Not trying to MASTER but.........

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MISTERQCUE

MISTERQCUE

Not Just Anutha Brutha
..........if the art of "MASTERING" your final mixdown incoporates
full album normilization,peak limiting,subtle compression and eq
leveling for submission to a Mastering House on specialized,2-track equipment; yet you have painstakingly recorded each track,
"wet" or "dry",panned judiciously,gated and compressed any signal that was warranted and applied any eq boost/cut needed;
then finally performed a TRUE,STEREO mixdown for your demo c/d,
dat etc.;and rec'd kudo's from various informed and experienced individuals on the ENTIRE PRODUCTION, can one by-pass the mastering process and submit Redbook for glass disc-@-once
duplication!!?? Or should project be submitted for mastering regardless of others semi-pro and pro views!!??

Just curious!
 
Kind of like when I pick up the apartment before the maid gets here. Then again, your comparison is similar to actually cleaning the place up entirely - washing and scrubbing everything judiciously before she arrives.

. . . in which case you've just given her the afternoon off.
 
Mr QQ,
There are two avenues, each with its own purpose. If you are looking to compete nationally with similar recording artists for airplay and album sales, having a second pair of ears is a must. The mastering engineer will make you competitive in the mass market. But if all you want is distribution to your pals and family, then there are plenty of duplicators that will take a cd-r. Most of them will have a list of things thay want, pq bursts and that sort of thing.
Try this page.... http://www.homemademusic.com/ , they have alot of info geared for the home recordist DIY cd packages for modest to minimal investment. There will always be opinions on you have too have it mastered by a professional, but you have to remember compromises happen more often to the poor than the rich. Just do your best for your situation.

Goodluck....

Peace,
Dennis
 
I would be careful about WHO you send your material to for mastering.

A certain person hired me to master their CD. He sent along the same project, but that another "big named" mastering engineer did. I verified that this dood in fact mastered at least a couple major label releases.

I could not believe what the hell I heard him do to this poor guys stuff!!! Overcompressed with obvious pumping and breathing. Clipping which led to digital distortion. EQ balance so out of whack that the CD was mostly unplayable in most consumer playback systems.

Mind you, this "big named" guy was using VERY expensive gear. Very expensive. I don't have even ONE piece that cost as much as his cheapest piece of gear, that is how expensive this stuff is. So, he should have been able to easily fix any problems in the audio (as the original tracks weren't THAT bad. In fact, they were all mixed with probably too conservative of levels!). I should not have been able to get even CLOSE to the same quality of a master. This dood had experience and impressive gear over me!

This guy just obviously didn't care! I couldn't believe what I was hearing and asked the client what kinds of dialog took place between him and the mastering engineer. This engineer made excuse after excuse about why the master was coming out so poorly. I was shocked at some of the stuff the dood said. He just didn't care, and it would appear that he didn't really want to master THIS CLIENTS CD. But that didn't stop him from taking this clients money for doing a shit ass job.

I hope that bonehead heard the master I DID!!! Same tracks. I achieved around 95% of the RMS volume that he did, but did so without ANY obvious compression/limiting artifacts, and with a much more balanced EQ for consumer playback systems. I also did it for a lot less money (about a 1/3 less the price as I recall), and I felt I was paid well for the job.

I am telling this story because I never like hearing generalized statement about mastering engineers! There is a mastering engineer in town here who masters a lot of people stuff locally. His work is not worth his price in my opinion, so I would never use him. There is another guy who even has some big label stuff. He did some mastering for me long ago. I never came out totally satisfied with the masters, and proved to myself that I could do just as good of a job with lesser gear, so I can't justify his VERY high cost per hour (between $100 and $125 an hour!!! Can you believe that?). I have remastered some stuff that people gave me that he did without the benefit of hearing his masters first, but then compared afterwards. The client was always more impressed with my masters.

I am not bragging nor making a plug for work here, I am just illustrating that just because they have "mastering engineer" below their name on a card, DOESN'T mean that they are worth a shit, and can bring your product "up to standard to compete with big label artist on the radio" bullshit. I have heard more mastering engineers SCREW UP good sounding product in the last couple years from trying to achieve that "radio sound".

