TerraMortim
New member
nothing beats beating off, or so I heard sweetnubs saying.
nothing beats beating off, or so I heard sweetnubs saying.
TerraMortim
New member
=D ns10s. Why?!!?!
M
mrhotapples
New member
Simulanalog sits really well in mixes. Use it. It'll serve you well. It's not as easy as Amplitube 2, which is my second favorite...But the depth and response of Simulanalog is great.
That said, amp sims are akin to creating a photo-realistic environment in a video game. It won't ever look real. The experience was never there in the first place. It will never catch your eye or strike you as much as seeing a picture of a tree, and then still, there is no substitute for the real thing, right there in front of you. Go out and look at some trees, and buy and PLAY a real tube amp like a Fender Super Reverb or Marshall JCM800/900, a Peavey 5150 or Windsor, Vox AC30/15...Then take one home and treasure it forever because it's about as connected as you can get to an electric instrument!
That said, amp sims are akin to creating a photo-realistic environment in a video game. It won't ever look real. The experience was never there in the first place. It will never catch your eye or strike you as much as seeing a picture of a tree, and then still, there is no substitute for the real thing, right there in front of you. Go out and look at some trees, and buy and PLAY a real tube amp like a Fender Super Reverb or Marshall JCM800/900, a Peavey 5150 or Windsor, Vox AC30/15...Then take one home and treasure it forever because it's about as connected as you can get to an electric instrument!
antichef
pornk rock
I like the tonelab (got the SE) and guitar amp pro, which is built into logic.
Lately I've been reamping the signals into my JCM800 and recording with the ACM-2 ribbon mic, then comparing to the models (the guitar amp pro models, that is, when I record the tonelab it's not dry, so to speak) - it's a pretty eye-opening comparison (ear opening?) - the Marshall is much bigger and meaner sounding, no matter what I do to the models.
But the models are easier to mix - they stay inside their frequency bands very nicely.
Lately I've been reamping the signals into my JCM800 and recording with the ACM-2 ribbon mic, then comparing to the models (the guitar amp pro models, that is, when I record the tonelab it's not dry, so to speak) - it's a pretty eye-opening comparison (ear opening?) - the Marshall is much bigger and meaner sounding, no matter what I do to the models.
But the models are easier to mix - they stay inside their frequency bands very nicely.
carlosguardia
New member
My contribution to this thread is this simple:
With all due respect to AMP SIMS and I own a few.... BUT... If you can do the real thing, why not do it? Is it that hard to get a decent amp and an SM 57??
With all due respect to AMP SIMS and I own a few.... BUT... If you can do the real thing, why not do it? Is it that hard to get a decent amp and an SM 57??
pipelineaudio
Well-known member
Well for one thing, there's the editing factor, being that this is the age of the million dollar demo. If you record it clean and reamp it it shouldn't be an issue.
Micing a a real amp well enough to beat an amp sim is not an easy thing. Especially when it needs to fit on an album with other instruments and both not eat too much room, nor get lost.
Miking an amp is fun, and a skill to learn for sure, but don't think for a second that "hang a 57 and run" is going to beat a well made amp sim anytime soon
P-J
Rank Amateur
No it's not really, but when you live in a terraced house (Google it) you need to have a little concern for your neighbours welfare. Most 'decent' amps need to be cranked a little to get the sound.
Although you can, there's still thousands who can't.
For those posting on here, and this applies to any thread, just remember the poster is likely asking because he cannot use a real amp in his situation. Not because he's lazy or prefers 'in the box' solutions. In this case he might be though
For those from North America and surrounding areas, try to recognise that in Europe (UK specifically) most people who aren't rich live in either a terraced house or a semi-detached house and the rules are very different. I know from visiting that a huge proportion of your houses are fully detached.
Not trying to attract undue attention with this post, just to air a few facts that might not have crossed people's minds
Anyway-- I'd go for Guitar Rig 3 since I've had most success with it.
