Painting a guitar.

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tom18222

yes
Basically, got a guitar i want to paint it,.

my uncle is a professional car body guy. he has his own shop and everything.

so what i want to know is.

is this site accurate

http://www.shredaholic.com/painting.html


and is guitar paint the same as car paint.


or should i buy from reranch.
 
Be sure that the paint you are spraying is compatible with what is originally on there, like laquer over polyurethane is a bad combo. It will melt the old finish underneath and you need to strip it all down.
 
My friend painted a DuriColor Car spray paint, small cans, on my MIM Strat.
He called Fender and it was PolyEsther or something, like POlyEurethane but stonger. The stores like GC want thick stronger stuff to reduce nicks and dings. He said it was a bitch to work with, sandpaper wouldn't hardly move the clearcoat poly-E crap.

The Laquer was from WalMart too I think, or Auto zone.


He also painted the Purple Yammie...spray paint and laquer, and about 4 weeks of sanding!

Its beautiful. Then the MIM will get a new Lime green or crazy color my kid wants.
 

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if the guitar has no dents or anything you cant just scuff the finish so the primer as something to adhere to?
 
tom18222 said:
if the guitar has no dents or anything you cant just scuff the finish so the primer as something to adhere to?
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You don't really need a primer coat for a guitar. Be sure there is a sealer coat if its raw wood or the liquid in the paint will just drip off. :mad:
 
Here's the MIM repair pics. It came out fair. Not as good, as the purple Yammie, which was like a glass coating...beautiful.

but compared to the original damaged condition...huge improvement. This thing had a deep gouge of wood gone.
Its barely noticeable now, unless held up in the light close up.
From 3 ft the gouge is out of sight. The car paint DuriColor was a bit lighter shade, as Fender wouldnt sell the Wine-color paint for our repair. (the patch is underneath the arm when playing anyway.)

Soon its going Yellow or Lime green or something crazy.. ;)

A Brand new MIM, damaged for about out the door of $200, it's mint shape other than the gouge.
My friend only charged like $10 or some cheap price + paint of course to fill and paint and polish.

I have the paint cans and laquer spray can. He did the homework on calling Fender and all that. He repairs and paints, and puts together, custom ordered pickups for "musicians without time or soldering type skills".
the woodwork is more of a enjoyment thing.

The second pic shows how sturdy the MIM Fender clearcoat is!!
 

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tom18222 said:
Basically, got a guitar i want to paint it,.

my uncle is a professional car body guy. he has his own shop and everything.

so what i want to know is.

is this site accurate

http://www.shredaholic.com/painting.html


and is guitar paint the same as car paint.


or should i buy from reranch.
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No, that site is not accurate. That is a fine way to paint a car, but a guitar needs to be able to vibrate. It's no good.


And NO, you can not use car paint if you want your gutiar to look and sound it's best.

At the very least, the first thing you need to do, if you want it done right, is strip the instrument to bare wood. No ifs, ands, buts, or maybes, you need to strip it. And of course, you then need to sand it. Also, try to keep your finish thin, it matters.

If you want to do it right, go to Stewart MacDonald's website, and buy a copy of Dan Erliwine's book on guitar finishing. Then, do what he says.

As for the material, once you've striped the guitar you can use whatever you want, but your friend is an idiot if he lets you spray something other than what he always sprays in his booth, and you don't want to use what he sprays. Mixing products in one booth is a real nightmare. But I'm betting he knows that. This being the case, you don't have the facilities to spray nitro, so no, you shouldn't use the stuff from Reranch. People will tell you you don't need a spray booth to shoot nitro, but they are wrong. I don't care how well their project came out, even trying it is flat out stupid. As in, potentially Darwin Awards stupid. No shit, folks, you can go up in a big fucking ball of fire. Don't fuck around with it. Besides, you don't need it. The Stew Mac waterborne finish and LMI's KTM-9 are fine products. They are both safe, they look good (although the clears can be a bit blue), and they don't require any special safety equipment. Don't be an idiot, use a safe product.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
Oh, and if you ignore my advise and try to shoot over the finish that is there, scuff sand it and then spray a coat of Shelac. Shelac will stick to any other finish product out there, so if you spray a coat of shelac between two other products you shouldn't have any adhesion problems.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
Ditto to evrything light says above. This was covered recently in thread about sunbursts. Read it HERE.

Also while shellac will give you a bond between two normally incompatible finishes it is only a mechanical bond. It works well for most things but be aware that you can still have problems with it. Especially when going on top of polyester. Nothing touches polyester and the mechanical bond it holds with shellac can be weak leading to checking, crazing and peeling down the road.

Auto paint is far from ideal for wood.

Seriously finishing is an art and takes years of experience to get it right. Think carefully before you start. Even many luthiers start shaking and jibbering sometimes just thinking about it!!!

