Re: Oktava 012 and QC

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Marik

Marik

Pro Microphone Design
Re: Oktava 012 and QC

This weekend our local Guitar Center had a special for Oktavas--buy one for $99.99 and get second free. I could not resist and decided to give it a try. The guys in GC were nice enough to let me go through all 012's (18) they had in stock, so I spent good couple hours going through all of them. First, I checked all the capsules, using the same preamp body and listening to the same tracks. Out of 18 I found ONE, which was good, actually it was very good, in fact I was surprised how good it was. Very accurate, well balanced sound, with great bass, and smooth top. Since I had to find a matching pair, as a mate for this capsule I ended up taking one with about 1db lower output and slightly bit more midrangy. It was impossible to find a closer match. All the rest were whether top or mid oriented. Many of them sounded very harsh and unpleasant, lacking bass and depth. I found another pair, which sonded decent, but not nearly as good as this one. Interesting enough (this trick I learned from RO forum), I measured the capasitance of the capsules, and the best one had 48 pf, and the second 47 pf, which makes me think that they have slightly different spacing.
Next step-- I will upgrade the pre of the mic with nice capasitors and then make some serious comparisons with my 451E and KM84.
I saw a lot of questions about different models of 012's, so FYI:
The letter "A" after 012 means for distributing inside of Russia, no letter--export model. It is an interesting practice in Russia. Since communist regim, export models always meant to be of better quality.
MK 012 -- three capsules
MK 012-01-- with cardioid only

Also, MK means--mikrophon kondensatorniy (condenser), and ML--mikrophon lentochniy (ribbon).
 
Marik said:
Interesting enough (this trick I learned from RO forum), I measured the capasitance of the capsules, and the best one had 48 pf, and the second 47 pf,
That's a good trick, and hard to believe possible: measure capacitance to 1 pf.
 
Re: Re: Re: Oktava 012 and QC

crazydoc said:
That's a good trick, and hard to believe possible: measure capacitance to 1 pf.

Yeah you're not kidding crazydoc. GC let him spend "hours" looking at all their stock to buy a pair of $99.00 mic? I could see that if he were looking to buy a couple $1K pres, maybe.

Nonetheless, what did you use to measure the capacitance??? What Frequency were the measurements taken at (i.e., 1KHz, multiple freqs)??? I’m willing to bet that if you did measure them it was with a simple hand held meter and not a piece of lab test equipment (not cheap). In addition, the 1pF differential was most likely the crap probes?
 
I couldn't get the bastards at GC to even let me plug in 1 mic when I went to look.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Oktava 012 and QC

Simman said:
Yeah you're not kidding crazydoc. GC let him spend "hours" looking at all their stock to buy a pair of $99.00 mic?
You guys must be going to the wrong Guitar Center. ;) The folks at mine will let me test mics all day long if I want. I usually just have them set me up and turn me loose. Then they can go off and help other customers in the mean time.
 
<eah you're not kidding crazydoc. GC let him spend "hours" looking at all their stock to buy a pair of $99.00 mic? I could see that if he were looking to buy a couple $1K pres, maybe.>

Simman, he doesn't buy $1K pres--he makes them himself for much cheaper. But if he were, it would take him 5 minutes max--usually, the price range suggests the QC.

To measure the capsules I used 1 Mhz Booton capacitance bridge.

<Marik,
Are you the Marik from RO's "Tech Talk"?>

Flatpicker, yes it is the same person. How your projects are coming along?
 
Marik said:
Flatpicker, yes it is the same person. How your projects are coming along?
I haven’t had much time to work on them lately...
Maybe when everything settles down after Christmas. (A little Christmas money wouldn't hurt, either! :D )
 
Marik said:

To measure the capsules I used 1 Mhz Booton capacitance bridge.
Sounds like a pretty expensive "trick"! Not many of us have access to this kind of equipment.
 
Marik said:
...To measure the capsules I used 1 Mhz Booton capacitance bridge...
Marik, can I borrow it so I can go match me up a pair? :p

BTW, how did you go about connecting the capsule to the meter? I’ve been wondering about the best way to do that.
 
Hey guys. Don’t take this capacitance as a “trick”. It only shows a spacing tolerance. There are other things, which determine the sound--diaphragm tension. Also, specifically in 012’--back plate material density--unlike most of “drilled” plates, here the plates are made out of tiny brass balls, compressed together—it determines the acoustical labyrinth for the back wave. However, providing that the tension is uniform (you can easily check it), more conventional capsules (like LD Neumann or AKG style) can be closely matched by checking the capacitance and then torqueing or releasing the capsule screws. Your “ears” should still be the main indicator, though. One caution--if you don’t know EXACTLY what are you doing, don't do it.
 
"Trick" was your word.
I misunderstood you - I thought the trick was in how you measured the capacitance, not that you measured the capacitance in order to match the mics.
As you say, there are many more things than the capacitance that determine the sound/matching characteristics of mics.

How, by the way, do you "easily" check the uniformity of tension on the capsule, other then viewing the reflection for distortion?
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Oktava 012 and QC

Simman said:
GC let him spend "hours" looking at all their stock to buy a pair of $99.00 mic?

I checked out six different mics at GC before I bought my 2 MK012's. Maybe you just need to find a different Guitar Center
 
When I bought my pair, I think I went through about seven and found one dud in the bunch. There were four real good ones and it came down to matching those up as best I could by ear.
 
ozraves said:
When I bought my pair, I think I went through about seven and found one dud in the bunch. There were four real good ones and it came down to matching those up as best I could by ear.
One time I bout six of these, and they were all great, and they all matched, pretty close, in output and frequency response.

I think the whole "Oktava has poor quality control" thing is a little overblown. I've tested at least a dozen of them, and none were "duds."
 
crazydoc said:
"Trick" was your word.
I misunderstood you - I thought the trick was in how you measured the capacitance, not that you measured the capacitance in order to match the mics.

Sorry for being unclear.


How, by the way, do you "easily" check the uniformity of tension on the capsule, other then viewing the reflection for distortion? [/B]


Essentially the capsule is a miniature drum. So you can lightly (and carefully) tap the diaphragm in different spots and listen to the pitch difference. It will also show you the resonant frequency the diphragm tuned. Then using a piano or chromatic tuner find out the note and convert it into frequency. Most of LD mics are tuned between 900Hz-1300Hz.
 
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