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richglenn
New member
I just bought a Oktava mk319 mic and have'nt used it yet. Still setting up studio. Anyone use one? If so what do I need to know?
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blinddogblues
New member
I do not have one, nor have I heard one, but I would be interested to hear your feedback once you have used it. I am in the market for more large diaphragm condensors and I am interested in that one and the 219 by Octava ($99).
Track Rat
Just Your Average Sized Member
I have a 319 and a pair of MC-012s and the 319 is fast becomeing one of my favorite vocal mics. It doesn't have the hyped high end that a lot of the under $500 LD condensers have. I'm planning on getting a LOMO M-1 or M-3 capsule for the 012s and I have high hopes for that combination. The 219 and the 319 are pretty much the same mic internally.
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trumpetman
New member
Is the MK319 different from the MC319? The MC319 is one I am considering, and it sells for about $200. Is this the one you like, Track Rat?
I am trying to decide whether to purchase the large diaphragm 319 or the smaller 012. Track Rat, you say you have a pair or 012s. Do you use them as a stereo pair, or what?
I record vocals, guitar, and trumpet in my home studio. Would you recommend the 319 or the 012 for this? Or perhaps the 319 for vocals and acoustic guitar, and the 012 for trumpet? What advantages/disadvantages does one have over the other? I am a bit of a newbie so basic info is welcomed.
Thanks,
Trumpetman.
I am trying to decide whether to purchase the large diaphragm 319 or the smaller 012. Track Rat, you say you have a pair or 012s. Do you use them as a stereo pair, or what?
I record vocals, guitar, and trumpet in my home studio. Would you recommend the 319 or the 012 for this? Or perhaps the 319 for vocals and acoustic guitar, and the 012 for trumpet? What advantages/disadvantages does one have over the other? I am a bit of a newbie so basic info is welcomed.
Thanks,
Trumpetman.
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blinddogblues
New member
Hey Trumpetman, I also have a pair of the MC-012s, and I love them. They are particularly good for acoustic guitar. I use them as a stereo pair and they do better than any other mic I use. Also, it is a MK-319, not an MC-319 that Octava makes. The large diaphragm (319) would probably be better for vocals, but you should check out the Marshall V-67 which has gotten excellent reviews on here and is on sale at Mars for $169 including the shock mount. As far as trumpet, I do not know whether a large or small condensor is better. Hope this helps. Jim
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richglenn
New member
When I looked the Oktava up on the Russian website it is listed as a MC 319 But mine does say Mk 319. They sure look like the same mic to me. I think it might be one of those "Guitar Center" things( thats where I bought it).
bongolation
New member
OK, here's the short course - I looked into this _hard_ a couple of months back, including a bunch of private correspondence with a sound engineer who services Oktavas:
The M219 and the M319 Oktavas are nominally identical except for the housings. The larger housing in the M319 allegedly gives a more "open" vocal sound.
Oktavas, like all other Russian-manufactured goods, have very serious problems with quality control. No two are quite alike. Some are great, some are so-so, some are bad - all out of the same lot. You will probably hear more difference between a good M219 and a so-so M219 than you will between a random M219 and a random M319.
One of the "good" Oktavas from Guitar Center (ASM markings) is a great bargain, but you need to go through a bunch of them in their studio to find ones you like. That's what I did and I got a great bargain on the M219s at $99. I would never buy an ASM Oktava without testing it. The differences are so gross that you can definitely hear them, just doinking around with headphones and a mixer. You'll also notice a substantial cosmetic difference in them; quite a few have stripped screw heads, dinged paint and loose screens.
Johnson - www.oktava.com instead of ASM at www.oktava.net supposedly retroactively repairs the poor QC on the Oktavas he buys and charges accordingly.
There has been a <<horrendous>> flamewar here and in a.p.a over these respective Oktava suppliers and it doesn't bear repeating. Most of it is beyond substantiation anyway. The specific production problems are probably too technical to go into here.
If you can get GC to let you try a few of the M219s or M319s in the store before buying, as I did, go that way and save some money. Otherwise get them from Johnson for a whole lot more. There's more of a price differential with the M219 between these two sources than with the M319.
A _good_ $99 M219 Oktava is probably the best microphone value on earth, but you have to work a little for it.
I hope this helps.
The M219 and the M319 Oktavas are nominally identical except for the housings. The larger housing in the M319 allegedly gives a more "open" vocal sound.
Oktavas, like all other Russian-manufactured goods, have very serious problems with quality control. No two are quite alike. Some are great, some are so-so, some are bad - all out of the same lot. You will probably hear more difference between a good M219 and a so-so M219 than you will between a random M219 and a random M319.