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pipelineaudio
Well-known member
Don't worry with the crazy housing development scandals going on here at the moment and "Master Plan Communities" the US will soon be a giant apartment complex/parking lot from coast to coast like europe and we'll all be mixing in our headphones
Not to get too far off on a tangent, but what they're doing to the environment here and the wholesale slaughter of entire biomes is an attrocity. With the full support of the "environmentalists" here for the most part as well
But I digress
X
xstatic
New member
I think LT. Bob touched on something really important here. Amp sims be they hardware or software react differently than a real amp does. As a result, to get the best product you can with them you have to approach things differently. Sometimes that may mean changing your technique a little, maybe your strings, and maybe even your setup. Personally, I record all guitars now with both a DI sending a clean guitar only track, and through the amp. This gives me the option to reamp later should I change my mind about tone, as well as blend an amp sim with the real mic'ed tracks. One thing I have found that many people may miss when mixing real guitars with software guitars is that you need to check the phase between the two because often times the end result becomes more focused when the polarity is reversed on either live mic or sim track.
Personally, I think amp sims have come a long ways. They are certainly more usable now than ever before, but generally speaking the sound of a good amp mic'ed up is still unmatched by software, especially when dealing with cab to pickup relationships, and higher gain stuff. There just seems to be a big difference in the perceived amount of "power" behind a cranked up high gain tube head with a decent cab and an amp sim. The crunch is punchier and seems to have more definition than the emulated track. I usually use the software tracks to help layer in behind the mic'ed tracks and fill any gaps that may be left from the mic'ed track.
In the end I see them all as tools. For the studio, I think I would actually prefer a good software emulation than a shitty amp, but a good amp is still king and is no danger of being dethroned in my opinion. They are all tools. Each persons situation is different, thus what might be valuable to each person is different. Of the emulations I have used, I like Amplitube 2 so far, and the Ampeg SVX bass modeler really kicks some ass. I have a good friend who is a guitar player and whose opinion I trust say that he loves the new NI Guitar rig stuff, but that still didn't stop him from recently purchasing a nice little 2x12 Mesa combo
Personally, I think amp sims have come a long ways. They are certainly more usable now than ever before, but generally speaking the sound of a good amp mic'ed up is still unmatched by software, especially when dealing with cab to pickup relationships, and higher gain stuff. There just seems to be a big difference in the perceived amount of "power" behind a cranked up high gain tube head with a decent cab and an amp sim. The crunch is punchier and seems to have more definition than the emulated track. I usually use the software tracks to help layer in behind the mic'ed tracks and fill any gaps that may be left from the mic'ed track.
In the end I see them all as tools. For the studio, I think I would actually prefer a good software emulation than a shitty amp, but a good amp is still king and is no danger of being dethroned in my opinion. They are all tools. Each persons situation is different, thus what might be valuable to each person is different. Of the emulations I have used, I like Amplitube 2 so far, and the Ampeg SVX bass modeler really kicks some ass. I have a good friend who is a guitar player and whose opinion I trust say that he loves the new NI Guitar rig stuff, but that still didn't stop him from recently purchasing a nice little 2x12 Mesa combo
rayc
retroreprobate
Shoot me down in flames but i was dooing some sketch recording last week & used a Behr Bass DI because it was still set up from the bass track - I managed to get some good stuff from it for single coil guitar.
Voxengo Boogiex is pretty good if you get the cab/mic sim with it (free too).
That said I prefer to use my Marshall bass amp for guitar - stillexperimenting (after all these years) with a mic to maximise the experience.
Voxengo Boogiex is pretty good if you get the cab/mic sim with it (free too).
That said I prefer to use my Marshall bass amp for guitar - stillexperimenting (after all these years) with a mic to maximise the experience.
TerraMortim
New member
aidan_m
Budding Rock Star!
jtees4
Member
Use a POD XT and a Korg AX1500G, as well as using amps some of th time.
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S
Superhuman
Shagaholic
I have a few modelers including the PODxt and TonePort, Digitech GNX, Bass GT-Pro and a whole load of VST's. THe best modeller I have used without question is the ROcktron Prophesy II. It's not cheap but it sounds and plays like a real amp with studio grade effects. Hated the PODxt the most but have to say it has its place - you can get useful sounds from it with the right tweaking. The Toneport is just plain handy, pretty much the same as the PODxt but with bass and Vox too which opens up some new doors. Rocktron wins for me but Line6 have the best software interfaces - very user friendly (on the pc). Boss comes in a respectable second for sound quality to my ears.
