Recording Guitar Reverb

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Greg_L said:
Although it doesn't help my case, that album and band represents everything I don't like about music. :D
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No, I knew that. But their name came up somewhere in this thread, and it is a good sounding album, whether you like the actual music or not. Point is, they didn't screw it up by producing it themselves.
 
Some info on Alan Parsons and Pink Floyd...

He became a regular there, engineering such projects as Paul McCartney's Wild Life and Red Rose Speedway, five albums by The Hollies, and Pink Floyd’s The Dark Side of the Moon, for which he received his first Grammy Award nomination. He was known for doing more than what would normally be considered the scope of a recording engineer’s duties. He considered himself to be a recording director, likening his contribution to recordings to what Stanley Kubrick contributed to film
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miroslav said:
Some info on Alan Parsons and Pink Floyd...
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That's pretty vague "known to do more than what would normally, etc......"

Listen, I'm sure he contributed a lot. But, like I said, those songs were 99% there when they were playing them live. He didn't invent any of the sounds on that album. He probably just knew how to capture those sounds, which usually involves knowing where to place a mic. :D
 
miroslav said:
You can "what if" all day long...but with guys like Alan Parsons, they were most definitely part of the production process and added to what we heard on the album.
There wouldn't be producers if every artist could just walk in and take complete command of their production from every angle.
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Hey, everyone knows that musicians are stupid and just do what everyone else does. Someone's gotta call bullshit when they see it. I'll be that guy. If it puts me in the minority, then good.

Some artists can, but you seem to feel that every artist would do a better job without a producer....which just ins't the case, and as I pointed out, major artists who know their way around a studio still work with producers.
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And as I pointed out, most of them HAVE to.

They understand what an outside view can bring to their sessions, and they value that. It doesn't mean they just do what the producer says....but even the best artists don't always see every angle of a production, so the producer provides them with more views.
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See above.

AFA producer/engineers.... in the HR world we wear a lot of hats, and that's why I said that most HR people's perspective are skewed, since they are always the artist/engineer/producer at every step of the way, which works well when it's your stuff you are are recording and you get to make all the decisions without any discussions.
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In a perfect world, that's how it would always be. But this world is imperfect, so we have imperfect people like
producers.
Outside of the HR world, there are more and more producer/engineers than ever before, so that's why I mention them interchangeably, but there are cases where each role is a different person.
Either way...even pure engineers have/give input....they don't always just press RECORD.
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There are more than ever before because one is a relatively easy skill, and one isn't a skill at all. Anyone can do either with time, luck, and a bunch of sycophants and musicians that don't know up from down.

Your distaste for the guys who are just producers is somewhat generic/global, and you are entailed to it, but I'm curious why you have it?
Did you work with a lot of producers in the past that you feel screwed up your music...or was it maybe just a single experience that you now apply to all producers?
I'm just curious why you feel the way you do...so extreme and without any exceptions?
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Why do you defend them all? Better yet, why don't you use them yourself if they're so valuable?
 
RAMI said:
That's pretty vague "known to do more than what would normally, etc......"

Listen, I'm sure he contributed a lot. But, like I said, those songs were 99% there when they were playing them live. He didn't invent any of the sounds on that album. He probably just knew how to capture those sounds, which usually involves knowing where to place a mic. :D
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Alan Parsons got them coffee, weed, and nudie mags.
 
I'll say this. Thank dog Alan Parsons didn't produce that album. It could have ended up sounding like a sterile, boring, faceless, obnoxious Alan Parsons album. :eek:
 
RAMI said:
I'll say this. Thank dog Alan Parsons didn't produce that album. It could have ended up sounding like a sterile, boring, faceless, obnoxious Alan Parsons album. :eek:
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I need that sound. I'm gonna give him a call.
 
Wow, it just keeps going! I guess maybe I started it?

The fact is that we're all kinda just talking generalities and debating philosophy, but not really helping the OP any. Maybe that's why he hasn't come back?

But really, that's the big issue in this thread, and something I tried to point out way back in my first post. We know absolutely fucking nothing about this situation except that some dude with 7 posts wants to record some "guy who plays guitar" and he (the OP) is unhappy with the sound coming out of the amp.

Is there a band involved, or is it solo guitar? Is anybody getting paid, or expecting to get paid? Is this intended for commercial release, a demo to shop around (for "deals" or gigs), or just a vanity project? Exactly what is the relationship between the OP and the "guy"? Are we just buddies fucking around? Did he get your name off your craigslist posting? Has he come asking you to help him refine and/or define his sound, or is he just there because you have better gear and/or space?

In short, WTF'n'F are we talking about here? Depending on whether I'm logged in or not it's either 3 or 10 pages of Greg (and I, I guess) arguing against RAMI and miro. Par for the course around this place, I suppose...


All of the above-listed situations are perfectly normal and valid, and it is by no means an exhaustive list, but each demands a slightly different set of skills and/or attitude from the OP. All of this should have been ironed out in "pre-production" talks. Before the time/space was "booked" there should have been some discussion on the intentions of the project, and the various expectations that each party had of the other.

I for one did not intend to imply that it is just completely wrong to try to offer opinions, advice, or experience when and where it is appropriate. I just wanted to point out that maybe it wasn't really appropriate in this case, or possibly even just a waste of time and energy.

If it's just a vanity thing that nobody's going to hear but the "guy who plays guitar", then why the fuck would you do more than maybe say "That sounds kinda funny to me, maybe we could try..." and when he says "Nope, this is what I want" you just shrug and go with it? Then don't put it on your "demo reel" if you don't want people to associate it with your good name. Dude might eventually decide that it does, in fact, suck. And he will also remember that you told him it sucked, and offered options, and that he rejected your suggestions. Unless he's a real prick there's no way he can stick that on you.

Or you could insist that he change his preferred way of working and present him with something of which you can be proud, and he'll cringe and bristle every time he hears it. Any time he plays it for a friend or family member he'll say "It's not exactly what I wanted, but the engineer just wouldn't listen to me."

I don't know. We kind of got away from helping the OP come up with options. Partly my fault, I suppose. I just wanted to point out that one option - definitely easiest, and possibly best depending on the situation of which we know nothing - could be to just record what the client asked for.
 
ashcat_lt said:
In short, WTF'n'F are we talking about here? Depending on whether I'm logged in or not it's either 3 or 10 pages of Greg (and I, I guess) arguing against RAMI and miro. Par for the course around this place, I suppose...

.
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No, not at all. For one, you and I and Rami are pretty much in the same boat as far as I can tell. Miro argues with me, and everyone else, about everything, so no big deal there either. Really we're not arguing at all. I don't take it that way anyway. It's just a disagreement that has no right or wrong answer. We just see things differently and went back and forth. He has his ideas, I have mine. Naturally they're worlds apart, as it should be.

As for the OP, he probably wasn't coming back anyway. They rarely do. :laughings:
 
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