Oh and if you do choose to shoot nitro without the correct extraction, ie spark and static proof, without the correct guns and without postive pressure in your booth call the fire brigade and let them know when you are about to start. They'll send someone round straight away. Be warned....
 
I think that a rattle-can refinish on a strat copy is a rite of passage. I have one that was blue, red, red with black stripes, black, green over black, and then blue again. The last time I did it, I used car paint from murphy mart and the weather must have been just right because the finish was nice and hard and didn't stain my arm of clothes when i played it.

Humidity and temperature are a huge factor. Ideally it should be pretty warm with low humidity so the finish will cure the right way. A friend of mine used to heat up cans of PJ-1 on the space heater before he shot black motorcycle frame parts and it worked great. that is, until he was out back of the shop doing a few pinch hitters and the widows blew out of the place. It was strange than nothing caught fire and there was supprisingly little paint anywhere.

FOOM!
 
I refinished a Strat copy with auto finish. I believe that Kramer and their acquired guitar companies did so as well, at least the clear-coat. Mine turned out really nice and the tone tightened up quite a bit.

...Car finishes don't weather-check as well as the good old lacquers, so don't use 'em if you want your axe to eventually achieve classic status... ;)

Eric
 
Car finishes don't weather-check as well as the good old lacquers, so don't use 'em if you want your axe to eventually achieve classic status...
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They can if you apply then to wood. Auto finishes are hard, high build fast dry and slow cure. The gas off for months and are not ideal for guitars. I very much doudt that any manufacturer would use auto finish. Even if they use Acrylic it would be a slower build with lower solid content, and faster solvents to aid gassing off. The Kramers I have seen do not use Auto finishes. Just get the stuff from Stew Mac it is designed for guitars and costs very little extra.


Humidity and temperature are a huge factor. Ideally it should be pretty warm with low humidity so the finish will cure the right way. A friend of mine used to heat up cans of PJ-1 on the space heater before he shot black motorcycle frame parts and it worked great. that is, until he was out back of the shop doing a few pinch hitters and the widows blew out of the place. It was strange than nothing caught fire and there was supprisingly little paint anywhere.
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Those cans are designed to be sprayed betwwen 15 and 21 degrees. Ideal is around 18 degrees. Much higher and the solvents gas off too quickly from the top of the finish and the paint remains soft underneath. The result is checking and blushing and possible printing in the finish later down the line as moisture and solvent attempt to escape from the finish. It can do it in one of two ways. Through previous coats which it will soften more than required or through the top coat via the path of least resistance. The label says keeep them away form excessive heat. Follow the safety instructions and there will be no Kaboom
 
so where should i buy the paint from?


my uncle has an actual spray booth, with a ventalation van that sucks out everything that doesnt make it on the cars that he sprays. its quite impressive.
 
I just finished doing my guitar with Krylon spraypaint. I've gotta say, no one in my band could tell that it wasn't a factory finish (well, aside from my other guitarist who knew what it looked like previously). It hasn't taken any scratches yet, even after a 10 hour practice session yesterday with my belt buckle rubbing against it, and I assume it hasn't even fully cured yet. If you want a finish that will be stunning and probably last forever, go with Light's method above. But if you want a nice looking finish on a budget that gives good results for the effort put in, I'd recommend Krylon and a bit of patience.
 
muttley600 said:
I very much doudt that any manufacturer would use auto finish.
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Back in the day, Gretsch shipped unfinished hollow bodies out to Cadillac for paint jobs, hence the Cadillac Green colour.
 
timthetortoise said:
I just finished doing my guitar with Krylon spraypaint. I've gotta say, no one in my band could tell that it wasn't a factory finish (well, aside from my other guitarist who knew what it looked like previously). It hasn't taken any scratches yet, even after a 10 hour practice session yesterday with my belt buckle rubbing against it, and I assume it hasn't even fully cured yet. If you want a finish that will be stunning and probably last forever, go with Light's method above. But if you want a nice looking finish on a budget that gives good results for the effort put in, I'd recommend Krylon and a bit of patience.
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Did you sand with 2000 grit and clearcoat and all that?

I still need to polish my sons and will put wax on it for durability. McGuires from Auto Zone. These guys play with them, their not collectors.

There's a big difference between collectors and people who spend more time polishing than playing them...

I find in my older age I spend more time polishing my instrument, when I was young I actually played with my instrument, in front of crowds and everything.
:eek: :D
 
I put two coats of clearcoat on and am gonna try to get one more on this week. Wet-sanded with 1000, as that's the finest I have around. I'm definitely surprised at the results of around $15 put into it.
 
!!

Gretsch used nitro for years and have switched to a Gloss Urethane. They still use nitro on some custom models because that is what their classics were finished with. I don't recall seeing one with a vinyl or other type of finish but they might be out there somewhere if you say they put them out. I was lead to understand that one of the fires in the old Baldwin plant was started in their nitro finishing plant!! Can't remember where that info came from tho so it maybe wrong.
 
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