Not the Best Room: Should I Deaden It?

Confusitron

Confusitron

New member
The room I record in (from what I can tell) does not possess the greatest acoustic properties. I would venture to say that this does not add the greatest element to the sound of recordings, however, it has never been any kind of distraction nor has it been very distinct. I am mainly referring to the recording of drums. Should I completely eliminate this somewhat poor addition to the sound of recordings by completely deadening the room? This way I would have to add all reverb, etc., through software for the idea of a nice sounding room.

Does this sound like a good idea?

I briefly searched the forums for this type of question, but only came upon deadening a room for the purpose of recording guitars and vocals.

Thanks in advance for any responses.
 
Start by controlling the low end - ALWAYS start with the low end. Bass traps and plenty of them.

Once the lows are under control, spot-treat trouble spots (flutter, comb filtering, etc.) with Sonex or Auralex or what have you. It shouldn't take much.

The problem with making a room "dead" (via "foam parties") is that it does nothing to correct the true problem areas (generally, the low end). It takes away all the ambience and leaves you with mud.

Places to go -

www.gikacoustics.com
www.realtraps.com
www.johnlsayers.com

The Master Handbook of Acoustics - F. Alton Everest
 
I guess I should have clarified that I do not intend to spend any money on this (maybe some on balsa wood). That means that all Auralex products are out.

I have a huge roll of egg-crate foam which I might make panels out of with balsa wood so that dampening can be adjusted more precisely. Any suggestions on what size these panels should be? Should I put blankets on the walls? The celing is composed of ceiling tiles, so I could wedge blanks between the panels and the tracks for the panels, which would allow the blankets to hang on the walls. What do you (all) suggest?

The way I can describe the acoustics of the room is... If you are to clap, or do something that produces a nice transient wave, then it sounds as though there is a very short delay on it. I did a comparison with a Boss delay pedal and I would say there is around a 150 millisecond delay (that's what sounded similar). It is not reverb, but it is delay. I don't know that low end is the problem. I am just looking to possibly eliminate this delay.

I have not yet looked at the links you've provided, Massive Master, but I will eventually.

Thank you for your response.
Massive Master said:
Start by controlling the low end - ALWAYS start with the low end. Bass traps and plenty of them.

Once the lows are under control, spot-treat trouble spots (flutter, comb filtering, etc.) with Sonex or Auralex or what have you. It shouldn't take much.

The problem with making a room "dead" (via "foam parties") is that it does nothing to correct the true problem areas (generally, the low end). It takes away all the ambience and leaves you with mud.

Places to go -

www.gikacoustics.com
www.realtraps.com
www.johnlsayers.com

The Master Handbook of Acoustics - F. Alton Everest
Click to expand...
 
Egg crate foam does nothing for bass buildup. It may dampen that "clapping" echo you're getting, but that is not the real problem. You will be left with muddy sounding recordings. Also, egg crate foam tends to be very flammable. Use at your own risk, as one stray ash or spark and your whole studio could burn.
 
scrubs said:
Egg crate foam does nothing for bass buildup. It may dampen that "clapping" echo you're getting, but that is not the real problem. You will be left with muddy sounding recordings. Also, egg crate foam tends to be very flammable. Use at your own risk, as one stray ash or spark and your whole studio could burn.
Click to expand...
I guess I'm having trouble understanding this bass buildup issue... Maybe my ears aren't trained well enough yet, but I haven't had any known issue with it yet. Are you saying that as a result of dampening the echo I've been talking about, I will get bass buildup?

I just tried the blanket on the wall method, on the wall opposite to the drum set, and it did noticeably reduce the echo from certain locations in the room. If this works well enough, I could probably ditch the egg crate foam.
 
scrubs said:
Egg crate foam does nothing for bass buildup. It may dampen that "clapping" echo you're getting, but that is not the real problem. You will be left with muddy sounding recordings. Also, egg crate foam tends to be very flammable. Use at your own risk, as one stray ash or spark and your whole studio could burn.
Click to expand...

Dont mean to hijack the thread, but do egg cartons work as sound proof? i.e will my mother stop freaking out when I crank my Marshall upstairs?
 
Egg crates suck. Confusitron, if you want to deaden your recording sound, hang a blanket around your kit with spare mic/cymbal stands while you record, which'll stop a lot of reflections; TelePaul, get room insulation and lots of it, OR turn your amp down :)
 
TelePaul said:
Dont mean to hijack the thread, but do egg cartons work as sound proof? i.e will my mother stop freaking out when I crank my Marshall upstairs?
Click to expand...


let me rephrase what scrubs said.....
egg crate foam doesn't do anything of good use. Just ditch the idea.
also, sound proofing and sound absorbtion are two different things. With sound absorbtion you use materials to absorb the bad freqencies and sometimes reflect the good ones.
With sound proofing, this requires mass, decoupling and major construction so that no sound whatsoever gets out. Especially if you are upstairs and trying to get rid of sound going through floors/walls.


I guess I'm having trouble understanding this bass buildup issue... Maybe my ears aren't trained well enough yet, but I haven't had any known issue with it yet. Are you saying that as a result of dampening the echo I've been talking about, I will get bass buildup?

