Performance Simulator
- Thread starter Nola
- Start date
keith.rogers
Well-known member
Just set up a camera and simply record yourself doing a set then watch it, non-stop, from start to end, preferably with a friend. You probably won't have the "stage fright" experience, but unless you're already polished, it will expose all the rough edges, fumbling and other things that become amplified live.
And, unless you're working up an Ozzy tribute, really pay attention to your expression. If it looks like you're sitting in the dentist's waiting room, practice walking around with a smile on your face for a solid hour at a time. The most entertaining performers look like they're having a great time, so the audience thinks they're having one too. That's usually practiced. (Though, some may just have better drugs, but probably not so much these days
).
And, unless you're working up an Ozzy tribute, really pay attention to your expression. If it looks like you're sitting in the dentist's waiting room, practice walking around with a smile on your face for a solid hour at a time. The most entertaining performers look like they're having a great time, so the audience thinks they're having one too. That's usually practiced. (Though, some may just have better drugs, but probably not so much these days
).
Nola
Well-known member
There is no substitute for playing in front of people, certainly not a video projection.
Well, that wasn't the question, though.
So they answer is "no" you don't know of anything similar to download?
miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
I think the best way...and something that's just happened sorta naturally for most musicians...is to simply work your way up, by first "performing" for Mom and Dad and Sis...then maybe in front of the whole family and friends during a BBQ...then at your local high-school garage band competition or dance or recital...and from there maybe to a real "gig" of sorts, or if you are doing classical music, you often enter a variety of competitions...and eventually to some serious audience gigs.
I think it's hard to fool yourself that you are performing in front of a live audience with any kind projection system. I mean...really...it's just not the same, and if that's all someone uses as prep, they will probably be somewhat shocked and frozen even, when their standing in front a larger live audience.
Back when I was taking classical piano lessons...I went to a few recitals. It was all kids' stuff, but serious playing and in front a full auditorium.
Boy...there was more than one case of stage fright I witnessed...
...because it was a first for some kids in front of a live (unknown) audience.
It's not just kids...there are adults who choke up. Go to some open mic nights, and watch some of the first-timers.
I think it's hard to fool yourself that you are performing in front of a live audience with any kind projection system. I mean...really...it's just not the same, and if that's all someone uses as prep, they will probably be somewhat shocked and frozen even, when their standing in front a larger live audience.
Back when I was taking classical piano lessons...I went to a few recitals. It was all kids' stuff, but serious playing and in front a full auditorium.
Boy...there was more than one case of stage fright I witnessed...
...because it was a first for some kids in front of a live (unknown) audience.It's not just kids...there are adults who choke up. Go to some open mic nights, and watch some of the first-timers.
Nola
Well-known member
Thanks, miroslav. That's helpful. I have performed before to moderate audiences. Just not in a long time. So I wanted to work back into it slowly. To me the projector is silly for sure but also a good way to start really slowly. I'm not even ready to play for mom and dad right now since it's been forever. Maybe the dogs...lol.
I realize the simulator looks silly on the surface, but if something helps then it helps, and for me personally it would. If it wouldn't for someone else, cool, then they don't have to use it. I just can't find one to download and put on the big screen and was wondering if anyone knew of one.
I realize the simulator looks silly on the surface, but if something helps then it helps, and for me personally it would. If it wouldn't for someone else, cool, then they don't have to use it. I just can't find one to download and put on the big screen and was wondering if anyone knew of one.
rob aylestone
Moderator
With great respect to the Royal College of Music, this is laughable. I cannot see that it reflects in any way apart from physical staging, a real performance - and the students of the RCM have all been performing in public for years, and continue to do throughout their time there. A pseudo audience doesn't scare you like a real one can do sometimes. Practice with lights in your eyes can get you used to it, but adrenaline is very difficult to source from a video, and no possibility of real disaster.
