Pro Tools Free....

[JazzMasterWil]

First and foremost, whoever came up with idea of a newbies forum is a genius.

I for some help over at the harmony central forums and one guys response was "buy a couple grams of snow and a patchbay"..... I also had a guy respond "Are you just making quick demo's? If so - save your cash for real studio time"............ I just had to let it slide... If they don't think you can make a great cd at home for cheap (*coughs* FUGAZI *coughs again*) that's their problem.

Anyways I'll let down to the point here. I have a somewhat nice setup now. It's a tascam dp-01 8 track recorder. I love the unit and it's very simple to operate.

It's superb as far as running a drum machine into it, and playing guitar and bass into a pod, and then putting a vocal track down..... It doesn't get much easier than that.

The problem is that it can only record two mics at a time and that it doesn't have xlr inputs. If you're a newbie reading this. PLEASE buy a recorder with XLR inputs. You will thank yourself for it later.

So to even run one mic, I have to plug the mic into the mixing board and then send a line off the mixing board into the tascam. This isn't such a huge pain in the butt, expect for the nightmare that we call "drums".

Basically I run every last drum mic (expect for the snare drum) into a 24 channel mixer. The signal off of this mixer goes into one input of the recorder.

The snare mic is run into a much smaller mixer and goes into the other input of the recorder. I do this so I can have the snare on it's own separate track and adjust it's level by itself.

Ok the problem is that I record all by myself. And I have to use the "guess and check" method. So basically I mic everything up, record it, make small little adjust on the mixing board, record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, ............... realize that one of my overhead mics is in the wrong position and then I record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board,record again, listen to it, make small little adjustments on the mixing board, ............................... It makes you want to pull your hair out just reading it doesn't it?

Anyways, I have seen the light as far as needed a computer based system is concerned.............. I'm not very good with computers and get confused by technology pretty easily. So please be patient with me.

I really need a system that will let me record up to 4 mics at one time. I know that's a good number of mics, but it's the least I could get away with. (That's 2 overhead, one on the snare, and one in the bass drum).

If I could make adjustment to channels while listening to the play back, that'd really help me out. (Instead having the nightmare of "guess and check" again).

I would like to have a program that I could get a lot of cheap (or even better, FREE) plug in's for. I'd love have reverb, compression, an eq, and all of that good stuff just a click away. It'd make life a lot simplier, and it'd be a lot cheaper than going out and buying effects units, compressors, limiters, eq's etc...........

I'd really like to try pro-tools free, or an similar inexpensive program. But I don't even know what I'd need. I mean I get that the computer would record the music, but what do the mics plug into? (And more importantly how much does it cost).

If I bought this "microphone to computer" thing-a-ma-jig could I only use it with pro-tools free?

Or could I use it later on down the line if I decide to upgrade to a different computer based recording system. (Perhaps pro-tools the not-so-free version or something).

I have a couple years of recording experience under my belt, but untill now all my stuff has just been in the "songs for fun" and "sappy little songs to give my girlfriend to listen to" categories.........

And now I wanted to make a pretty serious demo that could get my band a couple gigs. A drum machine is not going to cut it, and if I have to even type "guess and check" one more time (after that last one of course) I'm going to pull all my hair off and move to a desserted island somewhere off of Fiji.

Any and all help would be greatly appericated. I love recording and I really want to "break into" the computer based stuff, but I'm on a very limited buget. I can spend 500 at the most and that's including the mics-to-computer-thing-a-ma-jig (pardon all my technical lingo)

THANK YOU VERY MUCH IN ADVANCE!!!!!

 

[tourettes5139]

Start packing those beach clothes.


j/k
4 mics for a computer interface isn't bad at all. With my current hardware setup, I could run 8, and soon I would be able to run 16, so 4 not a problem, as far as hardware in general is concerned.

Yes, multitrack recording software lets you adjust the levels, eq etc. of the different signals that you recorded, providing that you recorded them seperately.


For a mic-to-computer-thingy (which is called an interface, by the way ), I would check out M-Audio's stuff. I'm not real up on the different models and such, but I'm sure that someone else here could help you out with choosing a specific model. Sorry. But (almost) whatever interface that you pick, you will be able to use it with different software.

