Recording drums with minimal mics.

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Holl

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Hey everyone. I'm new to the recording scene, and would like some suggestions on how to record drums. I've recorded drums with my behringer b-1 before, and wasn't impressed with the quality. My question is, how can I acheive the best results using a minimal amount of mics. Right now at our disposal, my friend and I have my b-1, another large diaphragm condenser, a shure sm58, and another very low quality dynamic mic. I'm planning on getting an sm57. How can I get the best sound using these mics? I have a 4 peice kit, and I almost never use the floor tom and use the other tom minimally. My main concerns are a nice overall balance of the kit and a punchy snare sound with lots of attack. Also, after everythings recorded, what do you guys usually do to the track as far as reverb, compression, etc. goes? I'm open to any and all suggestions, and any help will be appreciated.
 
Its gonna sound like crap but there are two ways you can go for right now. first if you can try an xy pattern with the LDC's you have, you usually want to use condensors for overheads. Next mic the snare with your 58 but unscrew the screen(make sure the drummer is careful) and use the cheapo on the kick and eq and compress. This may give you a decent sound but it'll take a lot of work.
 
Well, Since I'm the dissenter I'll go ahead and say it - I'd buy something other than the SM57. You basically have one, it's the SM58. There's not a whole lot of difference between the two mic's.

I would put the Money on an Audio Technica Pro-25.

As for recording with a minimal amount of Mic's.

Rule #1. Tuning is EVERYTHING.


Place the B1 on a Boom Mic stand directly over the drummer's head, and aim it straight down.

Build a "tunnel" in front of the kick drum using blankets and a chair or a garbage can - anything that will allow you to layer several layers of blankets over the end of the kick drum, and leave an open area under there.
Make sure the kick is sounding good out in front, before you build the tunnel.

Then put the other condenser mic under the tunnel.

Then mic the BODY of the Snare from about 8" away with the SM58 - just aim it at the middle of the snare shell from under the hi-hat.

Before you start EQ'ing anything - make a test recording of the kit, and listen back to it. Adjust the mic's positioning prior to making any EQ adjustments - always try using mic placement first. just by moving the mic 1" or so, you can make major changes in the sound.

The snare mic is just to add "fatness" to the snare, as well as allow you to add a little reverb to the snare by itself if you wish.

Typically, I just roll off some of the mid's using this type of mic'ing technique.

Granted - this isn't going to yiled the heavily processed "Radio friendly" (which is typically triggered anyway) drumsound, but it will give you a good solid "Rock" drumsound - as long as the drumkit is tuned well.

Any decent drummer (one who plays with dynamics) will be able to deliver a "pre-mixed" recording since they "mix themselves" according to what they are hearing - this overhead technique basically pics up something similar to what they hear.


Tim
 
jonnyc said:
Its gonna sound like crap but there are two ways you can go for right now. first if you can try an xy pattern with the LDC's you have, you usually want to use condensors for overheads. Next mic the snare with your 58 but unscrew the screen(make sure the drummer is careful) and use the cheapo on the kick and eq and compress. This may give you a decent sound but it'll take a lot of work.
Click to expand...


Why unscrew the screen? Just leave it on there - that is one of the worst misconceptions going around - you don't need to unscrew the screen.



Tim
 
Thanks for the help guys. I'll try your suggestions.

In a book I recently bought, Home Recording For Musicians (a For Dummies book), by Jeff Strong, he reccommends getting used vintage jazz kits from the 60's-70's, because smaller drums, tuned down, can sound really big and great in a studio. I've been thinking about this, and am considering getting a kit like he describes. Would you guys agree with this? It seems like it'd fit the type of music I'm into (60's-70's rock and blues), and it'd be cheap. Right now I have a really, really, bad used student kit. There's hardware missing, the heads are all dented up, the cymbals were used in a marching band I think. So anything would really be an improvement. I'm planning on getting some nice cymbals, and maybe a new snare if needed. What do you guys think?
 
I think you can get a good sound from what you have. If your drummer can play evenly, tune the kit well, and - most importantly - play the kit the way you'd like it to be mixed in the song (i.e., don't hit the cymbals so hard), even a single mic well placed can render a great sound. Do a google search on the glyn johns drum method - perfect for minimalists. Good luck!
 