So, investigate your mastering engineer very well. Always try to hear BEFORE and AFTER examples of his work, preferably from clients of his that are happy. Without the before and after comparison, you cannot access very well if he made "good" improvements to the bands sound or not.

Anyway Q. Yes, YOU can burn a Red Book that is ready for a glass master to be etched from. The standards for submission is not quite so high these days to the duping houses, so home recordists are not burdened with having to learn how to keep things straight on the playlist and printing out PQ Timesheets and what not.

Ed
 
sonusman said:

I am telling this story because I never like hearing generalized statement about mastering engineers!
Click to expand...

Im sorry if my gross generalizations caused your blood pressure to rise. Mr QQ has been around here long enough to have read the numerous dissertations on this subject of mastering engineering. If I had gone into a huge post it would have been disliked as well.

and can bring your product "up to standard to compete with big label artist on the radio" bullshit. I have heard more mastering engineers SCREW UP good sounding product in the last couple years from trying to achieve that "radio sound".[/B]
Click to expand...

The Key word is...CAN and again, you can either generalize or spend a month or so over at the mastering engineers bbs sorting through the thousands of posts on the subjectivity on current techniques of overcompression within the pop top 40 radio crap.


Anyway Q. Yes, YOU can burn a Red Book that is ready for a glass master to be etched from. The standards for submission is not quite so high these days to the duping houses, so home recordists are not burdened with having to learn how to keep things straight on the playlist and printing out PQ Timesheets and what not.

Ed [/B]
Click to expand...

Maybe this should have been first... Yes you can...But.....
be careful....

I have a comment specifically for sonusman....

Your touching on a subject that really pisses me off. Ive had the problems with mastering jobs gone bad by people who have gear and a business card who really don't care about the product, absolutely no integrity or talent for that matter.

How does the novice who wants a good product get one if they dont have the ears to recognize a bad mastering job? They don't know they've been screwed until someone else finds the condom hanging from their spincter. Its hard when youve spent your last dime and it sucks... Ive been wondering if folks could use a independant consulting service to verify as a third party that the mastering job is up to snuff, for a fee somewhat less than having to remaster with different houses until your happy. Lets say for 50 bucks, your disk gets sent to a consultant who independantly verifies it. I know that Bob Katz and Glenn Meadows have been tossing around the idea of having a license or some official credentials that "Mastering Engineers" have to have. One of the criteria being you dont own a finalizer :0) There are so many psudomastering penguineers flooding the market that the quality had gotten severely out of hand and the industry being out of control just makes it worse for the home enthusiest. Anyhow toss it about..to niche or not to niche....


Peace,
Dennis
 
atomictoyz, I am sorry if you took my statements personally. I really wasn't trying to suggest that YOU specifically making those comments is what propogates the problem in any way. You have shown in the past that you have indeed a pretty good idea on what is going on. And by the way, this is fun stuff. My blood pressure stays quite in balance! :)

Yes, I agree that the market has just been flooded with too many people offer their mastering "service" without much experience in ANY aspect of engineering, and with "toys" (like the finalizer...:)). But you know, I have herd a finalizer used WELL, and as the only boxed used. So, it really comes back to the competency of the person doing the work, rather than the tools used, and I guess that is the point I was trying to make, and that not all the "persons doing the work" even have the "knack" for doing it. I took a few liberties in expression along the way...:)

Peace bro.

Ed
 
Inadvertantly, I pretty much just said the same thing as you.....LOL....better take my own prescribed medicine about reading closely what was printed eh? ;)

Ed
 
Don't be sorry sonusman, I only take things personally when I think I can learn something. Which means I take everything personally. Im known for being a little cryptic and sporadic as well and add that to being left handed... well who knows what I might type. Im guilty though of propagating misinformation in some cases, I try to play the devils advocate and sometimes it backfires, I hope nobody buys a MD recorder because of me...I just couldn't bear the guilt of that one!

My education is a continual and you certainly have been great as a source of that education being positive. I hope people appreciate your openess as much as I do.


Peace,
Dennis
 
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