For the software, you could use Pro Tools Free, but you are limited to 8 tracks only, and no MIDI, if I remember correctly. Plus, you can't use the majority of the free plug-ins that are out there on the web with PT Free either. Cubase SE is only $99, and you can have 48 tracks, I think, and you can use VST plug-ins, which are the many, many free ones I mentioned earlier. Check out the Classic series by Kjerhaus (sp?) Audio, and www.kvraudio.com for some plug-ins. There are other sites, but the names escape me at the moment.

I'm assuming you already have reference monitors, you mentioned a mixer, so I won't talk about that stuff, (because you are switching over to computer, not starting from scratch) but if you have any other questions, just let me/us/whoever know, and we will do our best.

Hope that I helped.

P.S. - THANK YOU for using paragraphs. I don't mind long posts, but when people don't use the enter key, I sometimes don't even bother trying to read it.

 

[DavidK]

I personally would go with something like Cakewalk Home Studio, Cubase LE or N-Tracks. Audacity is free, I dont know it. The Cakewalk does a LOT for a small price, and plenty of plugins are out there for free.

A lot of the audio interfaces come with free software. My Maudio came with Ableton live, I havent tried it because I own SONAR. Keep that in mind when you look, some come with Cubase LE as well.

 

[JazzMasterWil]

Thanks for the fast responses guys!!! I really appericate the help.

This place seems way more "laid back" then over at harmony central. If I had 10 grand to spend on building a home studio, I certainly wouldn't be sweat going to a studio to do a 7 song e.p.......

It's kinda a catch 22 situation. And I think a few hundred dollars, spent stuff that I can use over and over again would be a far better investment then "some real studio time".

Ok, with that out of the way. I think I've found something that fits me perfectly. (And it has 8 mic inputs, and phantom power). Here's a link to the little system.

http://www.zzounds.com/a--2676837/item--PRSFIREPOD

What do you guys think about this? (I think it come with Cubase???) And I like the sound of free plug ins. Free is always a good price!

But, If I decide to buy that, what else would I need to buy?....... I mean I could use some monitors and a couple new mics and things like that (right now I'm using headphones and CAD drum mics), but I was talking more along the lines of....

"you'd need to by this cable to hook the interface up to the what-cha-ma-call-it-port in the back of your computer"

"you'd need to spend (X amount of money) on (X) sound card, and it would cost (X amount of money) to have somebody install the (X) sound card for you"

"your mics would need (X type) of adapters to be able to use this system"

And just any of that computer related stuff. This computer is mainly used for school work, ebay, and email. And that's about the extent of how much I know about computers.

B.T.W. this computer is a few years old, it's an E-Machine (but it does have windows XP). It has a sticker on it that says "intel inside.... celeron" and that's about all I know about it. Could anybody shed some insight as to wether or not my computer could even handle this kind of software. I know I'm not giving you much to go on, but here's a pic......

https://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c233/JazzMasterWil/rec007.jpg

Thank you so much!!! And I'm sorry if I'm babbling. I just tend to get very excited about "new toys" even before I get them. If you don't believe just ask my friends about the time I spent 600 dollars on mini-guitars in a month. (Ok I'll admit it, it was last month...... but they're just so cool!!!!!)

Ok, I'll shut up for real this time. But thanks a lot, and please keep the advice coming. It'll be a few weeks before the books I ordered arrive.

 

[something cool]

I wouldn't mess with Pro Tools Free -- it's based on Pro Tools 5.xx (IIRC), and Digi's up to version 7 now. Plus, it doesn't run on the latest OSes, so you'd need to get yourself a computer running Windows 98/Me or Mac OS 9. In addition to that, you only get 8 tracks of audio to work with. And no tech support. PT Free is meant strictly as a demo, and in truth I don't really know why Digi still offers it. (More info here)

In addition to checking out the M-Audio interfaces (as tourettes mentioned), I'd take a look at the Presonus Firepod. It's a little more ($600 on zZounds.com) than what your budget allows, but you get 8 mic (XLR) inputs, along with free Cubase LE software. As DavidK said, look for interfaces that come with free software, they're becoming more and more common everyday.

As far as which software to choose, it really doesn't matter a whole lot, but if you're on a tight budget I'd suggest making sure whatever you decide on is compatible with VST plug-ins. There's about a million and 1 free VST plug-ins floating around out there, so you can get started without breaking the bank.

Hope this helps and happy recording

EDIT: whoops, you beat me to the Firepod by 10 minutes!

