no tracks clip except the master fader?

  • Thread starter Thread starter djclueveli
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ecktronic said:
That wont work really.
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:confused:

Moving all track faders together really has the same effect as just moving the master fader.

Most DAW software allows you to select multiple tracks and when you move one of the faders, they all move relative to each other.
 
Moving the track faders is not the same as moving the master fader because the track faders are before the summing mixer. I've found that lowering the track levels can make things sound better if the summing mixer is being hit too hard. Lowering the master fader will not have that effect.
 
SonicAlbert said:
Moving the track faders is not the same as moving the master fader because the track faders are before the summing mixer. I've found that lowering the track levels can make things sound better if the summing mixer is being hit too hard. Lowering the master fader will not have that effect.
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However, lowering each track fader by the same amount will not effect the mix in any way, other than the overall volume. Right?

I think that's the point danny was trying to make.
 
Change of POETS said:
However, lowering each track fader by the same amount will not effect the mix in any way, other than the overall volume. Right?

I think that's the point danny was trying to make.
Click to expand...

Yup.

SonicAlbert said:
I've found that lowering the track levels can make things sound better if the summing mixer is being hit too hard.
Click to expand...

I don't see how a software summing mixer can be "hit too hard". :confused: Unless you're talking about hardware?
 
LeeRosario said:
well in terms of master buss compression, I think that one is always up for debate.

To compress a mix buss for effect and to patch up excessive clipping are two completely different things.
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Well I dont know why anyone would use a compressor rather than a brick wall limiter if they areonly using it to avoid clipping!! :@

Eck
 
ecktronic said:
Well I dont know why anyone would use a compressor rather than a brick wall limiter if they areonly using it to avoid clipping!!
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Because throwing up a brick wall at, say, -0.5dBFS will sound entirely different than moderate compression at a threshold of, say, -8dBFS. Both can potentially fix the clipping problem, but with differing effect to the rest of the non-clipping peaks and to the overall RMS of the signal.

G.
 
danny.guitar said:
:confused:

Moving all track faders together really has the same effect as just moving the master fader.

Most DAW software allows you to select multiple tracks and when you move one of the faders, they all move relative to each other.
Click to expand...
Are you sure?

I didnt think that the dB was linear. Im sure the dB is to do with logarithms.
So if every signal on each fader track was hitting 0dB, then the master out should be at 0dB? Is that what you mean?

Eck
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
Because throwing up a brick wall at, say, -0.5dBFS will sound entirely different than moderate compression at a threshold of, say, -8dBFS. Both can potentially fix the clipping problem, but with differing effect to the rest of the non-clipping peaks and to the overall RMS of the signal.

G.
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A limiter shouldnt affect anything below its threshold, same as with a compresser. What I was saying was, if you only want to fix the clips then why use a compresser, as a compresser is obviously going to have to have a lower threshold than a limiter, which in turn will affect (as you said yourself) the rest of the wave.

Eck
 
Ford Van said:
Why? Same difference really.
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Not at all the same difference. Peak limiting/compression with the goal of preventing overs is radically different than using buss compression to artistically change/color the mix.

The goals are totally different and the results will virtually always be different as well.
 
danny.guitar said:
:confused:

Moving all track faders together really has the same effect as just moving the master fader.
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Not neccessarily - if those faders are feeding any compressors your thresholds will change...
 
IMO, strapping anything across the buss to reduce overs is a band aid and does not address the primary issue - you're mixing too hot! Back off (start over if you have to for some reason) and stay away from 0dBFS - your mix will sound much better.

Only add buss processing to make it sound better, not to fix problems that should be addressed earlier...
 
I've noticed that if the tracks are all smashing up against "0" and the master is smashing up against "0" or going into distortion, it sounds better to lower the tracks and give the mix some headroom. Better than just lowering the master fader. And yes, I'm talking about an ITB mix.

I don't know where this "it's just numbers" argument comes from. All the usual stuff regarding the principles of mixing, gain staging, headroom, etc., still apply to an ITB mix.
 
bblackwood said:
Not neccessarily - if those faders are feeding any compressors your thresholds will change...
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Of course one would assume the mix engineer would make all the necessary adjustments regarding any dynamics dependent processing. So yes, thresholds would change and other adjustments might need to be changed as well. That's business as usual (or should be).

However, if there is no processing on the tracks, then just pulling down all the faders together by the same amount would bring all the respective volumes down in concert.
 
SonicAlbert said:
However, if there is no processing on the tracks, then just pulling down all the faders together by the same amount would bring all the respective volumes down in concert.
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Agreed.

Sorry if I came across as if I meant otherwise.
 
i always put a limiter on my master.

i never put the thresh very low though. if i got distortion i would take all my tracks down.

i just watched my limiter on a song. it attenuates like..4 quick times through the whole song. if that thing ever was attenuating even part of a phrase..anything more than just a quick eyeblink, i would turn everything down.
 
Wouldn't it be more appropriate to find out what's causing the clips and limit *that* so you can keep the main buss clean?

IMO (and more other O's than I could possibly count), if you're even approaching full scale, you're considerably too hot...

That ain't how it's done downtown... :cool:
 
SonicAlbert said:
I've noticed that if the tracks are all smashing up against "0" and the master is smashing up against "0" or going into distortion, it sounds better to lower the tracks and give the mix some headroom. Better than just lowering the master fader. And yes, I'm talking about an ITB mix.

I don't know where this "it's just numbers" argument comes from. All the usual stuff regarding the principles of mixing, gain staging, headroom, etc., still apply to an ITB mix.
Click to expand...

Some of this depends on the DAW you are using. In a Pro Tools environment lowering the master fader has the same effect as lowering the tracks.

See: THE PRO TOOLS 48-BIT MIXER PLUG-IN section of http://akmedia.digidesign.com/support/docs/48_Bit_Mixer_26688.pdf for further info.
 
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