Perfect Demon

  • Thread starter Thread starter Yonce N Mild
  • Start date Start date
Wow! It seems I have achieved perfect mediocrity. Not bad enough to flame not good enough to comment.
Thing is I think this is a great song. I must have really fucked up the tracking/mixing to make it so uninteresting.


How depressing............. back to the drawing board.
 
All comments and criticisms appreciated.
It's far from perfect. How can I do better next time?

http://soundclick.com/share?songid=7135574


Intro reminds me of Rusty Cage/Soundgarden. I like that. Drums are buried in the mix a bit much as well as the vocals. The whole thing is a bit muddy. The heavier vocals sound a bit distorted. The overall vocal mix seems a bit too processed. I dig the song but a little more time on the recording could really do it some justice. What was your set up?
 
I always count on waiting at least 24 hours to get feedback around here. (This post is coming 16 hours after your original, so you're good!)

The panning at the beginning is really strange. Why does it move from right to left once?

A lot of your drums sounded a little weak. i.e. your snare rattles for too long after a hit, especially on the lighter hits.

The whole track could use more low end. Turn up the bass guitar and/or eq the rhythm guitars a little lower.

The song does sound like it has potential, but it definitely needs some work.
 
Intro reminds me of Rusty Cage/Soundgarden. I like that. Drums are buried in the mix a bit much as well as the vocals. The whole thing is a bit muddy. The heavier vocals sound a bit distorted. The overall vocal mix seems a bit too processed. I dig the song but a little more time on the recording could really do it some justice. What was your set up?

Thanks for the feedback!

This is my first full out attempt at recording real drums. I used MXL 603s for overheads MXL 991 for snare and a SM57 for the kick. I used the preamps on my behringer mixer for the drums.
My previous attempts at using the 57 for the kick resulted in a very boomy kick. This time I over compensated and it came out very clicky. I ended up triggering the kick using a free drum replacer plug. So the kick sound is a mix of the real kick from the overheads and a sample.

Guitars are fender hotrod 4x10 with a 57 on one speaker and a modded MXL 990 a few feet back pointed at a different speaker. The two different mics are panned to opposite sides for both lead and rhythm.

The Bass is DI through a bass V-Amp. I wasn't happy with the sound at all once I got into the mix. Way too much low end and no definition.

Vox: Modded 990 again through my TC Helicon vocal pedals. I am actually really happy with the vox especially the backing vox. They are a bit distorted but it's deliberate. I tried several different mics for the lead vox and the 990 seemed to work best. I usually record a wet and dry signal when I record vox but this time I slapped the correct pedal(pitch correction compression) on the dry channel and I wish I hadn't. Overall though I'm pretty pleased.

The panning at the beginning is really strange. Why does it move from right to left once?
It's because the rhythm guitar is panned slightly right so once the lead guitar and drums join in it makes it sound like everything jumps left. I have mixed feeling about this effect as well.

A lot of your drums sounded a little weak. i.e. your snare rattles for too long after a hit, especially on the lighter hits.
Yes! That is annoying the hell out of me! No matter how loud I make them they still sound weak. I think those drums are in serious need of new heads.
I also made a mistake in the tracking process. We recorded a scratch track with the drummer playing to a click. Then we recorded just the drums with the drummer playing along with that scratch track.
Problem was there were drums on the scratch track. I think sometimes he wasn't hitting as hard as he should have because he was already hearing the drums blasting in his ear no matter how hard he hit them.
Do you think the drums sound dead? Would new heads help? What about the cymbals?

The whole track could use more low end. Turn up the bass guitar and/or eq the rhythm guitars a little lower.

The song does sound like it has potential, but it definitely needs some work.

I was thinking it was too muddy. I think it has low end but it's not defined enough. It lacks punch. Which is upsetting because this song really has balls when we play it live.
I'm hoping that new heads on the drums will help especially during the tom driven parts. I'll try rolling a little more off the bottom of the rhythm guitar and see if that helps.


Does anyone else think the bass is too low? Most of my mixes come out bass heavy so I may have over compensated.


Thanks again for the feedback guys!
 
Hey Yonce!
This is a great song, it just needs some adjusting. Drums sound a bit too muffled. The guitars are just right compared to the voice, but really out in front compared to everything else. Solo sounds above everything else. If you had a pumping, purring bass which hits you right in the belly, it would make a big difference. So you see, it's just a matter of getting your levels and EQing and compressing right so that all the pieces of the puzzle fit together. Nonetheless, great song and I really dig the voice (reminds me of Creed's first album....) and the guitar sound. Keep working at it, it has loads of potential! ;):)

Joe
 
Hey Yonce!
This is a great song, it just needs some adjusting. Drums sound a bit too muffled. The guitars are just right compared to the voice, but really out in front compared to everything else. Solo sounds above everything else. If you had a pumping, purring bass which hits you right in the belly, it would make a big difference. So you see, it's just a matter of getting your levels and EQing and compressing right so that all the pieces of the puzzle fit together. Nonetheless, great song and I really dig the voice (reminds me of Creed's first album....) and the guitar sound. Keep working at it, it has loads of potential! ;):)

Joe

I'm glad other people are hearing what I'm hearing. Makes me feel like I'm on the right track. I'm getting to the point with tracking vocals and guitars where I can actually get a consistent decent sound. having a well treated room has made a world of difference too.