One of the "good" Oktavas from Guitar Center (ASM markings) is a great bargain, but you need to go through a bunch of them in their studio to find ones you like. That's what I did and I got a great bargain on the M219s at $99. I would never buy an ASM Oktava without testing it. The differences are so gross that you can definitely hear them, just doinking around with headphones and a mixer. You'll also notice a substantial cosmetic difference in them; quite a few have stripped screw heads, dinged paint and loose screens.
Johnson - www.oktava.com instead of ASM at www.oktava.net supposedly retroactively repairs the poor QC on the Oktavas he buys and charges accordingly.
There has been a <<horrendous>> flamewar here and in a.p.a over these respective Oktava suppliers and it doesn't bear repeating. Most of it is beyond substantiation anyway. The specific production problems are probably too technical to go into here.
If you can get GC to let you try a few of the M219s or M319s in the store before buying, as I did, go that way and save some money. Otherwise get them from Johnson for a whole lot more. There's more of a price differential with the M219 between these two sources than with the M319.
A _good_ $99 M219 Oktava is probably the best microphone value on earth, but you have to work a little for it.
I hope this helps.
bongolation
New member
The MK-319 v. MC-319 thing is part of the pissing match between ASM and Johnson. They're the same microphones.
This is why I use M319 to designate either.
This is why I use M319 to designate either.
Track Rat
Just Your Average Sized Member
TrumpetmanAs far as the MC or MK, it's a Russian thing. They're the same mic. The MC-012s are a lot like Neumann KM-84s in their sound. A little darker and not as airy but nice. I've used them as drum over heads, on acoustic guitar, mandolin and cello with great results. If you pick up the 012s, I'd recomend you get the three capsules and the attenuator (the capsules are omni, cardiod and hyper cardiod and the 10dB attenuator for loud sources). I haven't tried them on brass yet. A ribbon mic might be a better choice if you're recording a lot of horn stuff but I'm sure they'd do a very passable job as well. I don't want to start the Octava wars again (it's a long story) but, IMHO, I buy mine from Taylor Johnson at The Sound Room. You get what you pay for. Your mileage may very.
bongolation
New member
Track Rat said:
As far as the MC or MK, it's a Russian thing. They're the same mic. The MC-012s are a lot like Neumann KM-84s in their sound. A little darker and not as airy but nice. [...] I don't want to start the Octava wars again (it's a long story) but, IMHO, I buy mine from Taylor Johnson at The Sound Room. You get what you pay for. Your mileage may very.
The MC/MK business isn't "a Russian thing," but part of the Johnson/McKay battle. MC=Johnson, MK=ASM.
The MK/MC-012s are subject to the most severe quality control problems, according to the guy I wrote to who works on lots of them, so I might go with Johnson on that one especially, since the price differential is not as great between the GC version and Johnson's (however, I think Johnson just raised his prices - my recollection was that he used to charge around $260 for the MC-012 as opposed to GC's sale price of $200). You get the foxy box from Johnson, too, I think.
Johnson's MC-219s are nearly three times as much as GCs, so I don't see buying MC-219s from him unless one really has money to burn.
The problems with Oktava microphones are manifold, but the biggest single factors are the inconsistency of the Russian electronic component parts (particularly leaking wet-slug capacitors) and the poor cleaning of flux from the boards, again according to the guy who works on them all the time. His attitude is that these are no big things to fix and had some interesting tweaks he passed along.
If money's an object, I say go with the GC/ASM MK219s and test a few out to avoid getting an obvious lemon. If money's no object, go with Johnson and get whatever you want. If money's no object, hell, go get a palletload of German ribbon mics.
As always, it ultimately boils down to how much you have to spend and how much hassle you want to go through, but as I said, it's hard to imagine a better dollar value than a good Oktava MK-219 for $99. I've got a couple and I'm tickled to death.
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trumpetman
New member
Thanks to all for the very useful information!
I think I will check out some of these Oktava mics at Guitar Center and see if I can find a couple of good ones.
Two questions: First, what should I do to test a mic in the store? Just monitor it through headphones and say "test test" or what? Should I bring my own headphones into the store for this?
If I could bring a couple home and test them on my setup, in my room, and with my instruments, that would be great... but you can't return mics to GC as you probably know. So what can I do in the store, with the ever-present Guitar Center kids wailing metal riffs at maximum volume on Fender Squires in the next room?
Second question: What advantages/disadvantages does a large-diaphragm mic have over a small one? The Oktava 319 is large diaphragm and more expensive. Is this a better mic in general, or only in specific situations? The 012 has the changeable caps, though, so it may be more flexible. What's the difference?
Thanks again folks, this is a huge help.
Trumpetman.
I think I will check out some of these Oktava mics at Guitar Center and see if I can find a couple of good ones.
