Newbies - why your new years resolution should be to use fewer plug ins.

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manning1

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Why do i post this topic ?
consider these points carefully.
1. Ive seen too many mixes ruined by inappropriate use of
plug ins. either too many or not used properly.
i actually saw one mix that used 30 plug ins. very crazy.
2. you cant rescue basuically poorly engineered tracks by
scattering plug ins everywhere.
3. consider that the old hit standards you hear on the radio
everyday. plug in technology was not available then in software.
going back further studios used engineering tricks instead.
And overall , the old adage too many cooks spoil the broth holds true
today.
so you ask , what instead ?
remember at one point ? songs that sold by the millions were done
on 3 track machines, and way back mono machines.
todays DAW will do 48 tracks without a blink. so instead of reaching for the plug in
consider some old ways. for example the other day i wanted some reverb on a track
so i miced a speaker in a reverberant room.
in summary , focus yourself on learning the art and science of audio
engineering and being creative with mic positioning and use of
natural spaces the next time your tempted to reach for a quick plug in fix.
the advantage being you wont need a 3ghz super system.
something to think about.
if you dont believe me, try and talk to seasoned AE's that have been around the block a few times.
 
Yowsa! That is a cool thread.

But...but...!

Plugins are so much FUN!!

:D

I tend to use as many plugs as I want, after I get the mix as close to perfect as I can completely DRY.

Almost invariably, most of the plugs are light compression, reverbs, vocal delays, and the occasional limiter... but man does it sound like crap when I go too far with the experiemental stuff. Its pretty obvious the next morning. *Click* - turn off all the plugs and suddenly the song sounds real again.

They are still fun. And they still ruin mixs when overdone- like anything else.

Take care,
Chris
 
great point

... my tastes tend to run towards the "less is More" mentality as well. while i've heard plugins and effects used very artistically at times, i've also heard them used as a "turd polisher", so to speak:) well recorded performances usually don't need much in the way of effects, and a little well placed "spice" goes a long way towards bringing out certain aspects of a song or mix.
but what the hell do i know, i like most stuff bone dry... i'm weird that way.
peace- jv
 
Try recording in a more reverberant room?? Well for most newbies, we're in our basement and don't have the luxory of different rooms, or the cableing to move our DAW to another room in the house. plugins are a way of life, when you're in a square room with concrete floors and can't afford to foam the entire room.

Pat
 
... limitations are understood. i think manning is just offering suggestions for alternatives to software effects, but obviously only if you have access to such ideas. i believe he is simply saying that plugins and effects in general are useful tools, but maybe shouldn't be the emphasis of a recording. more like the "icing" on the "cake". learning to get good sounds to tape, or pc, or whatever, is a very valuable asset.
on the other side of the coin, many people are doing amazing things with creating sounds and textures with all kinds of processing, which can be an art unto itself. it all depends on your bag.
peace - jv
 
jv

jv. you said it perfectly. ive seen a lot of quite decent mixes
ruined. all i'm saying is too many use plug ins as a crutch.
ive found most newbies have to go through a cycle no matter how i try to counsel them. lots of equipment and plug in buying
until they reach a new understanding that good songs come from good songwriting and clever audio engineering like the old songs we hear everyday on the radio. often done on 3 track machines, and old scullies. remember them ?
 
yeah...

... is it just me, or do you think the overuse of production and processing on popular music has changed the ears of your average listener, as well as many engineers and producers? i'm not just talking about overzealous home recorders, with a bunch of plug ins at their disposal, but also top engineers in major studios. i can't really blame newbies for trying to emulate the production value of their favorite new cd, and reaching for plug ins to try and achieve the sound. the emphasis of the industry (in some cases, not all) has shifted to production over performance, and a "fix it later" mentality. i know a few high end engineers in la who have told me of sessions with famous clients, who had to record their verses, one line at a time, for multiple takes, and still had to use a bunch of pitch correction. where's the mojo there!?
crap... i sound like an old man yearning for the good ol' days, and i'm only 42. to be fair, this is a trend that doesn't apply to all popular music, and there are lots of young artists that are doing incredibly hip shit with the new technology.
manning, i didn't mean to stray a bit from your original post, but you kinda led me here, and hell, it's your thread, right?
maybe i should start a thread on the industry standard of production, and how it's affecting the craft of songwriting and the recording process. whaddayathink? and what forum would be appropriate? i'd be interested in hearing other's veiws on this.
peace- jv
 
ABSOLUTELY!

I've been pondering this a lot lately. I have no doubt that the average listen's ears are being affected by the pasturization/homogenization of sound today!

I wonder in the future how many people will actually know what a real live set of acoustic drums sounds like. That makes me incredibly sad, really. Because to me natural organic sounds are just simply one of the most beautiful things on earth. Like the sound of a bow across a string or the different nuances of rimshots.

I'm very much a purist, but I even find myself at times questioning whether folks will want to listen to my music (which is pretty raw) because it doesn't sound like they think music is "suppose" to sound. But ironically the vibe and edge or "real" music is something I value and admire most.

I try to take time to check out songs from a wide variety of musicians, and the ones that capture my ears and make me want more are the ones that retain that humaness. I was most impressed and genuinely moved by your songs on CDBaby, johneeeveee. Really "real" stuff!

Sorry if this is straying even further from the original thread , but I do think it is a very worthwhile and timely topic.

I look forward to hearing what others think.

~Kester
 
thanks for the kind words, kester...

... i always appreciate someone curious enough to dig around and find my stuff. thanks for listening, and for your views.
yes, this is what seems like an endless topic to me, so i just need to find a place to start such a thread, but i'm really not sure which forum is appropriate. anybody got any ideas?
once again , manning, i don't mean to stretch your thread, and i promise to move this discussion somewhere else.
thanks again, and peace - jv
 
i'll give it a spin in the "recording techniques" forum

... by the way manning, thanks for all the informative articles. nicely done, and nice of you to take the time to share. - jv
 
the art of songwriting has been lost

i agreewhoheartedly jv,. you and i think alike.
the songs are loosing to people spending too much time on "the frills". one of my favorite songs "Secret agent man" now THATS a SONG. wished i had written it. full of vibe and just happy to be alive everytime i hear it. or "china grove" . both make me smile.
both great songs with great engineering imho.
i have a song on my soundclick.com/bmanning site. its had a lot of plays. listen to the lyrics sometimes. its a comedy take off on todays music and the music biz.
 
oops

the comedy song is called limeyrap. if you give it a listen,
its a joke song.
 
manning...

...your songs sound good, even through my little shitty laptop speakers. thanks for sharing.
i know it seems like the art of real songwriting has been lost. i rather think it's been misplaced, or put in it's proper place... among the independent musicians out there who write, record, and play shows for the love of it, and the need to connect with others who appreciate the same care given to the craft. it stays "cleaner" down here in the underground, than it ever could in the mainstream music industry.
peace- jv
 
jv

very kind of you to comment jv. i too lament the fact of loss
of the songwriting art. i just dont hear hooks in the songs today.
in some ways maybe the young today are rebelling against the hook laden boomers era songs. but you know things DO TURN.
i'm trying to write songs in readiness for when they do. and they will. i strived in my song "woohoo" to get that old 50's type sound picture. its very hard to do it well. time will tell.
 
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