Patchbay Connections

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kiwimike

New member
Hi everyone.

I’m a newbie here, so please bear with me...

I’m a NZ singer-songwriter currently based in Germany. You can check-out my material on my MySpace site - just go to myspace.com and search "Mike Brosnan..."

There's 4 songs from my current album, plus 2 from a soon-to-be-released live CD/concert DVD. Everything there has been mixed by me…

I’ve searched the archives here thoroughly but whilst there's many posts that answer parts of my question, I'm unable to find a complete answer. I’m hoping someone here can help?

First a bit of background:

After 10 years mixing “in the box” I wanna do at least some of my mixing in the analogue domain. To this end I’ve purchased a Sound Workshop 1280B (with 8 x “Super EQ’s) which has been heavily hot-rodded – external power supply, re-capped, op-amps replaced, etc…

Particularly I wanna use the 1280’s pre’s for recording and the EQ’s for mixing. Essentially I plan to do a hybrid ITB/OTB mix, using the best effect and processor plugs I have, plus the 1280’s eq’s and maybe reverb and comps…

The 1280 has the usual channel line ins/line outs, though bus sends are limited.

My interfaces are 1 x MOTU 1224 + 1 x MOTU 2408, both also hot-rodded a la Black Lion Audio. This gives me a total of 16 I/O, which is all I require for the work I do here.

I also have 4 stand-alone pre's, 2 x Mindprint and 2 x Brent Averill 1272’s

Oh yeah, I'm running Logic 8 Pro on a G5...

I wanna have the possibility of using all the pre's on the 1280 plus the channel strips, so we’re looking at using all 16 i/o’s on the MOTU’s.

I currently have 2 x standard Neutrik ¼” patchbays. More can be purchased if required?

And I intend bringing the XLR mic-ins on both the 1280 and the channel strips forward to a panel on my rack.

Now, to my question:

I wanna set-up a patchbay to maximise my connection options; to make it easy to use, and (HOPEFULLY?) tidier than the bird’s nest of cables currently lurking behind my rack.

I’ve been puzzling over info on connection options for the last 3-4 days, with the only result thus far of giving myself a major headache! Every time I come up with what I think is the best option, I find a new piece of info that takes me right back to square one!!

If someone out there can find the time to help out with some advice, I’d REALLY appreciate it!

Thanks in anticipation, Mike
 
kiwimike said:
Hi everyone.

I’m a newbie here, so please bear with me...

I’m a NZ singer-songwriter currently based in Germany. You can check-out my material on my MySpace site - just go to myspace.com and search "Mike Brosnan..."

There's 4 songs from my current album, plus 2 from a soon-to-be-released live CD/concert DVD. Everything there has been mixed by me…

I’ve searched the archives here thoroughly but whilst there's many posts that answer parts of my question, I'm unable to find a complete answer. I’m hoping someone here can help?

First a bit of background:

After 10 years mixing “in the box” I wanna do at least some of my mixing in the analogue domain. To this end I’ve purchased a Sound Workshop 1280B (with 8 x “Super EQ’s) which has been heavily hot-rodded – external power supply, re-capped, op-amps replaced, etc…

Particularly I wanna use the 1280’s pre’s for recording and the EQ’s for mixing. Essentially I plan to do a hybrid ITB/OTB mix, using the best effect and processor plugs I have, plus the 1280’s eq’s and maybe reverb and comps…

The 1280 has the usual channel line ins/line outs, though bus sends are limited.

My interfaces are 1 x MOTU 1224 + 1 x MOTU 2408, both also hot-rodded a la Black Lion Audio. This gives me a total of 16 I/O, which is all I require for the work I do here.

I also have 4 stand-alone pre's, 2 x Mindprint and 2 x Brent Averill 1272’s

Oh yeah, I'm running Logic 8 Pro on a G5...

I wanna have the possibility of using all the pre's on the 1280 plus the channel strips, so we’re looking at using all 16 i/o’s on the MOTU’s.

I currently have 2 x standard Neutrik ¼” patchbays. More can be purchased if required?

And I intend bringing the XLR mic-ins on both the 1280 and the channel strips forward to a panel on my rack.

Now, to my question:

I wanna set-up a patchbay to maximise my connection options; to make it easy to use, and (HOPEFULLY?) tidier than the bird’s nest of cables currently lurking behind my rack.

