Hey guys, my motherboard took a dump. At the present time, I can't afford a new system. I was running a p3 800, 512 mem. I can pick up a motherboard and a P3 1.2 Tualatin processor for about $200. That way I just replace the motherboard and go. I'm running Sonal 1.3.1 with windows 98. This computer store tells me I can get a Celeron 2.2 ghz, 512 mem, motherboard and power supply for $320. They said the "old" mith about Celerons is not true anymore. They said the "old" Celerons had no "L2" cache, that's why no one recommended them for recording music but, the new ones have 128K L2 cache. Can someone help me make up my mind plz....... thanks.........
P3 1.2 ghz vs. 2.2 Celeron
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DAFFYDRUNK
New member
Computer store is right and wrong. The first Celery 266 (and 300 MHz I think) had no L2. Then came the 300A... so the no L2 was short lived. In later Coppermine/Tualitan based Celerys they had 128 cache and 256k respectively and weren't too shabby for Celerons, especially since the last P3 based Celerys ran a 100MHz FSB. The new P4 based Celeron is a pooch though. The 20 stage pipeline needs alot of L2 and 128k doesn't cut it. There's so many cache misses that a 1.6GHz AMD Duron setup will easily out run a 2.6 Celeron, and is a cheaper alternative.
If your board supports Tualitan see if you can score a 1.3 Celeron. That's the fastest P3 based Celery you can get. Maybe even get a 1.2 P3 if you have PC133 memory....
If your board supports Tualitan see if you can score a 1.3 Celeron. That's the fastest P3 based Celery you can get. Maybe even get a 1.2 P3 if you have PC133 memory....
If you're REALLY daring...
A Celery Tualitin 1.1 oc'd to 1.5 or 1.6 will SCREAM. I have a 1.0 oc'd to 1.6 that competes very well against my P4 2.4... (different sound cards, so I can't truly accurately compare...)
A Celeron Tualatin is very close to the Pentium 3s. The current celerons don't compare too favorably against the P4s, however.
A Celery Tualitin 1.1 oc'd to 1.5 or 1.6 will SCREAM. I have a 1.0 oc'd to 1.6 that competes very well against my P4 2.4... (different sound cards, so I can't truly accurately compare...)
A Celeron Tualatin is very close to the Pentium 3s. The current celerons don't compare too favorably against the P4s, however.
Celerons are lame, overall. Even the 2.2 and faster. Still lame.
If you want to go fast for cheap, look into an nForce powered board and an AMD. More money will get you a hot rod P4.
No Celerons.
The comment about the P3 elegance is one missed by most folks who can only see clock speeds. IMO, the P3 is better engineering.
If you want to go fast for cheap, look into an nForce powered board and an AMD. More money will get you a hot rod P4.
No Celerons.
The comment about the P3 elegance is one missed by most folks who can only see clock speeds. IMO, the P3 is better engineering.
bgavin said:
I say own it, and like it. The least you could do is be a bit more polite about it. You don't have to be a jerk about it.
Besides, Celerons were also based on P3's, which were more efficient than P4's, or can't you read what I posted?
And yes, I can rationalize a P3 based Celeron w/ 256KB cache beating many full P4's up until 2Ghz......because that's a reality.
I have AMD in my desktop (with a KT600, barely a tick slower than a full nForce2 Ultra 400 chipset, but I'm sure you'll argue that too) and it works great as well.
If I sound less than thrilled with you, it's because I am thoroughly tired of your opinion coming through as fact, and disregarding others' opinions as bullshit.
So my opinion, backed up by multiple benchmarks, is that 1.3Ghz Celeron w/ 256KB cache > P4 1.5/1.6/1.7/1.8Ghz w/ 256KB cache.
Why? The Celeron of that generation had less instructions, therefore more efficient than a P4 of a higher clock speed, therefore faster. With the same L2 cache, the first P4's couldn't compete.
I don't understand why you don't realize this.
Yes, the newer Celerons are slower. They don't really pick up until 2.6Ghz, like said.
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christiaan
Active member
The Tualatins are great cpus for what they do clock-for-clock. The Pentium-M chip in Centrino notebooks are also derived from the P3 and they kick ass.
But there are more things to consider.
Personally I use AMD but given the options from the first post I'd choose the 2.2 Celeron.
Virtually every P4/Celeron motherboard that's on the market today will give you way better upgrade options.
Extra memory (DDR-sdram) can be added easily and cheaply, full blown P4s in the future when money is less tight, you can opt for a motherboard that has S-ATA support for new hard drives. And all without having to reinstall Windows.
The celeron 2.2 lacks horsepower? Depends on how you look at it. Compared to a P4-2.2, sure but it will still run circles around a PIII-800 and is more than enough for most homereccers to record without a hitch.
I've said it before: For homerecording, you don't need the fastest computer. You need one that's fast enough.
But there are more things to consider.
Personally I use AMD but given the options from the first post I'd choose the 2.2 Celeron.
Virtually every P4/Celeron motherboard that's on the market today will give you way better upgrade options.
Extra memory (DDR-sdram) can be added easily and cheaply, full blown P4s in the future when money is less tight, you can opt for a motherboard that has S-ATA support for new hard drives. And all without having to reinstall Windows.