The best thing that happened to me was being booed off early in my career. Two shows, one night - ten miles between on a New Years eve. First for a rowdy dinner suited audience who'd had food and lots of drink. It went down amazingly well, by the time we started at the next venue, they just wanted to party, and we were not right for the venue at all - they started to boo and yell - off off off and worse. The manager stopped us, paid us off and we went home. Wrong band, wrong audience, wrong time of the night. I can still remember the hostility - a bit like the scene in the Blues Brothers. NOTHING has been as bad ever since then. Since then, I have been on stage as a performer, on stage as a compere, and on one night, on stage in front of fifteen hundred people telling them the show was over at the interval as a water leak had killed all the equipment in the interval - and they were really hostile. Now nothing phases me and the only thing that stresses me is when things are going wrong, before we start. Once I'm on, I actually enjoy it - especially when things go wrong and we have to improvise.
If you want to tighten up your physical performance, between songs, perhaps - then I don't have much faith in this thing - I'd suggest just doing out and exposure - if you are terrified of performing in front of an audience, find one that will be kinder? Depends on if you are solo or a group - but I would work with real folk, not simulations.
The best thing that happened to me was being booed off early in my career. Two shows, one night - ten miles between on a New Years eve. First for a rowdy dinner suited audience who'd had food and lots of drink. It went down amazingly well, by the time we started at the next venue, they just wanted to party, and we were not right for the venue at all - they started to boo and yell - off off off and worse. The manager stopped us, paid us off and we went home. Wrong band, wrong audience, wrong time of the night. I can still remember the hostility - a bit like the scene in the Blues Brothers. NOTHING has been as bad ever since then. Since then, I have been on stage as a performer, on stage as a compere, and on one night, on stage in front of fifteen hundred people telling them the show was over at the interval as a water leak had killed all the equipment in the interval - and they were really hostile. Now nothing phases me and the only thing that stresses me is when things are going wrong, before we start. Once I'm on, I actually enjoy it - especially when things go wrong and we have to improvise.
If you want to tighten up your physical performance, between songs, perhaps - then I don't have much faith in this thing - I'd suggest just doing out and exposure - if you are terrified of performing in front of an audience, find one that will be kinder? Depends on if you are solo or a group - but I would work with real folk, not simulations.
spantini
COO of me, inc.
I reckon the original question has been addressed well enough, so if you don't mind I'll throw in another war story..
For me, it was the old 'sink or swim'. First time on a big stage, I couldn't face the audience - I was the bass player, so I had to face the drummer . I had my full back to the audience, even though I couldn't see a soul due to the stage lighting. Only when we got lots of applause after the first song did I begin to slowly face the audience. After that, I just played as if we were practicing in a very large basement. I even looked up and out into the blinding lights directly at the audience - it became a fun thing to do.
For me, it was the old 'sink or swim'. First time on a big stage, I couldn't face the audience - I was the bass player, so I had to face the drummer
. I had my full back to the audience, even though I couldn't see a soul due to the stage lighting. Only when we got lots of applause after the first song did I begin to slowly face the audience. After that, I just played as if we were practicing in a very large basement. I even looked up and out into the blinding lights directly at the audience - it became a fun thing to do.
mjbphotos
Moderator
No, I don't.
From my personal experience - over 20 years between stage appearances - doing it with friends is a good 'restart'. Find some local open jams or open mics you can attend, generally these events will be less judgmental, and chances are that there will be people there more nervous and with less experience than you.
Nola
Well-known member
Cool, thanks, yeah I'm starting with an open mic. In a way the small crowd and intimacy of that is worse than a larger crowd because you can see every face and hear every noise/comment (lol), but I want to restart playing out and that seems the best and easiest way to get started. My biggest fear is my hands tensing up. Sometimes when recording a difficult part that happens, and when they're tense it becomes nearly impossible to strum and pick properly. Eventually it goes away, and I record the part. So, I don't really know how I'll react live since it's been over a decade since I played live, and if that tensing up happens it will really suck. Oh well. I guess I have to just accept that's part of the risk of playing live and getting songs out there.
spantini
COO of me, inc.
