Spinney Lainey
New member
The thing is - I only have a ribbon mic at present but was thinking of buying a condenser in order to do this, so just weighing up whether it's worth buying a new mic......
The thing is - I only have a ribbon mic at present but was thinking of buying a condenser in order to do this, so just weighing up whether it's worth buying a new mic......
S
simmerin
New member
Recording flute
I'm a flute player and have done a lot of recording over the years in a variety of music. I've found that a close mic, I use condensors, just above the mouthpiece works best. I then use effects and EQ if needed to blend it into the mix.
I'm a flute player and have done a lot of recording over the years in a variety of music. I've found that a close mic, I use condensors, just above the mouthpiece works best. I then use effects and EQ if needed to blend it into the mix.
kip4
Well-known member
Hi Lainey.
I don't think a mid-side setup is likely to help if your flute is getting lost in the mix,
but a two mic setup without aiming for stereo image could be useful….Who knows.
I'm more inclined to say move the mic around and find the perfect spot; If it doesn't exist, try a different mic.
I'm not entirely convinced that blending, or stereo capture is the way forward.
It's all about experimenting though, so try everything and anything and see what you come up with.
True that. I still think it the stereo spead might help the flute sound bigger in the mix though.
I could be wrong. I've never done what Spinneys doing so take it with a pinch ok.
kip4
Well-known member
Ask Henry.
You can never have enough mics Spinney.
More flavours = more variety = more possibilitys
You can never have enough mics Spinney.
More flavours = more variety = more possibilitys
H
howl2001
New member
Hi,
I have recorded flute, and also play flute.
with the folk rock tunes i was recording last, I started with a condenser mic, sounded pretty good C12/ peluso P12 . I ended up trying my live condenser mic V117 Flute Mic (Applied Microphone Technology). - this mic is fixed to the flute and i was getting a similar tone to the other condenser mic. so got the results i wanted by playing into a dynamic mic (AKG D190)
got the edge from the dynamic mic and the clarity from the condenser. .... next time I am going to try one of my ribbons , sounds like a good idea, (along with the condenser flute mic that clips on the flute.
I have recorded flute, and also play flute.
with the folk rock tunes i was recording last, I started with a condenser mic, sounded pretty good C12/ peluso P12 . I ended up trying my live condenser mic V117 Flute Mic (Applied Microphone Technology). - this mic is fixed to the flute and i was getting a similar tone to the other condenser mic. so got the results i wanted by playing into a dynamic mic (AKG D190)
got the edge from the dynamic mic and the clarity from the condenser. .... next time I am going to try one of my ribbons , sounds like a good idea, (along with the condenser flute mic that clips on the flute.
kip4
Well-known member
Beware of phase issues''!!!!!
S
SimonA
New member
Hi Spinney
Just wanted to clear up a couple of confusions raised above.
Re:ribbon mics being 'darker' on one side than the other - this is not true of all ribbons, in fact only true of a minority. Ribbon mics are not the easiest to use for a number of reasons, they require a hi impedance at the preamp, they can be very low output (and therefore suffer a potentially poor SNR at the preamp), they are prone to physical and electrical damage, they are very susceptible to proximity effect.
Over the last five or six years people have begun to rediscover their good qualities however, and this has led to a number of manufacturers investing in and developing the ribbon mic. Amongst recent changes have been active circuitry, increasing the sensitivity of the design and protecting it from electrical damage, changes to the ribbon material itself ('roswelite' was among the first), changes to the magnet assemblies and mounting position of the ribbon diaphragm itself. It is this last feature which has led to some ribbons exhibiting a different character on either side. The ribbon assembly is offset in such a way that one side of the mic has extended HF response in relation to the other (this would make the mic unsuitable for use as sides in M/S). I don't think that the SE x1r is of this type - it's polar response seems to be similar in both lobes.
M/S arrays can be inconvenient to use - depending on your rig. To properly hear the stereo field captured (and so place the array) then the outputs have to be 'matrixed' to standard L/R stereo in your monitor chain. There are other considerations - where more than one mic is used on a source then time of arrival differences can cause intereference between the two signals where they are combined - the 'phase' mentioned in an earlier post. Both constructive and destructive interference will occur for instance if the track is later folded to mono. To get around this the mics can be coincident (placed close together in one plane) and therefore they then derive stereo information by 'intensity' differences alone. The most common coincident technique requires two similar mics, normally cardioid or near-cardioid SDC's in 'X/Y' (horizontally coincident, mutual angle near 90'). Guess M/S was suggested because it is a coincident array and you already have one of the necessary mics and no SDC's.
So should you use M/S? I'd say no - as already mentioned you'll only recover a narrow image close to the flute which in any event, if the track is played in mono will collapse completely to mono leaving you with only the mid mic - your fig8 will disappear....
Should you get another mic? I'm in the yes camp. As has been said more mics = more choice. Maybe a budget SDC or even matched pair like the Rode NT5 or 55 - and you could try out M/S ;-)
Hope you reached the end....
Kindest
SimonA
Just wanted to clear up a couple of confusions raised above.
Re:ribbon mics being 'darker' on one side than the other - this is not true of all ribbons, in fact only true of a minority. Ribbon mics are not the easiest to use for a number of reasons, they require a hi impedance at the preamp, they can be very low output (and therefore suffer a potentially poor SNR at the preamp), they are prone to physical and electrical damage, they are very susceptible to proximity effect.
Over the last five or six years people have begun to rediscover their good qualities however, and this has led to a number of manufacturers investing in and developing the ribbon mic. Amongst recent changes have been active circuitry, increasing the sensitivity of the design and protecting it from electrical damage, changes to the ribbon material itself ('roswelite' was among the first), changes to the magnet assemblies and mounting position of the ribbon diaphragm itself. It is this last feature which has led to some ribbons exhibiting a different character on either side. The ribbon assembly is offset in such a way that one side of the mic has extended HF response in relation to the other (this would make the mic unsuitable for use as sides in M/S). I don't think that the SE x1r is of this type - it's polar response seems to be similar in both lobes.
M/S arrays can be inconvenient to use - depending on your rig. To properly hear the stereo field captured (and so place the array) then the outputs have to be 'matrixed' to standard L/R stereo in your monitor chain. There are other considerations - where more than one mic is used on a source then time of arrival differences can cause intereference between the two signals where they are combined - the 'phase' mentioned in an earlier post. Both constructive and destructive interference will occur for instance if the track is later folded to mono. To get around this the mics can be coincident (placed close together in one plane) and therefore they then derive stereo information by 'intensity' differences alone. The most common coincident technique requires two similar mics, normally cardioid or near-cardioid SDC's in 'X/Y' (horizontally coincident, mutual angle near 90'). Guess M/S was suggested because it is a coincident array and you already have one of the necessary mics and no SDC's.
So should you use M/S? I'd say no - as already mentioned you'll only recover a narrow image close to the flute which in any event, if the track is played in mono will collapse completely to mono leaving you with only the mid mic - your fig8 will disappear....
Should you get another mic? I'm in the yes camp. As has been said more mics = more choice. Maybe a budget SDC or even matched pair like the Rode NT5 or 55 - and you could try out M/S ;-)
Hope you reached the end....
Kindest
SimonA