The celeron 2.2 lacks horsepower? Depends on how you look at it. Compared to a P4-2.2, sure but it will still run circles around a PIII-800 and is more than enough for most homereccers to record without a hitch.
I've said it before: For homerecording, you don't need the fastest computer. You need one that's fast enough.
Looking at your profile tells me you are yet another internet troll... no name, no stats, no location. Just an anonymous keyboard to hide behind so you can dispense insults. As for what you think of me, and calling me names, you can pound sand.Polaris20 said:
I've been in the computer engineering business for 31 years, a few of them at Intel, and IMO the Celerons are mutts, and perform accordingly. I see them all day, every day, and their performance is pitiful compared to non-emasculated processors.
Sure, this is my opinion. I didn't fling around the insults and name calling as you do above, so who is the jerk? My opinion is based on LONG years of experience in this field.
bgavin said:Looking at your profile tells me you are yet another internet troll... no name, no stats, no location. Just an anonymous keyboard to hide behind so you can dispense insults. As for what you think of me, and calling me names, you can pound sand.
I've been in the computer engineering business for 31 years, a few of them at Intel, and IMO the Celerons are mutts, and perform accordingly. I see them all day, every day, and their performance is pitiful compared to non-emasculated processors.
Sure, this is my opinion. I didn't fling around the insults and name calling as you do above, so who is the jerk? My opinion is based on LONG years of experience in this field.
Just like most people I know who work in that industry and I attened college with in Computer Engineering, you're a total ASS!
I think that was the biggest reason I changed majors - I couldn't stand the ego's...
arena rock
New member
bgavin said:Looking at your profile tells me you are yet another internet troll... no name, no stats, no location. Just an anonymous keyboard to hide behind so you can dispense insults. As for what you think of me, and calling me names, you can pound sand.
I've been in the computer engineering business for 31 years, a few of them at Intel, and IMO the Celerons are mutts, and perform accordingly. I see them all day, every day, and their performance is pitiful compared to non-emasculated processors.
Sure, this is my opinion. I didn't fling around the insults and name calling as you do above, so who is the jerk? My opinion is based on LONG years of experience in this field.
Here's one 'real world' (home recording) Celeron user who gets very good real world results....I've had 15 tracks with probably 8 to 9 fx running simultaneously , and that was for several years on a Celeron @850....Can't argue with results, and I spent very minimal $$ on it compared to PIII's/P4's ....
bgavin said:Looking at your profile tells me you are yet another internet troll... no name, no stats, no location. Just an anonymous keyboard to hide behind so you can dispense insults. As for what you think of me, and calling me names, you can pound sand.
I've been in the computer engineering business for 31 years, a few of them at Intel, and IMO the Celerons are mutts, and perform accordingly. I see them all day, every day, and their performance is pitiful compared to non-emasculated processors.
Sure, this is my opinion. I didn't fling around the insults and name calling as you do above, so who is the jerk? My opinion is based on LONG years of experience in this field.
Alrighty then. I called you a jerk, because instead of just saying you prefer P4's or Athlons, you continue to insult my choice.
You have no tact.
Internet troll? I've been here longer than you, and rarely get into arguments (though most of them, surprisingly, have been with you).
What stats would you like? I am 28, live in Schaumburg, IL, enjoy long walks and quiet evenings with my wife. I am 5'7, and in good shape. I have brown hair and blue eyes. Anything I am missing? Yes, I am being a bit sarcastic.
I don't give a shit that you've been in the industry for 31 years. I'm in it too (though admittedly not as long) and have run across a lot of people with X amount of years that don't know shit.
What you spout about your background on the Internet means nothing to me in terms of credibility.
Your ego is quite incredible.
So why don't we just agree to disagree?
Internet troll? I've been here longer than you, and rarely get into arguments (though most of them, surprisingly, have been with you).
I think we had a couple good ones back in the day.
No hard feelings now I hope.What stats would you like? I am 28, live in Schaumburg, IL, enjoy long walks and quiet evenings with my wife. I am 5'7, and in good shape. I have brown hair and blue eyes. Anything I am missing? Yes, I am being a bit sarcastic.
Hey - we're the same age! I was actually out in your part of the world last week for a job interview (Rolling Meadows). It went really well and I may be moving out there.
brzilian said:
Internet troll? I've been here longer than you, and rarely get into arguments (though most of them, surprisingly, have been with you).
I think we had a couple good ones back in the day.
What stats would you like? I am 28, live in Schaumburg, IL, enjoy long walks and quiet evenings with my wife. I am 5'7, and in good shape. I have brown hair and blue eyes. Anything I am missing? Yes, I am being a bit sarcastic.
Hey - we're the same age! I was actually out in your part of the world last week for a job interview (Rolling Meadows). It went really well and I may be moving out there.
We've had quite a few arguments, but you've been able to present your opinion as an opinion, not as fact, something that escapes bgavin. Certainly no hard feelings
Rolling Meadows? That's pretty close. I might be getting a new gig too, but it has some traveling. only 15%, so I don't mind, because the price is right
Good luck with the new job, if you get it. If you need help finding a place, I can recommend good areas.