I restarted live performances in 2010 after an absence of 15+ years. It was in a large, brightly lit (all overhead fluorescent lighting) dining room with an audience of around 60 - the front row was maybe 8 feet from me and we're all at floor level. I chose an original instrumental number specifically so's not to have to sing awkwardly, and it was a good idea since I was so nervous I was visibly shaking and could hardly hold chord positions. I missed many finer notes but the main parts of the tune came through well enough to garner a burst of applause. After that, all my tension melted away and I squeezed in a second song with vocal with no problems (my slightly recomposed version of Jimi's All Along The Watchtower done on 6-string acoustic). That's the most terrified I've ever been in front of an audience, and it cured me forever.
One thing I've learned - The audience doesn't hear things as you do. When you present material which is new to them they can't tell when you fudge a part or leave something out or add something extra, unless you do it so awkwardly it's incredibly obvious (then make a joke about it and just start it over). So just behave as though you're supposed to be there doing what you're doing and doing it whichever way it comes out. And be sure to say "Thank you!" - that too will help to relax you.
Be one with the audience (bing bing bing bing bing.. fades out
).
One thing I've learned - The audience doesn't hear things as you do. When you present material which is new to them they can't tell when you fudge a part or leave something out or add something extra, unless you do it so awkwardly it's incredibly obvious (then make a joke about it and just start it over). So just behave as though you're supposed to be there doing what you're doing and doing it whichever way it comes out. And be sure to say "Thank you!" - that too will help to relax you.
Be one with the audience (bing bing bing bing bing.. fades out
).
Nola
Well-known member
Oh man, exactly. It's like death claw where your hand won't move right. It happens sometimes when I record, though I'm a lot better now after a lot of recording. Funny I read a quote by Chopin recently saying he had the same problem and he felt performing was an unnatural thing...so even virtuosos get it.
spantini
COO of me, inc.
Arrrrgh! The Giant Claw !
Interesting. To this day, whenever I set up to record, or have done so in the past, I always have a nervous difficulty getting through the first couple of takes - different from the playing live problem. I'm so self conscious I can't concentrate enough to stay in the moment, then I always jump to the wrong section and blow that take. This has gotten better recently, but only a little.
My first ever recording session was as a bass player in our band (all originals). One song opened with a solo bass intro for the first 8 measures. That took a few takes, let me tell ya.
Interesting. To this day, whenever I set up to record, or have done so in the past, I always have a nervous difficulty getting through the first couple of takes - different from the playing live problem. I'm so self conscious I can't concentrate enough to stay in the moment, then I always jump to the wrong section and blow that take. This has gotten better recently, but only a little.
My first ever recording session was as a bass player in our band (all originals). One song opened with a solo bass intro for the first 8 measures. That took a few takes, let me tell ya.
miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
When I was a kid I was pretty shy (hard to believe now 
)...though strangely, I was never bothered by playing music in front of others, and I was doing the piano recital competition thing when I was maybe 10-11 years old in big auditoriums. I wasn't some virtuoso piano player...and I think mostly I would just focus on the task and ignore the audience because I was trying not to fuck up.
I also spent a lot of time playing guitar and piano for fun with friends and in school...so I just sort of rolled with it even during my youth and teens.
When I got older and put together my first band...it was a pretty big deal, I mean it wasn't your usual garage band thing, it was straight to serious gigs.
Even as the band was forming/rehearsing, we already had guaranteed gigs, for good money...mostly because people knew I could play, and that we were taking it seriously, and because we knew it was a real band and we had agreements to fulfill...so we all stepped up and rehearsed a lot, sounded good, and the stage butterflies were gone after that first couple of tunes.
I know it's hard for some folks, no matter how good you play. We had another guitar player in one band, and he could play great during practices...but on stage he would always have anxiety, and when he took a lead, he was never as comfortable as during practices.
After we did a bunch of gigs, he ended up leaving the band because of that ...much to everyone's disappointment. We tried hard to persuade him to stay and said that it would get better...but man, he just couldn't shake the anxiety.
Best advice I could give is to focus on your playing, and try hard to take an "I don't give a fuck" attitude...
...not about the playing, but about the fact that there are all these people listening.
My view was...that even on my shit performance moments, I was on the stage and they weren't...meaning, I had the guts to play in front of them, and just by being there to listen, they were showing some respect for that.