I just tried the blanket on the wall method, on the wall opposite to the drum set, and it did noticeably reduce the echo from certain locations in the room. If this works well enough, I could probably ditch the egg crate foam.
Click to expand...

my question is what is that you're trying to reduce when you're listening. The sound of the room your standing in....or the sound that is recorded and played back through your speakers. They are two different things. What is pleasing to your ears while you stand there is one thing...what is pleasing to what goes into the microphone is another.
If you reduce the highs too much by adding blankets and whatnot, but still have low frequency problems, your mixes are just going to sound muddy. Especially when adding certain material that skews the frequency response of your room. It may increase certain frequencies by 8dB and decrease others by -5dB. So you'll still get peaks and nulls around the room. The great thing about using material to correct bass frequencies (particularly 703 fiberglass insulation that people here recommend) is that it ALSO absorbs the higher frequencies. So naturally you'll still get less decay/reverb time from flutter echoes.
Remember, the "clap" method only shows you a small amount of information of what's going on with your room. Think of the frequency range a clap might sit in....and think about the frequency range your bass drum might sit in. They're not the same.

Read this (edit...ah apl beat me to it ;) )
 
I had a similar issue in my basement in the last place I was in. There was no way to get it sounding "good" for drums, so instead, I killed it as much as I could. Moving blankets (or other heavy blankets) are about the most cost-effective. Hang them all around the drumset, on the ceiling, etc - and then record. No, you may not get rid of standing waves and such, but your room will no longer sound small - ideally, you won't hear it. The goal for me was to keep crosstalk between mics down - so you'd hear the hi-hat in JUST the overhead pointed that way, and vice versa. It helped a lot, but then you have to go to a good bit of trouble to "replace" the room virtually. Honestly, though, if you've got a small room that you don't like the sound of, I think that deadening it is a good way to go.

FYI, though - I tried egg-crate foam. The stuff sucks. It takes like 6 layers of it to equal 1 moving blanket. Oh, and hang your blankets a little bit away from the walls - .5-1 foot or so. This doesn't do a ton, but helps a little with lower frequencies.

jon
 
if you guys want some cheap-ass bass traps, get a 55-gallon drum trash can, stuff it full of fiberglass, and cover the top with canvas/muslin - this is sort of like using the O-C 703, but way more ghetto...you can even build them to go down to a specific frequency using the following equation:

f = 1130/2H, where f = the frequency trapped, and H = the height of the can(in feet)

i would do this myself, but i don't have space in my tracking room for the trash cans, so oh well
 
A couple things you didn't mention are how big the room is and if you have any furniture etc. in the room. Things like couches, overstuffed chairs, bookshelves with books etc. can change the room for the better in addition to their obvious uses, assuming you have the space for them.

If you have ever been in an empty house with no furniture or anything vs. a furnished house, you probably have noticed the difference in the ambient sound in the rooms. If you could score some old furniture to sit on, it might be a good start. Just a thought.
 
Put the foam up, especially in the corner by the drums. Next, hang some blankets around the drums. I've used portable clothes racks turned on their side with comforter-type blankets draped over - with good results. What you get is cheap, localized sound dampening. This won't sound proof your room though. To do that you have to build a 'room' inside your existing room with none of the inner walls touching the outer walls. The heavier the paneling you use, and the more insulation you use in your walls, the better the soundproofing. I doubt you'll do all that so, use your foam and the blanket and if you're still motivated put some fiberglas batting in garbage bags and stuff/staple them into the ceiling, then replace your ceiling tiles. Cheap and effective.
 
look dude, you understand better than you think.

your drum tracks sound like shit, eh? yeah i have the same problem, with a $2000 drumset and everything close mic'ed, and some cute little AKG overheads etc etc etc, but it all comes down to the room that you are in.

i'm in the same boat, i just cant drop the money on bass traps today (ahem last 6 months..)

for now, use what ya got. i did buy a package of auralex foam for $100 a few months back, but that did errr next to nothing.

i recently put up some old carpeting on the walls. i can tell you it sounds better live, but i havent tried recording it yet. (recording drums depresses me because i never get anything good)

hey, the blanket thing won't hurt. i even used an old mattress in front of the kick drum at one point. it all helps, but no where near enough (for me anyone).

so for now, i use my TD-3 with DFH superior, until i cant cough up the dough for some bass traps.
 
I treated my room to a degree with Gobos...just to stop acoustic sounds boucning around. Wood floors and high glass ceilings make everything prone to natural 'verb and reflection...which isn't good all the time. So, almost for the sake of it, me and my bro made wooden batons and in-filled 'em with polystyrene. Helps alot with trapping sounds and is sooo cheap.
 
Sorry, folks. I forgot I even made this thread. I'll get back to you in the next day or two.

Ironklad Audio said:
if you guys want some cheap-ass bass traps, get a 55-gallon drum trash can, stuff it full of fiberglass, and cover the top with canvas/muslin - this is sort of like using the O-C 703, but way more ghetto...you can even build them to go down to a specific frequency using the following equation:

f = 1130/2H, where f = the frequency trapped, and H = the height of the can(in feet)

i would do this myself, but i don't have space in my tracking room for the trash cans, so oh well
Click to expand...
Interesting idea!

Thanks for your suggestions overall.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top