Since it's a Firewire interface, all you'll need to hook it up to your computer is a Firewire port in your computer (a Windows eMachine? I'm guessing it doesn't have one). In that case you'll need to pick up a Firewire card for your system (check sites like tigerdirect.com for prices).

Aside from that, this diagram should help you figure out what else you might need to hook everything up.

And lastly, a Celeron will get you on your feet, but you probably won't be able to get too fancy with it. Plan on an upgrade in the relatively near future.

 

[DavidK]

This is 100 bucks cheaper

tascam

But, If I decide to buy that, what else would I need to buy?....... I mean I could use some monitors and a couple new mics and things like that (right now I'm using headphones and CAD drum mics), but I was talking more along the lines of....

"you'd need to by this cable to hook the interface up to the what-cha-ma-call-it-port in the back of your computer"

"you'd need to spend (X amount of money) on (X) sound card, and it would cost (X amount of money) to have somebody install the (X) sound card for you"

"your mics would need (X type) of adapters to be able to use this system"

You dont need anything else as far as cables, I am sure either come with a firewire cable. The units have XLR and line in, phantom Power, etc. The software is included and is just fine. The learning curve is steep, so dont worry about plugins, they come with plenty to get you going.

 

[JazzMasterWil]

That tascam looks pretty cool, and tascam is a name that I trust. I've never had anything but tascam units.

The first one recorder ever had was a very old porta studio 02, and then I upgraded to a dp-01, so it'd kinda make sense to take take the next step with them.

But then again, if the firepod would be a lot better in the long run, I wouldn't mind spending 100 more on it. I know I said 500 at the most, but 600 is a do-able price.

And you're totally right about me not needed to worry about plug-ins yet. The most complicated thing I have in my little rig now is a 31 band eq that I never use because it's too complicated.........

Anyways back to the main point. The firewire ports did not look all the expensive, but I might have been looking at the wrong thing.....

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1456367&CatId=510

Does that look about like what I need? If so, it's not the 40 dollars that's worrying me. It's the cost of having it installed..... do you think I could get it installed for cheap?

Ok, moving foward........ here's the quote from 'something cool' .......... "And lastly, a Celeron will get you on your feet, but you probably won't be able to get too fancy with it. Plan on an upgrade in the relatively near future."

How much with this cost to replace? I mean part wise....... Maybee I could get that done when I get the firewire port installed, that might save me a little bit on "labor" at the computer store.....

Here's the exact specs from the presonus.com

"Minimum computer system requirements:


Windows
• OS: Microsoft Windows XP"

Ok that's one check I have XP

"• Computer: Windows compatible computer with FireWire port."

A half check maybee.... I have windows but no firewire port.

"• CPU/Clock: Pentium, Athlon with 900Mhz or higher (1.5GHz)"

I don't even know what this means, so I'd don't think I have it......

"• Memory(RAM): 256 MB (512MB recommended)"

I'm not sure on how much RAM I have..... Could I buy some kind of something or other to get much RAM? (If so, the same "how much is this going to cost me?" question applys here.)


Am I getting so far up the price range here that'd it'd be cheaper to just buy another computer and dedicate it completely to recording? (If so, what's the "dirt cheap"-est thing I could get away with?)

I apologize for all the long post. I promise I will shut up for awhile and listen. Thanks again.

*Edit* I have to leave to go on a little "turkey day holiday" tommarow around lunch time. I'll be back thursday night. I just thought I'd let you guys know. Thanks again

 

[Kryptik]

I'd be surprized if you didn't meet the minimum spec if you're running XP.

One thing about the Firepod vs. Tascam is the Firepod comes eight mic pres where the Tascam only comes with four. You have the mixer so you really don't need the extra mic pres, but if you ever get rid of the mixer, you'd have to get separate mic pres in order to use all eight inputs.

Just thought I'd throw that in there.

Edit:

If you want to make sure that your computer meets the minimum, do this:
Click on Start -> Settings -> Control Pannel -> System Properties -> General Tab

All the info should be there.

 

[JazzMasterWil]

Edit:

If you want to make sure that your computer meets the minimum, do this:
Click on Start -> Settings -> Control Pannel -> System Properties -> General Tab

All the info should be there.

Ah ha! Thank you, I would of never found that one my own.... Here's the exact specs.

