Pre-Amps Again

  • Thread starter Thread starter FoulPhil
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FoulPhil

FoulPhil

Well-known member
Right now I have an Mbox 2 and I was thinking about upgrading to a 003 Rack+ and have 8 channels of mics with digidesign preamps. The only thing is I'll probably never need that many channels because I do mostly over dubbing and it's even rare I use more than 1 channel at a time...

Anyway, I always hear about people saying that the 003 preamps are a little better, but still aren't really so great.

So, I was thinking that it may be wiser to just buy a real nice pre-amp instead and run it into the mbox. Something around $1000 would be nice, but I can do more if it's going to be reallt worth doing more.

I've been told a lot of good things about the Focusrite ISA series preamps which range from $800 to $3000. At least the ones I've been looking at are in this price range.

They sell just the preamp with none of the extra features for around $800.

http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.co...lassic-Single-Channel-Mic-Pre-w-DI?sku=180258

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I'm not looking into how to get this or that sound with this or that preamp. I'm just wondering if all the preamp in this range are going to be fine with just suttle differences, or if there is a specific ass kicker in the lot that is a must have for truely professional results.

:D

That being said, my logic is this. All I need is a kick ass preamp, don't need all the compressors, EQs, Effects, ETC. I can add all that stuff with pro tools and waves.

I just need the preamp right? Not all the other crap?
 
You're in the wrong forum, and I've dropped a note to the mod team to move your thread to the correct one (The Rack).

In the meantime, preamps are overrated. Generally, in order of importance: Talent, then instruments, then room, then mics, then pres, then converters.
 
Let's put talent last on the list :D

I've been told timeless amounts of times and taken some online courses and all say that you need high end preamps.

So, my Jackson Kelly wont shred though the DI of a bad ass preamp? That's what you're telling me? LOL
 
Supercreep said:
You're in the wrong forum, and I've dropped a note to the mod team to move your thread to the correct one (The Rack).

In the meantime, preamps are overrated. Generally, in order of importance: Talent, then instruments, then room, then mics, then pres, then converters.
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FoulPhil said:
Let's put talent last on the list :D

I've been told timeless amounts of times and taken some online courses and all say that you need high end preamps.

So, my Jackson Kelly wont shred though the DI of a bad ass preamp? That's what you're telling me? LOL
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Maybe you do need high end preamps...if you've already got killer talent, great instruments, the perfect room, and awesome mics.

Seriously, the preamp thing is such a distraction. I spent (wasted!) so much time and money chasing down preamps because they seemed so sexy and important to the whole process. Well guess what? They don't make a lousy song sound good, or a lousy player sound good, or a lousy room or instrument sound good. Not to mention mic and mic placement! (Way more important, IMHO) And when all of those things are good--guess what else? I'll take most any preamp!

(I know, I just stepped on the third rail of recording. Oh well, it's the truth.)
 
When has anybody listened to a song and said, "Wow! Listen to that preamp!"?
 
Supercreep said:
When has anybody listened to a song and said, "Wow! Listen to that preamp!"?
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umm.. All through out recording history LOL. I'm the kind of guy who reads about this stuff for hours on end because for some reason I love hearing the stories about how all these classic albums were recorded.

I always download videos and take courses anything I can get my hands on. I've yet to find a one stop guide that tells you how to do everything. Matter of fact most of them are pretty shitty and a waste of money...

My point is they talk about the sounds they got from these preamps like from Focusrite, SSL, neve, etc. Taking into consideration these are the preamps that are supposed to be on these huge mixing boards in "MAJOR" studios.

You get what I'm saying?
 
Make sure your mic is over the top before you worry about the pre.
 
I build preamps. Preamps come in various flavors, but most of those flavors aren't very important. Low noise can be important. Get a decent low noise preamp and get on with your life. And don't use more gain that you really need.
 
So. do you think the digirack 003 preamps are good enough?
 
FoulPhil said:
So. do you think the digirack 003 preamps are good enough?
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I think you ought to record something with your 003 and post it in the mp3 clinic. One you digest all of the feedback you get, you'll be in a better position to assess where your money needs to be spent.

Not trying to put you down, but it seems you aren't real familiar with use of EQ, compression, etc. Your 003s will definitely be fine until you figure that out. They'll be fine until you learn mic positioning.

I mean, you can buy a $1K preamp now, but if your mic is in the wrong spot, it won't help. So what is your game plan? Because the stuff you record two years from today will be far better than what you record today. No gear can change that. You can always remix, but if you don't like your mic choice, or the mic position, or the room you recorded in--or the preamp, well then you have to retrack. Are you going to want to retrack everything every two years? Because you will always be getting better.

If you need a professional CD tomorrow, hire a professional studio. Otherwise, fire up your 003 and start learning.
 
dintymoore said:
A lot of people give me shit because I say this over and over but I think you need at least a U87. That's just my ears.
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Well if you can afford that, you'll have to pay me for consulting on your mixer :p
 
mshilarious said:
Well if you can afford that, you'll have to pay me for consulting on your mixer :p
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Hey if the gig scene was like it should be, I'd fly you to here and pay you to breath in the lead fumes! :)

When I bought my "expensive shit" it was in the time of project after good paying project ... I don't even watch the news anymore it's so depressing.


RE: the U87 - after going through this gear thing, if I was to start out again I'd beeline for a U87, any kind of used $30 interface, a free computer and $10 home stereo speakers. That's where I'd start. Then I'd start upgrading the rest. That's what I found out the hard way. After the song and the performance, the mic is the main thing. I know lots of people disagree, remember I'm just 1 guy out of 6.5 billion and people have been telling me I'm wrong since day 1.
 
I did post a few songs in the MP3 clinic, but no one ever said I should do this or that. I try to use the least amount of compression and EQ. I actrually only use compression on things that I know actually need it and I only use EQ to ballance out all the instruments. Every now and then I may use EQ just to improve the sound of something, but I try not to have to do that.

I'm not one of those guys who's set in once specific style of muisc either. :D
 
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How's your room? Monitoring chain? Converters? I'd look at all of that before you worry about a high end preamp. If the room you're recording in sounds like crap it won't matter if you're recording through $10,000 worth of front end...it'll still sound like crap. If you can't trust the room from a mixing standpoint, you'll never be able to do anything with whatever you record anyhow.

Frank
 
You guys are 100% right :D

I just listened to about 7 different preamps. Behringer, Mbox, Something from Yamaha, An $800 Universal Audio Solo/610. Both with the SM57 and the U87.

Even with the $800 dollar preamp the SM57 sounded kind of weak and hollow, but the U87 sounds much much better.

The only thing is I don't think I can afford $3,429.00...
 
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