S
Superhuman
Shagaholic
No it's not really, but when you live in a terraced house (Google it) you need to have a little concern for your neighbours welfare. Most 'decent' amps need to be cranked a little to get the sound.
Although you can, there's still thousands who can't.
For those posting on here, and this applies to any thread, just remember the poster is likely asking because he cannot use a real amp in his situation. Not because he's lazy or prefers 'in the box' solutions. In this case he might be though
For those from North America and surrounding areas, try to recognise that in Europe (UK specifically) most people who aren't rich live in either a terraced house or a semi-detached house and the rules are very different. I know from visiting that a huge proportion of your houses are fully detached.
Not trying to attract undue attention with this post, just to air a few facts that might not have crossed people's minds
Anyway-- I'd go for Guitar Rig 3 since I've had most success with it.
Good point and not not usually mentioned around here. I'm from Ireland and most houses here are either semi-detached (two houses stuck together) or terraced (a whole load stuck together in a row). THe only good thing is that houses here are block built which offers a little more in the line of sound insulation but it's still very difficult to crank a tube amp and not have the cops knocking on the door. A cranked 15 watter could easily be heard in the next door house.
I'm doing a major job on my own house which includes a soundproof studio at attic level and it ain't easy or cheap! Modelers make sense for homerecording purposes plus they are getting better al l the time. There are also loads of tricks you can do to make modelers sound better too like splitting the signal before the modeller and playing through a little practice amp so you can also pick up controlled feedback, increase natural sustain and harmonics. PLus with modelers like Amplitube and Toneport reamping is easy and if you don't like the tone you can take the wav and reamp through a big stack after you have done your arrangement and get the tone you want.
mjbphotos
Moderator
I use a Guitarport interface, which upgraded me with gearbox a while back, and now PodFarm, which lets you set up two separate f/x-amp chains to play simultaneously. A lot of variety possible!
Lt. Bob
Spread the Daf!
And I THINK the Rocktron Utopia has the same quality of sound without as much versatility, fx-wise, as the Prophecy.
I haven't used a Prophecy but my Utopia is the most real sounding and 'feeling' modeler for live use out of the many I have tried by a pretty wide margin.
nate_dennis
Well-known member
I guess I do this a lot . . .. but rather than try to answer this post I will ask a related question in order to gain some enlightenment.
Paul Reed Smith was talking about resistance (I don't recall the tech. term . . .impedance maybe?) and said that a lot of people hate they way wireless systems sound but that if you put a twenty foot cable b/w the guitar and the wireless system (wrapped around your strap or something) that the resistance would increase and it would sound better. The idea being that guitars are designed to use this resistance in the creation of tone. What would increasing cable length do to affect the tone and response of these simulations?
Paul Reed Smith was talking about resistance (I don't recall the tech. term . . .impedance maybe?) and said that a lot of people hate they way wireless systems sound but that if you put a twenty foot cable b/w the guitar and the wireless system (wrapped around your strap or something) that the resistance would increase and it would sound better. The idea being that guitars are designed to use this resistance in the creation of tone. What would increasing cable length do to affect the tone and response of these simulations?
Lt. Bob
Spread the Daf!
Actually an interesting question. I don't know the answer but I can say that I generally use the exact same cords I would use into a pedal board and amp ..... 2-15' cords. That wouldn't seem to be the issue for me.
kcearl
I see deaf people
Ive tried about every modeler i could get my hands on in demo's and bought a toneport with the gold bundle and platinum farm updates and the Studio Devil plug in...
Im strictly a beginner but i noticed some huge differences in sound and cpu usage (which was important with my set-up) from near 40% on ReValver to 12% with Studio Devil (both with sonar running)..and how "fake" a lot of GR3's sounds were
Overloud TH-1 was the best sounding imo..and very low cpu usage...just not the deal the toneport was/is
all need a bit of adjusting mind
Im strictly a beginner but i noticed some huge differences in sound and cpu usage (which was important with my set-up) from near 40% on ReValver to 12% with Studio Devil (both with sonar running)..and how "fake" a lot of GR3's sounds were
Overloud TH-1 was the best sounding imo..and very low cpu usage...just not the deal the toneport was/is
all need a bit of adjusting mind