Newbie with $600-900 to spend.

F

funkoptimus

New member
My band(cover band) is looking at doing some originals and we need equipment to recoord with. We are leaning towards getting a recorder/mixer unit because it all inclusive and portable and possibly doing more work with a computer inregards to mixing using Cubasis.

We just have a small line mixer so we need something that will handle the mics from the drum kit...if thats possible without a mixer.

Ideally we will record drums with the recording unit and then go home and work on the mix and add bass and guitar via a Line 6 POD. We may or maynot do the final mix on the PC/computer so having a way to link up to it would be helpful.

Im new at this and lost what is my best options.

I maybe able to scatch up $1000
Thanx!!
 
The 788 has a SCSI connection.

You can plug four mics into the 788. It doesn't have XLR connectors. I'm assuming the inputs are good enough for recording drums without a mixer but I don't know for sure. The thread below from the Tascam 788 forum suggests that it does. The post from LGM talks about micing a drum kit straight into the 788. You could ask there or ask in the Tascam forum on this site. I know there are a few 788 users who post there. They might know.

http://www.tascambbs.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=13&t=001919&p=
 
Fostex VF-16 (or the newer VF-160) is perfect for you. It has double the tracks of 788 (total of 16) and double the inputs (8) of 788 of which 2 has XLR & phantom power for condenser mics. Thru the Adat interface it's much easier to transfer tracks back and forth between the VF and the computer (with an adat soundcard) 8 tracks at a time than using some outboard storage media like SCSI zip drives or SCSI hardrives.

The VF can also be used as a digital mixer to mix the 8 channels of audio from computer thru Adat interface with 8 sources connected to it's analog inputs. Think about the possibilities here if you have external gear that you want to use while mixing on the computer. If that's not enough for you with an external ADDA box like Fostex's own VC-8 (about $200) you can have 8 more analog inputs to record 16 tracks at once. Or you can buy a digital mixer to have additional inputs with mic preamps. Last week I bought an Fostex VM-88 digital mixer that gives me 4 more inputs with XLR & pantom and 2 line level stereo inputs.

A computer, a souncard with adat interface and the VF-16(0) makes a compact yet mobile recording studio that you can do tracking at home or on location. What more could you ask for?
 
But due to budget we were hopeing to plug the kits mics right into the digital recorder rather than having to but a separate mixer. Is this possible with the fostex?
 
Yes it is. There's 8 mic preamps on VF and two of them have both the 1/4" jack and XLR connector with phantom power that you can plug in either condenser or dynamic mic and the 6 remaining inputs have only 1/4" jacks that you can plug in dynamic mics. If you use two condenser mics for overheads and the rest of the mics are dynamics then you don't need a separate mixer.
 
Reality is the mic pres in most all of the multitracks are shit. Thats why I suggested the dps12, at 400.00 its the best value out. For a mic preamp the RNP by FMR, is supposed to be the badboy.
 
So you're willing to trade the much better connectability/expandability of Fostex for allegedly better mic pres on Akai. Well I wasn't when I was shopping for digital multitracer last year. Think about it, according to the FAQ on akaipro.com if you wan to transfer tracks between DPS12 and computer you have to do it 2 tracks at a time when with the Fostex you can transfer 8 tracks at a time. For a 4 minute song you'd spend half an hour transfering 16 tracks from DPS12 to computer when with VF it takes less than 10 minutes, not counting the time needed to select the tracks to be transferred between each pass. Fostex makes life a whole lotta easier in this respect.

BTW the price of DPS12 was $499 on www.shreveaudio.com not $400 and with the tiny 4gig drive. And if it's really the DPS12, not the DPS12i, then you'd have to use much more expensive scsi HD's for recording media. While Fostex uses standard 3,5" IDE-HDs it's not much more expensive to buy another HD when the previous fills up than to backup the data on CDRs and erase old recordings for new sogs.
 
First off PeteHalo-
have you any experience with the one with the cd-burner??? Do you recommend this or just use a pc with a card to transfer data. Also is the price of $899 for the with a burner a good price. Alos do you have any examples of recording using the Fostex?

