patch baying all of this stuff??

  • Thread starter Thread starter wes480
  • Start date Start date
a mixer would be nice, it gives you an excuse to buy MORE patchbays :)

basically, a patchbay would allow you to set your stuff up in a way that you NORMAL(ly) work, without plugging any cables around. PLUS you can at any time EASILY and quickly and painlessly change routing to any thing you can dream up.

If thats what you are looking for, then a patchbay is for you.

Right now Im in the middle of soldering 14 96point TT patchbays so Im happy to talk about patchbays as it gives me an excuse to get away from it for a second and let the burns heal :)

heres my new setup in case you want to see what it looks like when youve got FULLBLOWN Gear Accquisition Syndrome

bay 1:
top row mic lines 1-48 1/2 normalled to
bottom row console mic pre inputs 1-48

bay 2( triple row):
tape recorder outputs 1-48 double-half-normalled( oops a new one) to both
row 2: Console Line inputs 1-48 and also to
row 3:Console Tape returns 1-48

Im using an old school console that is split instead of inline so its kinda screwy

bay 3:
console insert send 1-48 1/2 normalled to
console insert return 1-48

bay 4:
console direct outputs1-48 1/2 normalled to
tape recorder inputs 1-48

bay 5
group outputs 1-48
aux sends and headphone snakes

bay 6
outboard mic pre inputs 1-48
outboard mic pre outputs 1-48

bay 7
outboard mic pre inputs 49-96
outboard mic pre outputs 49-96

bay 8
compressor inputs 1-48
compressor outputs 1-48

bay 9
compressor sidechain sends 1-48
compressor sidechain returns 1-48

bay 10
FX inputs 1-48
FX outputs 1-48

bay 11
FX and utility devices, sound modules inputs 1-48
FX and utility devices, sound modules outputs 1-48

bay 12 console facilities, 2 track reel, DAT, masterlink, cassette, FX returns, etc...

bay 13 facilities and utilities continued

bay 14 feed from 1/4" patchbay ( hey Im CHEAP!!! 1/4" to TT cables get expensive so I use a cheap 1/4" patchbay to do it :) )

on second though, dont get into owning patchbays cause they get friggin expensive!
 
Wes, not evryone really NEEDS a patchbay. Let's say you basically use a mixer for preamps - especially a mixer with the jacks on the top surface rather than in the rear. Maybe you only have a couple of pieces of outboard gear - and those might be tabletop styles rather than rack mounted. You can probably do pretty well without one.

But as soon as you get to the point where you are crawling around the back of your racks with a flashlight constantly plugging and unplugging various connections, my brother, you need a patch bay. Also, nothing stresses your cables more than continual plugging and unplugging. By transferring the connecting chores to a patchbay all your cabling will have a longer lifespan.

Don't worry if you think you don't fully understand everything about them. They're cheap enough you can buy one and experiment with how they work. As you saw by Pipeline's "explanation" of Row A, Column B, etc. without a hands on experience or at least some nice pictures, it's very difficult to describe how a typical patchbay works purely verbally. Hell, I've been using patchbays for years and even I was scared off by Pipeline's explanation! :p

The whole thing is much simpler than we are making it sound!
 
"But as soon as you get to the point where you are crawling around the back of your racks with a flashlight constantly plugging and unplugging various connections, my brother, you need a patch bay. "

ok, then I am there ;)
 
Patchbayin...

Wes,
You've already gotten a lot of good advice here but you asked for articles to read and I've got one. I posted this link over in the "Making TRS Patch Cables" thread but the link changed so here's the new one.
http://213.129.73.14/aa_dt_new/index.cfm
Once you are at the hompage, click on the Articles button at the top. On the drop down that appears on the next page select "Tech articles" and scroll 2/3 of the way down. The article is "Patchbays 'R Us" It's got piktures too!
Building a patchbay is a pain but once it's done everything will be easier. Plus, the learning is invaluable!
 
What the other people are saying is right. What the guy in the store said was a combination of sort of wrong and really totally wrong.

The wildly simplistic version of why a patchbay is good:
- It brings all your in and out jacks together in one place, in front.
- It makes makes 'em all similar enough so you can easily hook one to another.
- You don't need to do anything to hook together stuff that's "normally" hooked together, but you can change things quickly and easily.

A mixer isn't a substitute for a patchbay. For one thing, it costs a lot more. For another, having a mixer makes you want a patchbay more.
 
Mixer?

Wes, do you have an analog mixer or are you doing everything in the PC? If not, do you intend on getting a mixer? Just asking.
 
that link mikeA posted has pictures that do a WAY better job of explaing than my A B C D stuff!
 
Wes,

Yes, you do need one.

Another example for you from my humble studio setup; my rack, which I custom built from standard rack rails and laminated shelving, looks like this (from top to bottom):

(Space)
Furman PL-Plus(everything below plugs into this, one button and everything is on or off as the case may be)
TL Audio PA-1 2 channel mic pre
DBX 386 dual mic pre
(Space for air flow)
Layla 24
TC M2000 effects processor
Behringer T1951 parametric eq
JV1010 and RNC compressor on rack shelf
(Space for air flow)
Behringer 48 point patch bay, unbalanced with top switches for Normal/Denormal/Half normal
(Space)

My basic signal chain, via XLR except for RNC:
TL mic pre -> EFX -> EQ -> RNC -> patch bay.

The 386 is setup to run digital via rca cables to the EFX and that runs into the eq via XLR.

The RNC in and out are connected to the last pair of points on the patch bay in normal position. I also have a pair of patch points set up for the JV and my Flextone amp which can be sent to either of the mic pres or directly to any of the other patch points.

From there I can patch the RNC outs to any other patch point with patch cables or bypass everything in the chain and run straight into the RNC, like with my Flextone amp.

Meanwhile, the first 16 pairs on the patch bay interconnect all of the Layla I/O and 8 channels of my Mackie 1604 mixer:
Mackie outs -> Layla inputs.
Layla outs -> Mackie inputs

With this setup I can have the XLR cables for mics set up all the time, running to the back of the mic pres and just turn on the phantom power when needed, or run straight into the instrument inputs on the front of the mic pres. Or I can run straight into the Layla or straight into the Mackie and use the XDR pres, all of which runs into my Sonar setup. I then monitor off the Mackie's main outs via the Layla's first 2 outputs.

Basically I can connect almost anything to anything else without getting behind the gear or I can introduce something new or temporary into the chain without major surgery. The Furman cleaned up all ground loops and even has room for the wall warts like the RNC, and because the runs are so short there are no issues with balanced vs unbalanced. With careful attention to gain staging the noise floor on live micing is generally around -74 and around -72 for DI.

Before I set this up it was chaos and shit was everywhere. One other possibly helpful tip: You may want to diagram the layout and the signal chain based on the way you like to work. This helped me realize that a patch bay was the answer.

Now I'm sure this has cleared everything up :)
Go forth and patch!

------------
Fishkid
 
Thanks Wes, a couple more if you don't mind

Do you do everything in the control room or do you have a separate tracking area? Also, what about keyboards, synths, drum machines, sound modules, etc. Sorry for all the questions, You'll see where I'm going with this hopefully this afternoon.

Mike
 
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