOS tuition for comparitively second rate schools like Mid Tenn State Univ. and such.
 
MCreel

The only thing that sucks is the 20" of snow in an hour thing. :rolleyes:
What major are you looking at?
 
Vocal performance. mostly. I figure I could move to LA or NY and start "paying my dues" but that might take many many years where as at Berklee or another music school I could get instruction and education and make contacts and very possibly have a gig right out of school if not sooner.

Since I'm already a degreed college grad I'm talking to admissions about if some of my classes would be accepted for credit and then that might free up some more time for me to do a major or a minor of some sort in the recording/sound engineering program.
 
Vocal Performance?.....There are MANY schools for that. I went to the School of the Arts and Lees-McRae, but Purchase in NY has a phenomenal program. westminster choir college is another great one!....And Belmont...UNC-G,

(I have a voice degree too)

Teddy
MCreel said:
Vocal performance. mostly. I figure I could move to LA or NY and start "paying my dues" but that might take many many years where as at Berklee or another music school I could get instruction and education and make contacts and very possibly have a gig right out of school if not sooner.

Since I'm already a degreed college grad I'm talking to admissions about if some of my classes would be accepted for credit and then that might free up some more time for me to do a major or a minor of some sort in the recording/sound engineering program.
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BigRay said:
Vocal Performance?.....There are MANY schools for that. I went to the School of the Arts and Lees-McRae, but Purchase in NY has a phenomenal program.

(I have a voice degree too)

Teddy
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Yeah but not a ton that I'm real interested in going to.. Most of the collegiate vocal performance degrees are rooted in classical/operatic style.

My undergrad is from UNT. Can't get much better than that for music. But I didn't want to do voice there because the program for voice isn't as exceptional as the jazz instrumental programs are, and its not modern enough.
 
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