To everyone- this is my first thread and group of postings and Im very thankful for the advice.
 
There's some really good info here. However, depending on what you want the final mix to sound like and your experience level, I think the akai or tascam would be better suited to your needs. There are definately trade-offs, the SCSI issue being an expensive one, but the akai and the tascam are in another league when it comes to user-friendliness, and most importantly, sound quality. When I was searching, I was looking for the same thing... more xlr ins for drums. That is the reason I chose the Korg D1600 over the Akai DPS16i. It is another league when you step up to the akai or korg, and the Yamaha units are supposed to be even better. I can tell you from experience that looking back, as much as I love my D1600, I think now I would concentrate more on the preamps and other periphreals than on more tracks and more xlr ins. I think I would do this:

Korg D12 $699 @samash.com
2 Midiman Audio Buddy preamps $100each
CD burner for D12 $200

That's $1100 for a 9+ track that records 4 tracks at a time, 4 xlr ins through the Audio Buddies, and direct cd burning capabilities. You could even skip the cdr to save some $$

Hope this helps.

Pete
 
I've had my VF-16 (the older model) for such a short time and haven't had the time to really get into recording yet. Mainly I've been trying just to learn to use it first and been exploring the different ways to use it together with my computer and what I've found out so far has been pretty exiting.

I don't see much use for the internal CDRW if you already have one in your pc and have a souncard with Adat interface. It's so much easier to just plug in those two optical cables and set cubase to record and VF to play and sit back and relax or surf the web for those couple of minutes than to start burning wav files to CDRs and then loading them to Cubase.

As for the price the VF-160 /w burner costs about $1500 here in Europe so the $899 looks like a steal to me.
 
I'd have to say invest in a good hard drive recorder; Roland has several good ones with burners: and get a decent mixer, (Mackie mixers have awsome mic pres.) on top of that and use your 900 bucks as a downpayment. Rent to own or finance. Credit isn't much of an issue. They want your money! There's no replacement for good gear and I think you'll find that the limitations of 6 and eight track recorders will just frustrate you.
 
Let's get real here for a change. The guy has $900 to spend not $3000 and he wants to get the best bang for his limited bucks. Of course if you spend three times the money you get better stuff but is it three times better? And maybe he's not so thrilled about the idea of having to haul around a rack full of gear to record outside his home studio when he can fit the VF (or DPS) into a small suitcase. If you go back and read the original post then it should be fairly easy to see that the VF is just what the doctor ordered and the other solutions offered here doesn't even come close regardless of price. VF is portable, there's enough of mic pres to record live drums, it's easy to transfer tracks between computer and VF and it can be used as the mixer in home studio. All he needs to start tracking is the VF, a soundcard with adat interface and the computer which he already has.

There's on thing I've forgot to mention before. The VF-160 and VF-16 are pretty much the same machine except for the internal CDRW. VF-16's OS can be upgraded to same specs as VF-160's. To me the VF-160 looks clumsier because of the sharper corners. If you can find a used VF-16 in good shape for about $500 - $600 then I suggest that you grab it and spend the $400 for couple of good mics or something.
 
Yeah but with the extra 400.00 to 500.00 he could get a sweet pre like the RMP and have a chance of getting killer tracks onto his machine, instead of the less than standard tracks he would have on the Fostex. Which dooms the fostex to being a demo machine only. And why does he want to transfer the tracks to computer anyway. He should only use his computer for mastering and burning CDs.
 
OK Im leaning towards the VF, There is a used one here in town were I live thats on consignment. So thanx PeteHalo Im 90% sure this is what Im going to get.

Follow up questions. Is there any benefit to tracking on the PC??
I thought it would give more tracks to play with and better effects(which I keep hearing isnt very good on these portable units).

Also what does this mastering thing really entail?? Any suggestions on mastering software?

Also we have access to a smaller Yamaha mixing board that we may see if the pre's are better on.

Thanx again!!
 
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