You have to let yourself go...completely...and know that having even some talent and willpower is a LOT more than the majority of folks have who are there listening.
I mean...it's not like everyone in the audience is a master musician, and they're going to critique the shit out of you if you are not 100% perfect.
)...though strangely, I was never bothered by playing music in front of others, and I was doing the piano recital competition thing when I was maybe 10-11 years old in big auditoriums. I wasn't some virtuoso piano player...and I think mostly I would just focus on the task and ignore the audience because I was trying not to fuck up. I also spent a lot of time playing guitar and piano for fun with friends and in school...so I just sort of rolled with it even during my youth and teens.
When I got older and put together my first band...it was a pretty big deal, I mean it wasn't your usual garage band thing, it was straight to serious gigs.
Even as the band was forming/rehearsing, we already had guaranteed gigs, for good money...mostly because people knew I could play, and that we were taking it seriously, and because we knew it was a real band and we had agreements to fulfill...so we all stepped up and rehearsed a lot, sounded good, and the stage butterflies were gone after that first couple of tunes.
I know it's hard for some folks, no matter how good you play. We had another guitar player in one band, and he could play great during practices...but on stage he would always have anxiety, and when he took a lead, he was never as comfortable as during practices.
After we did a bunch of gigs, he ended up leaving the band because of that ...much to everyone's disappointment. We tried hard to persuade him to stay and said that it would get better...but man, he just couldn't shake the anxiety.
Best advice I could give is to focus on your playing, and try hard to take an "I don't give a fuck" attitude...
...not about the playing, but about the fact that there are all these people listening.My view was...that even on my shit performance moments, I was on the stage and they weren't...meaning, I had the guts to play in front of them, and just by being there to listen, they were showing some respect for that.
You have to let yourself go...completely...and know that having even some talent and willpower is a LOT more than the majority of folks have who are there listening.
I mean...it's not like everyone in the audience is a master musician, and they're going to critique the shit out of you if you are not 100% perfect.
Nola
Well-known member
Thanks, guys, good advice. I'm going to have two singers up there with me as well so I just have to play guitar. This should help bc it takes focus off me. Wish we had a drummer. The noise of drums takes a lot of pressure off guitar. It's an acoustic guitar venue where you plug into a PA. This is causing the most anxiety because I'll be the only person playing an instrument and PAs are pretty unforgiving to acoustics from what I've experienced. Also this venue has those bright/white lights right on your face. Oh well! We have a few practices before the performance so I'll just practice with people staring in mind. If you don't hear back from me it probably means I popped an artery and died. At least I'll die doing what I love!
What is with "the claw"!? When practicing I play so relaxed to the point I drop my pick all the time...yet in front of people it's the death claw. So annoying. Argh!
What is with "the claw"!? When practicing I play so relaxed to the point I drop my pick all the time...yet in front of people it's the death claw. So annoying. Argh!
mjbphotos
Moderator
^^^This!^^^ There are always those (in the audience) who will not be paying attention, or talking or doing something else. Learn to ignore them, focus on one person at a time who seems to be paying attention.
Playing at an open mic at a bar is better than at a 'listening room'-type environment because there is background noise, people are liquoring up, etc.
I never have the tensing-up problem when recording, but playing live (solo) for sure. Since you've got other people doing the singing, that does take 1/2 the pressure off of you - make sure you rehearse a couple of times. "Know the material" makes a real difference. It's very tempting to use a guitar tab, or lyrics/chords - most open mics have a stand available - but you should focus on knowing the songs without 'cheating' - at least to start out with. It takes some skill to play/sing while reading lyrics/chords and still make it sound good. I've had people come up to me and say 'how do you remember all the lyrics?' when I had a music stand right in front of me (but low).
miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
I also suggest for the whole band's benefit...pick 2-3 songs you guys could do in your sleep without even thinking about them as your first songs.
Easy, good sounding ice-breakers, preferably uptempo, since it get both the crowd and you guys tapping and moving a bit...and the minute you feel that positive vibe from the crowd and/or from within the band...you'll instantly feel more relaxed.