Perfect timing or not while recording?

[zenabi]

While recording is it necessary to use the metronome when each band member is recording seperately? Or is there a way to "stretch" the song into proper timing if off timing while recording? Obviously I'm only talking about being a few bpm off the path. Nothing dramatic. We use Sony Acid Pro 5.0 to edit etc. Thanks.

 

[MadAudio]

Since Acid is tempo-based, my suggestion is to use a click or drum loop. There are ways to strech the audio, but if you're recording a whole song length track for any given instrument, it can get tricky.

 

[Cloneboy Studio]

My opinion is if you can't record in time, you shouldn't be recording--you should be practicing.

 

[zenabi]

Thanks....

Well it isn't that we can't play in time but, one of our guitar players has a really tough time with the click track or metronome. Which obviously makes it very hard to record. I'm simply looking for a good remedy for him. I prefer the metronome myself and it would obviously be much easier to have everyone on the same page but, right now that isn't the case. -Zen

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

Well it isn't that we can't play in time but, one of our guitar players has a really tough time with the click track or metronome.

Which means he can't play in time! (And therefore, needs to be practicing more!!)

 

[scrubs]

Well it isn't that we can't play in time but, one of our guitar players has a really tough time with the click track or metronome. Which obviously makes it very hard to record. I'm simply looking for a good remedy for him. I prefer the metronome myself and it would obviously be much easier to have everyone on the same page but, right now that isn't the case. -Zen

Once the drums are laid down, I tend to use them instead of a click. However, that may not help if your guitarist can't keep time with the drums, either.

 

[giraffe]

doesn't sound like a click problem to me.................

 

[mick8569]

time stretching wont help if ur timing is all over the place, would only be any good if it was recorded in time but at a different tempo

 

[RAMI]

Not that this is the solution, because if the guy can't play in time, he's got problems. But, as was mentioned above, program a simple drum beat on a drum machine, or loop a simple drum beat from your drummer. It's a lot easier to play to that then just a click...but he still needs to practice.

 

[Cloneboy Studio]

Well it isn't that we can't play in time but, one of our guitar players has a really tough time with the click track or metronome. Which obviously makes it very hard to record. I'm simply looking for a good remedy for him.

Solutions:

1.) Get a guitarist that can play. Believe it or not but TIMING is as important as pitch... maybe more important.

2.) Get ready for punch-in-O-RAMA! while you contend with his miserable playing.

3.) When he isn't looking have someone else play it right and delete his weak tracks.

4.) Make him practice the part for a few weeks.

5.) Give him an electrical shock everytime he falls off beat.

 

[zenabi]

ok...ok.....ok....

So I get my initiation to this website on the first day! Thanks for making me feel right at home everybody!!! Believe it or not, it all sounds like great advice! -Zen

 

[gecko zzed]

Having a musician that has difficulty in matching the tempo laid down in preceding tracks is very frustrating. If a drum track exists and they can't follow that, then there is not a lot you can do. If there isn't a drum track (but the other tracks are synched to a click), then you can create one that might make it easier. Alternatively, recording the the whole thing in chunks might make it work. Stretching or squeezing audio files to get beats to line up is a tedious activity that you would want to avoid. Most audio editing programs have this facility somewhere in their arsenal of tools.

 

[XLR]

And there's always note-by-note cut and paste editing if that doesn't drive you crazy. Better though to just do it with a tight rhythm in the performance. Playing to a click is an aquired skill and just takes a little practice to get to where it doesn't feel mechanically confining. Whole different thing than playing tightly together live.

Tim

 

[xstatic]

Personally, I usually turn the click track off after the drum tracks are laid. I do however automate it back for parts without drums or for breaks. Basically, once the drum tracks are laid the click doesn't matter. In my opinion its better for the other players to follow the drums, whether they be right or wrong, unless there is a major issue which means the drums need to be redone.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

If a guitarist can play OK live with the drummer but has problems palying back to a recording of the drummer or with a click track because the "energy is not the same", the perhaps you could try recording the guitar direct while recording the drums. Once the take is done, take the direct guitar recording and send it back out to the am to record it again through the amp ("re-amp") it to get the amp sound without the bleed form the drum.

The downsides to this are your options are limited when it comes to re-takes and punches, and that if the guitarist doesn't accept his limitations, suggesting this method might put him off a bit.

G.

 

[snow lizard]

Another vote for switching the click off if the drum tracks are laid down in time.

Auxiliary vote for more practice.

If the guitarist can follow the drummer, and if the drummer can follow the click, it might just be something as simple as not being used to the feel of a metronome. It's easier to get a handle on the feel of the timing when you can clearly follow the right downbeats, but there's still a huge advantage to being able to play with a click.

Having said that, as a bass player it's important to be on time, but also to lock into what the drums (especially kick) are doing. I'd rather work to a finished drum track than a click for bass, just to get the right feel rather than because I can't play to a click. Personal preference.

It used to throw me a bit trying to play to a drum machine/metronome, but it seemed fairly easy to grow into after a short while practicing with it. It improved my playing a lot, and it's a simple thing to arrive at through regular practice. The only downside is that any time I play with a drummer that goes out of time, it's pretty obvious.

This sucks real hard when I'm the drummer.

Best case scenario is that your guitarist just has some kind of mental block when playing to a click track. Some people are like that and do fine without the click.

If you want to rely on editing to correct timing mistakes, you might find it cumbersome. Results can be less than stellar.


sl

 

[Cloneboy Studio]

Some moron neg rep'd me for saying if you can't play in time you shouldn't be recording. So who's the wiseass noob that did it?

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

Some moron neg rep'd me for saying if you can't play in time you shouldn't be recording. So who's the wiseass noob that did it?

Some fuckwit did the same to me for my comment.... if they were serious, it just shows how clueless they really are!

 

[TuoKaerf]

Some moron neg rep'd me for saying if you can't play in time you shouldn't be recording. So who's the wiseass noob that did it?

Lame. I engineered/produced a session a few weeks ago where the drummer couldn't keep his feet with the click (a lot of bad double kick). I tried a loop, same results. I suggest that we trigger the kick, and the drummer got quite pissed at me for even mentioning it. It took 8 hours to record 2 1/2 songs.

So we finish the project, I mix the songs, and pass them off to the band to get them mastered wherever they want to. I get an e-mail from the band, telling me how crappy their recording is (although they loved the mix), asking why the chorus is 8 clicks faster than the verses, and telling me its all my fault.

Lesson learned-spend more time checking out a band that wants a recording. Pre-production saves some valuable time.

 

[IronFlippy]

Lame. I engineered/produced a session a few weeks ago where the drummer couldn't keep his feet with the click (a lot of bad double kick). I tried a loop, same results. I suggest that we trigger the kick, and the drummer got quite pissed at me for even mentioning it. It took 8 hours to record 2 1/2 songs.

So we finish the project, I mix the songs, and pass them off to the band to get them mastered wherever they want to. I get an e-mail from the band, telling me how crappy their recording is (although they loved the mix), asking why the chorus is 8 clicks faster than the verses, and telling me its all my fault.

Lesson learned-spend more time checking out a band that wants a recording. Pre-production saves some valuable time.

Sounds like the daily adventures of the Mixerman !