Two questions: First, what should I do to test a mic in the store? Just monitor it through headphones and say "test test" or what? Should I bring my own headphones into the store for this?
If I could bring a couple home and test them on my setup, in my room, and with my instruments, that would be great... but you can't return mics to GC as you probably know. So what can I do in the store, with the ever-present Guitar Center kids wailing metal riffs at maximum volume on Fender Squires in the next room?
Second question: What advantages/disadvantages does a large-diaphragm mic have over a small one? The Oktava 319 is large diaphragm and more expensive. Is this a better mic in general, or only in specific situations? The 012 has the changeable caps, though, so it may be more flexible. What's the difference?
Thanks again folks, this is a huge help.
Trumpetman.
bongolation
New member
Testing at GC is quick-&-dirty: Have two plugged into the board, hold one in either hand and sing scales back and forth between the two while listening in the headphones for sound and trouble. Some Oktavas clip at relatively low input levels due to dirty boards. I don't understand quite why this happens, but two engineers I know of independently gave that explanation and I did encounter MK-219s that did precisely that, for whatever reason.
When you decide which one of the two is better, pull out the bad one and replace it with another untested one and repeat the above, just like you were doing the lens test to get new glasses.
Eventually you'll separate the better ones from the obviously bad this way. Don't forget to work the switches, too. Believe it or not, the switches and the roll-off circuits are sometimes bad on these.
QC with Oktavas is such that unless you're absolutely deaf, you _will_ notice an audible difference in MK-219s, even at this crude level of comparison and with whatever headphones they have lying out on their boards. In my local QC their recording-gear studio is fairly well acoustically isolated from the shredders in the guitar department. I also did this at 1100 on a weekday, right when they opened, which was a good call considering it was still quiet in the store and they had time to accomodate me in this.
I went through eight and bought the two that seemed best and definitely rejected a couple of bad ones. This isn't some serious lab test for guys in white coats, but I think it will determine which are the better ones out of a batch, which is ultimately all you can do. I doubt that my selected MK-219 are materially better or worse than Johnson's selected MC-219s - it's just that Johnson catches the bad ones and repairs them or sends them back and doesn't sell them if they're not right. GC just moves whatever stock ASM sends them by the palletload.
Considering that 012s and 319s are $200 (or more) at GC, I doubt that I'd buy them there, particularly in that the 012 is particularly noted for troublesome circuitry. The price differential between Johnson and GC is small enough on these models that it might be wiser to pay a bit more and get the royal treatment from Johnson.
I doubt I'd ever buy a 319 at twice the price of a 219 when it has the same internals, come to that.
When you decide which one of the two is better, pull out the bad one and replace it with another untested one and repeat the above, just like you were doing the lens test to get new glasses.
Eventually you'll separate the better ones from the obviously bad this way. Don't forget to work the switches, too. Believe it or not, the switches and the roll-off circuits are sometimes bad on these.
QC with Oktavas is such that unless you're absolutely deaf, you _will_ notice an audible difference in MK-219s, even at this crude level of comparison and with whatever headphones they have lying out on their boards. In my local QC their recording-gear studio is fairly well acoustically isolated from the shredders in the guitar department. I also did this at 1100 on a weekday, right when they opened, which was a good call considering it was still quiet in the store and they had time to accomodate me in this.
I went through eight and bought the two that seemed best and definitely rejected a couple of bad ones. This isn't some serious lab test for guys in white coats, but I think it will determine which are the better ones out of a batch, which is ultimately all you can do. I doubt that my selected MK-219 are materially better or worse than Johnson's selected MC-219s - it's just that Johnson catches the bad ones and repairs them or sends them back and doesn't sell them if they're not right. GC just moves whatever stock ASM sends them by the palletload.
Considering that 012s and 319s are $200 (or more) at GC, I doubt that I'd buy them there, particularly in that the 012 is particularly noted for troublesome circuitry. The price differential between Johnson and GC is small enough on these models that it might be wiser to pay a bit more and get the royal treatment from Johnson.
I doubt I'd ever buy a 319 at twice the price of a 219 when it has the same internals, come to that.
bongolation
New member
It's worth pointing out - maybe - that GC has the MK-012 with the one cardioid cartridge for $99 this month, so I guess this calls for a rethinking of some of the previous recommendations.
Maybe I'll bag some and see what happens. Or not. We'll see.
Maybe I'll bag some and see what happens. Or not. We'll see.
bongolation
New member
richglenn said:
If you got this at GC, be aware that they just put these on sale for $149, so if you got it last month for $199, scoot back down there and they'll give you $50.
You have thirty days to do this. $50 ain't hay.
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richglenn
New member
Got it for $149.00 including the shockmount (with a retail value of $179) yea right!! The mic has a retail value of $699.00 "wow what a deal" No, I think its worth $149 though.