Holl said:
Thanks for the help guys. I'll try your suggestions.

In a book I recently bought, Home Recording For Musicians (a For Dummies book), by Jeff Strong, he reccommends getting used vintage jazz kits from the 60's-70's, because smaller drums, tuned down, can sound really big and great in a studio. I've been thinking about this, and am considering getting a kit like he describes. Would you guys agree with this? It seems like it'd fit the type of music I'm into (60's-70's rock and blues), and it'd be cheap. Right now I have a really, really, bad used student kit. There's hardware missing, the heads are all dented up, the cymbals were used in a marching band I think. So anything would really be an improvement. I'm planning on getting some nice cymbals, and maybe a new snare if needed. What do you guys think?
Click to expand...

I had a 1960's 20" Ludwig kick that sounded wicked good in the studio. Wish I still had it. It's much easier to dial in a good kick sound from a 20" than a 24". A 22" or 24" can get much better lows with a subkick mic, but the attack on a 20" is too sweet to believe.
 
you're going to be unhappy if you go with mono. thats all i'm sayin.
 
I don't know - there's some great examples of mono drums out there. Aren't the drums in Lady Madonna mono?
 
treymonfauntre said:
you're going to be unhappy if you go with mono. thats all i'm sayin.
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Bullshit. (pardon my French) :rolleyes:

The Majority of drumtracks are mono. How many times have you mic'ed each tom with two mics? They wouldn't be true stereo unless every single source was mic'ed individually with it's own pair of mic's, so complete spatial placement could be controlled.A good quality mono drumsound is definitely preferred over a crappy stereo one. The Drums and the Bass should go right up the center for most music, so it can provide a Solid Foundation.
The reality is, most of the "Stereo" image is made with effects and secondary (non-foundation/Rhythm) tracks.


Re-read his post. He's really only concerned with 2 drums - the kick and the snare, with a little bit of 1 rack tom.


Tim
 
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I agree with Tim on the Stereo front. I used to bust my balls trying to get a good stereo image. Its just not nessecary. I have had some pretty satisfying comments in regard to my drum sound lately and that is beacause I have simplyfied my micing. I'm down to two mics (kick and o/h) which makes mixing the kit an absolute breeze.

Holl, as far as your kit goes can you post some pics? The condition of the heads makes a massive difference to the sound, but it may be worht seeing if your kit is worth spending the money on new heads or put it towards a new (old) kit.
 
Normally I use at least 4 mics on drums. One each for snare and kick, just so I can EQ, compress and maybe add reverb to them, and 2 overhead for the cymbals, overheads are panned 15 or 20% respectively and snare and kick stay pretty much in the center. You say you don't use toms much so don't worry about micing them, the other mics should catch them enough to suit your purposes.
 
Sorry I can't post pics right now, but the heads are in really bad condition, there's dents and everything in them and the batter head on the snare is flaking off. I don't think the drums really sound bad, but I've got a problem. My toms don't have the bottom rims on them. I bought them before I knew a lot about drums, so I didn't notice it. This makes the toms sound like cardboard boxes, which I really dislike. This is probably the main reason I don't play the toms much. Does anyone know where I can maybe buy bottom rims? I also have a very hard time tuning my drums. Will this be easier with new heads?
 
Holl said:
Sorry I can't post pics right now, but the heads are in really bad condition, there's dents and everything in them and the batter head on the snare is flaking off. I don't think the drums really sound bad, but I've got a problem. My toms don't have the bottom rims on them. I bought them before I knew a lot about drums, so I didn't notice it. This makes the toms sound like cardboard boxes, which I really dislike. This is probably the main reason I don't play the toms much. Does anyone know where I can maybe buy bottom rims? I also have a very hard time tuning my drums. Will this be easier with new heads?
Click to expand...


You can get bottom rims through the link in my banner.

New heads will make all the difference in the world!


Tim
 
Thanks Tim for all your help. I'll be ordering new heads soon, and recording with the method you suggested. Thanks again.
 
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