Drums are a bastard though. I'm not sure any eq or compression is going to get those drums to sound the way I want them to. I think I need a decent kick drum mic and some new heads on the kit. I'm also considering close micing the toms.

I haven't ever been happy with a single recording I've done with that bass v-amp. I think the main problem is our bassist always has the thing with him so I don't get much time to really dig into it on my own. I'm sure it's capable of good sounds. It sounds great at practice. I recently got my ACMP -73 from the group buy and used it to track some bass and I love it. I'm really looking forward to trying that out on this song.

I think you're right about the geetars. I need to stop listening to my guitarists when they say "It sounds good but the guitars need to be a touch louder." They say that every time.............. I guess I should have learned by now.
When you say the solo sounds above everything else do you mean too loud or just not sitting right? I did crank up the solo because I love it! Maybe I got carried away.

I'm thrilled that you like my voice. That's quite a compliment coming from you!
 
I'm glad other people are hearing what I'm hearing. Makes me feel like I'm on the right track. I'm getting to the point with tracking vocals and guitars where I can actually get a consistent decent sound. having a well treated room has made a world of difference too.

Drums are a bastard though. I'm not sure any eq or compression is going to get those drums to sound the way I want them to. I think I need a decent kick drum mic and some new heads on the kit. I'm also considering close micing the toms.

I haven't ever been happy with a single recording I've done with that bass v-amp. I think the main problem is our bassist always has the thing with him so I don't get much time to really dig into it on my own. I'm sure it's capable of good sounds. It sounds great at practice. I recently got my ACMP -73 from the group buy and used it to track some bass and I love it. I'm really looking forward to trying that out on this song.

I think you're right about the geetars. I need to stop listening to my guitarists when they say "It sounds good but the guitars need to be a touch louder." They say that every time.............. I guess I should have learned by now.
When you say the solo sounds above everything else do you mean too loud or just not sitting right? I did crank up the solo because I love it! Maybe I got carried away.

I'm thrilled that you like my voice. That's quite a compliment coming from you!

The solo sounds great! The way I hear it is it should sink into the mix a little bit more but still stand out. Maybe compress it a bit? That's what I do with my songs. Like I said it's just levels.....:)
Have you tried putting some kind of tube simulating plugin on the bass? And then boosting the lows between 50 and 100 Hz and the mids at around 2500 Khz with a narrow Q? Works pretty good for me ;)
 
You may need to retrack to fix it, but I think that if you tightened the snare on the snare drum, you'd get a punchier, snappier tone out of it. New drum heads might help too; I'm not all that familiar with drums.
 
Have you tried putting some kind of tube simulating plugin on the bass? And then boosting the lows between 50 and 100 Hz and the mids at around 2500 Khz with a narrow Q? Works pretty good for me ;)
I'll give that a shot. A little bit o' fuzz on the bass is great idea!

You may need to retrack to fix it, but I think that if you tightened the snare on the snare drum, you'd get a punchier, snappier tone out of it. New drum heads might help too; I'm not all that familiar with drums.

Great ear! It doesn't just need tightened it needs replaced! I was at my brother's place checking out the drumset last night and noticed that several of the wires were busted on the snare.:(
No wonder I had to eq so much snare rattle out of the toms.

I also think me playing the drums back to the drummer while he tracked caused him too hit rather inconsistently.

Despite the poor condition of the snare I'm pretty happy with the way that 991 captured it. That might be my go to snare mic from now on.



This is definitely getting re-tracked. I won't have a chance again until late January though.

I'm trying to make it work with what I have. So far it really helped me make a to do /not to do list for the next tracking session.

To do:

1. New drum heads, new snare!
2. Spend some time and dial in a decent kick sound!(maybe try some different mics)
3. Put some work in on the bass tone. Specifically more attack/mids less mud.
4. Record a totally dry vocal track.
5. Don't get lazy with the guitars. I had to eq out some ringing at around 20k can I fix that in tracking?
6. Close mic toms.

Not to do:
1. Don't put the drums from the scratch track in the drummers cans when he is recording!
2. Don't forget to remind our drummer to hit the snare like it robbed his momma.



Anybody got anything to add to the list?

I'm gonna keep working on this mix so I'm sure I'll have some stuff to add soon enough.

Thanks for all the help guys!
 
sounds pretty boxy but that might be intentional...ultimately for me personally i cannot comment on this because it washes over me and leaves me totally unaffected....its not good ..its not bad...it just is.
 
sounds pretty boxy but that might be intentional...ultimately for me personally i cannot comment on this because it washes over me and leaves me totally unaffected....its not good ..its not bad...it just is.

Perfect mediocrity I knew it!
I think I'd prefer you hating it, rather that it leaving you totally unaffected.:o

I agree that the song lacks impact. I can assure you that is not the case when we preform this song live. That tells me that at some point I managed to suck the life out of this track.:(

Dead drums perhaps. I also think that the vocal performance is lacking passion. Technically it's a good performance but it seems to be lacking the emotion it needs. Maybe? Timing is a little iffy in a few spots too.

I'm definitely re tracking this entire thing. Every time we do this it's an awesome learning experience for me. SO frustrating but so much freaking fun at the same time!:cool:

If anyone else has any suggestions I'm all ears.

Here's a question for the drummers out there. What type of drum heads would you recommend for recording this type of music? I don't think my drummer has a specific preference.

Thanks again everyone!
 
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