I’ve been puzzling over info on connection options for the last 3-4 days, with the only result thus far of giving myself a major headache! Every time I come up with what I think is the best option, I find a new piece of info that takes me right back to square one!!

If someone out there can find the time to help out with some advice, I’d REALLY appreciate it!
Click to expand...

I do now exactly what you're wanting to do, but I use a Mackie 32.8, SSL Xlogic converters to an RME HDSP9652 card. All the console I/O except the inserts routes to four patchbays...mix of normalled and half-normalled. Right now the converter outs are normalled to the console mix-B inputs, so no repatching is required...all I have to do is switch each channel to Mix-B to move from tracking to mixing. All my outboard is routed to the patchbays as well (from wall plates on the other end). I keep all of my preamps together in once section, dynamics in another and FX in another...sends on top, returns on the bottom. I can also mix entirely ITB if I want...I have a Steinberg Houston controller for that purpose. If I'm mixing on the console it functions just like tape auto locator would....machine control for the DAW and that's about it. I can use all of my UAD and Voxengo plugins, plus do all of my editing in the sequencer. It works great.

Does that all make sense? What specific questions do you have on connections?

Frank
 
Thanks for your prompt reply Frank.

OK, so let’s see if I get it right?

I should bring the converter out’s to the top row (normalled) and the corresponding bottom row goes to the line in on the mixer.

Same goes for the direct outs from the mixer – to the top row with the corresponding bottom row going to the convert in’s?

And the mic in’s from the XLR panel go direct to the mic in’s on the mixer…

My outboard pre’s can through the patchbay to the converters, which SHOULD give me the option to use the same in’s (to the converter) for outboard effects?

Is that correct?

The issue I see is that, with the 1280 not having the bus options “modern” mixers such as your Mackie has (The Mix-B section for example) switching between tracking and mixing is not so easy?

Any suggestions on how I can do this?

The “normalled” / “half normalled” thing confuses the s**t out of me, but is it possible to maybe do the switch using dead patching?

Thanks again and cheers, Mike
 
Does your mixer have a switch to choose between mic-in or line-in? That's all you have to change to monitor either record or playback.

Yes, it sounds like you have the patchbay routing figured out. Although make sure you get a decent one. It really can make or break your entire system. More details about patchbays in this thread, (at bottom of page 1.)

I am not familiar with your mixer but most have insert jacks on each channel. That may be a better place to insert your outboard effects.
 
Hmmm, yes... It seems the 1280 is not so simplistic as I thought? What I believed to be a pad switch on each channel actually selects between the mic and the line inputs, so that problem is solved :-)

Thanks for the heads-up.

Feels like I'm getting closer to a result here.

Thanks again, Mike
 
kiwimike said:
Thanks for your prompt reply Frank.

OK, so let’s see if I get it right?

I should bring the converter out’s to the top row (normalled) and the corresponding bottom row goes to the line in on the mixer.

Same goes for the direct outs from the mixer – to the top row with the corresponding bottom row going to the convert in’s?

And the mic in’s from the XLR panel go direct to the mic in’s on the mixer…

My outboard pre’s can through the patchbay to the converters, which SHOULD give me the option to use the same in’s (to the converter) for outboard effects?

Is that correct?

The issue I see is that, with the 1280 not having the bus options “modern” mixers such as your Mackie has (The Mix-B section for example) switching between tracking and mixing is not so easy?

Any suggestions on how I can do this?

The “normalled” / “half normalled” thing confuses the s**t out of me, but is it possible to maybe do the switch using dead patching?

Thanks again and cheers, Mike
Click to expand...

I'd leave the converter inputs/console DI's non-normalled...that'll save you some confusion. You'll have to patch your preamps into the converter inputs, but at least you'll be able to tell what you're doing at a glance by looking at the patchbay.

Any decent patchbay will allow you to at least switch between normalled and non-normalled configurations.

Frank
 
Stage snakes & a patchbay have changed my life... I can now connect any mic to any pre, any compressor, any input, just by plugging & unplugging easily accessible numbered connections, rather than wading through a mess of seemingly random wire. Also, I use the patchbay with switching between normal, half-normal and thru (a Behringer, actually), I can't imagine messing around switching jacks and so forth.
 
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