Recording and editing a guitar line

[gordholio]

Hi everyone:

I just recorded the main guitar line for my song. It was a perfect take. To simplify things, let's just say the guitar line is similar throughout the entire song, even during the verse. What I want to do, however, is lessen the punch and drop the volume during the verses when our singer is singing. What do you guys do? Do you simply throw a volume envelope on the track and lessen or increase the output by node editing? I find when I do that that it sounds like somebody accidentally dropped the guitar volume during the recording session. It sounds like a mistake. How do I get it to sound purposeful? By zooming in very tight on the waveform and making sure the volume drops at precisely the right point? Even if I do that, the guitar is never silent during the entire song, so I'll always be dropping the volume while the guitar is making noise, and that always sounds sucky. I could re-record the verse parts to a new track, but my playing and the guitar sounds were so good the first time around.

I have a feeling that nobody is going to offer a magical solution, and that this is the 'skill' part of recording. Am I right? By the way, I use a registered version of Sonar 2.1.

Thanks!!!

gordo

 

[The Green Hornet]

Yo Gordo:

I'm not the expert but here is a suggestion.

Since it sounds like you have a damn good cut of your guitar, don't change it.

Put the vocal on two tracks and play with l/r pan on both tracks of vocal while setting up your mix.

You can also dabble with some minor eq on the guitar track to soften it -- but if it's good -- leave it as is.

Green Hornet

 

[gordholio]

Hey Green Hornet (that was such a cool TV show):

Really? I don't have to decrease the volume of the guitar during the verse so that its emphasized when it stands alone and moved to the background when playing underneath the vocals?

gordo

 

[stonepiano]

Hi everyone:

To simplify things, let's just say the guitar line is similar throughout the entire song, even during the verse.

no easy answers. of course! I would just listen to a lot of songs that exemplify what you're trying to create test theirs against your mix.
A song I can think about that does this you might want to listen to as a reference is Green Day's When I Come Around. Don't know what genre you're in, but that guitar line is pretty steady over intro and verse.

Another thing to consider, and this is my imagination runnning wild, is dropping the riff out of the verse completely? If you can't make it subtle, why not make the change so drastic as to appear intentional? Check out The Pixies "Where Is My Mind" for reference of how less can be more.

Miles

 

[gordholio]

You're not suggesting that the melifuous sounds of my muted guitar by elminated are you?

gordo

 

[The Green Hornet]

Yo Gordo of Odrog:]

Exactly! Play your vocal but leave the "cool" guitar solo solemente.

I also enjoyed the GH TV series; I have a couple of VHS tapes of the old Green Hornet Serials. One very old; the other a bit more contempory.

On one VHS series it is noted on the jacket that the producer hired the guy on WXYZ radio to come in and dub the voice of the Green Hornet because the actor who had the part couldn't make it with his voice.

The Green Hornet will return to help out Spiderman and the Justice League!

Cheers,
Green Hornet

 

[Sennheiser]

There is nothing wrong with pulling a fader to lower the level of the guitar when it would compete with the vocal track. It doesn't have to be that obvious.

Man, I remember the GH on TV too. I think that's the only show my dad ever watched "just because".

 

[TexRoadkill]

I just recorded the main guitar line for my song. It was a perfect take. To simplify things, let's just say the guitar line is similar throughout the entire song, even during the verse. What I want to do, however, is lessen the punch and drop the volume during the verses when our singer is singing. What do you guys do?

That is called 'Mixing' and the ability to do it right is where the skill and talent comes into play. You might try compressing the guitar a bit. This will help it 'sit' in the mix better and should eliminate a lot of micro volume moves. But you will still have to adjust the levels during the song to get it right. Then listen and readjust, rinse, wash, repeat until it sounds perfect.

If it was easy then anyone could do it

 

[VOXVENDOR]

>>What do you guys do?

I would record a lighter, more spacious guitar for the verse, and then have a thrashy, compressed and beefy guitar in the chorus...

2 seperate parts.....



I don't think it will ever sound right dropping that guitar sound down in the verse, it will always sound like a volume move...

Think of Evenflow by Pearl jam...... That heavy intro, then when the singing starts, its a totally lighter, more chugging and delicate guitar sound, rather than an all out heavy sound...

Now, imagine that heavy intro continued through the Verse... but turned down a bit.....

It just wouldn't be right..

(In my opinion)


You need to have the performance that displays the guitar player holding back during the verses..Rather than the mixing move that does it..

Joe

 

[stonepiano]

You need to have the performance that displays the guitar player holding back during the verses..Rather than the mixing move that does it..

Joe [/B]

what he said.

 

[gordholio]

Hey Joe (geez, there's song title for ya):

I hear you on Evenflow. An even better example is Nirvana's Teen Spirit - I guess that forceful/quiet dynamic was a trademark of the Seattle sound.

gordo

 

[djc]

The best part of the Green Hornet was Bruce Lee.

 

[Sennheiser]

The quiet playing while the singer is doing his bit is what should have happened to begin with like VOX said.

He'll have to re-track that perfect guitar take now. I was thinking that maybe the guitar part was tracked without a scratch vocal that caused this problem to begin with.

Always try to do a scratch vocal while tracking the rhythm parts if possible. It will give the performers a reference to play by.