"Itel(R)
Celeron (R) Cpu 2.66GHz
2.66 GHz, 224 MB of RAM"

I'm definately higher than 1.5GHz
And 224 MB of RAM is really close to 256 (maybee enough to get away with.)

So maybee all I'd really need is the firewire port? (hopefully)

Thanks again!

 

[Wickermusic]

Ah ha! Thank you, I would of never found that one my own.... Here's the exact specs.

"Itel(R)
Celeron (R) Cpu 2.66GHz
2.66 GHz, 224 MB of RAM"

I'm definately higher than 1.5GHz
And 224 MB of RAM is really close to 256 (maybee enough to get away with.)

So maybee all I'd really need is the firewire port? (hopefully)

Thanks again!

You can get your hands on a firewire card pretty cheap these days...
However, I really think that 256 RAM will be your first hurdle......

The more the RAM the better as far as computer audio is concerned.
If you are in a position to get more ram put in it, I'd recommend it.

Personally I'd recommend a minimum of 512mb.... 1gb would be ideal.

 

[tourettes5139]

Yeah, the firepod is a GREAT option, I just didn't mention it because of your price range, although I probably should have. Oh well!

You would be able to install that firewire card no problem. It's easy.

I didn't realize that the Tascam was that cheap. Wow, I might have bought that instead of my MOTU 828 (mkI, not mkII). Sweet.

You would do well with either of those, but it comes down to whichever one you want, and whichever one fits your needs.

Good luck!!

 

[DavidK]

Ah ha! Thank you, I would of never found that one my own.... Here's the exact specs.

"Itel(R)
Celeron (R) Cpu 2.66GHz
2.66 GHz, 224 MB of RAM"

You probably have 256 RAM already, it just shares 32 with your video. Another 256 stick will get you where you need to be. They are cheap and usually easy to install.

I have a Compaq, AMD Sempron 3000 1.8 Ghz 512mb RAM. I can easily get 20+ tracks with some plugins.

 

[ibleedburgundy]

First and foremost, whoever came up with idea of a newbies forum is a genius.

I for some help over at the harmony central forums and one guys response was "buy a couple grams of snow and a patchbay"..... I also had a guy respond "Are you just making quick demo's? If so - save your cash for real studio time"............ I just had to let it slide... If they don't think you can make a great cd at home for cheap (*coughs* FUGAZI *coughs again*) that's their problem.

Which fugazi cd are you referring to? I thought Fugazi recorded at inner ear studios with the great Don Zentarra.

BTW, I agree with the point you were making. If you can't make great cd at home you probably don't have it in you to make anything great in the studio.

 

[JazzMasterWil]

The fugazi cd that I was refering to was the 13 songs disc (one of my all time favorites b.t.w.). I heard that they recorded it at home (this might not be true). But either that, it's a wonderful cd that doesn't sound very "produced" (imho). That music on that cd is just awesome. I really like the 13th song (I don't know the name, but it goes "words..... words and expressions").....

Anyways, I happened to run into my cousin over at thanksgiving dinner. He's a "sound engineer", he mainly does live sound, but he knows a good bit about recording as well..... He'd really be great to have around, but I only see him like once a year.

To make a long story short, he said that I should check out my USB interface options. He seems to think I could get a system of similar qualitity without having to completely upgrade my computer.

He's also under the impression that the Cubase program is pretty memory hungry, and that I might be able to find something of about eqaul qualitity that's a little easier on memory.

Is anybody out there using a usb interface? I've seem some of them in catologs and things, but I really don't know anything about them.

Thanks in advace.

 

[Cody Suit]

Which fugazi cd are you referring to? I thought Fugazi recorded at inner ear studios with the great Don Zentarra.

BTW, I agree with the point you were making. If you can't make great cd at home you probably don't have it in you to make anything great in the studio.

i think they did it themselves cuz ian mackaye owns Dischord Records. and my buddy has a dvd showing them recording in the dischord house. not sure what cd they were doing tho.

 

[Cody Suit]

He's also under the impression that the Cubase program is pretty memory hungry, and that I might be able to find something of about eqaul qualitity that's a little easier on memory.

not sure about the memory hunginess comparisson but i use cool edit pro. it's really simple/easy to use and its got tons of plugins with it. compressors, limiters, reverb, pitch/time shifting. you can use it with the firepod.

lots of people can usually find a way to get it for free.... or i think its like 100 bucks.... but yeh the firepod comes with cubase for free.. so... yeh....