Newbie Needs Help w/PC System - Build or Upgrade?

  • Thread starter Thread starter MoBettaBlues
  • Start date Start date
M

MoBettaBlues

New member
I am new to recording systems and I have been contemplating the type of recording system I wanted to obtain. My needs are currently to be able to record my band and produce a sellable quality recording. I do not want my equipment to be the weak link in the process so I have decided to use a PC based system.

I am seriously considering “Digidesign Digi 002 Rack” system.

What I need to know is can I upgrade a PC I have now to meet the requirements of this system or should I just build a new PC?

Here’s what I have now:
Dell Dimension XPS T450
Pentium 2
256 MRAM
Windows 98
12G Hard Drive
48x16x48 CD-RW (Using Nero Express burning software)
DVD R
Floppy
TBS Montego sound card
Dell M780 Monitor
Mouse
Keyboard

I bought this system new back in ’99 (I think). Either way I go I’ll have help (my nephew) doing the work as I am 75% PC dysfunctional when it comes to the technical side. I can follow directions and install software; I added the CD burner, etc.

I wanted to be able to cut cost by doing one or the other instead of buying a PC from Sweetwater.

Any help I can get will be appreciated.
 
MoBettaBlues said:
I am new to recording systems and I have been contemplating the type of recording system I wanted to obtain. My needs are currently to be able to record my band and produce a sellable quality recording. I do not want my equipment to be the weak link in the process so I have decided to use a PC based system.

I am seriously considering “Digidesign Digi 002 Rack” system.

What I need to know is can I upgrade a PC I have now to meet the requirements of this system or should I just build a new PC?

Here’s what I have now:
Dell Dimension XPS T450
Pentium 2
256 MRAM
Windows 98
12G Hard Drive
48x16x48 CD-RW (Using Nero Express burning software)
DVD R
Floppy
TBS Montego sound card
Dell M780 Monitor
Mouse
Keyboard

I bought this system new back in ’99 (I think). Either way I go I’ll have help (my nephew) doing the work as I am 75% PC dysfunctional when it comes to the technical side. I can follow directions and install software; I added the CD burner, etc.

I wanted to be able to cut cost by doing one or the other instead of buying a PC from Sweetwater.

Any help I can get will be appreciated.
Click to expand...

Your system is not up to speed, especially if you're looking to use Pro Tools. You really need a processor in the 2 GHz range 512Mb RAM is the absolute minimum nowadays for DAW work. A 12Gb HD will not get you very far either.

The biggest problem is that your system is running Windows 98. The Digi002 is a Firewire based system - Win98 does not have any support for the Firewire. Even if you upgraded the system and the OS, you would still need to add a Firewire interface so you can connect the 002 to your system.

Save yourself time and grief and just get a new system.
 
Re: Re: Newbie Needs Help w/PC System - Build or Upgrade?

brzilian said:
Save yourself time and grief and just get a new system.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought.

I've seen other posts detailing a system they built. Are there any "posts" here that detail a system I should model mine after.

Boy does that sound like it's coming from a novice or what?!!

;o)
 
I don't see much salvagable or upgradable in your current system. The CD burner and DVD maybe. And of course the mouse, keyboard and monitor (assuming you don't want to go over to a flat screen).

I think you want to look at building a new one. But I certainly would pull the CD burner and DVD out the present one and put them in the new one.

You might also get away with keeping your current hard drive and using it for the OS, while adding a second, larger and probably faster hard drive for your audio files. Personally I would likely get two new hard drives for the new system and install the third one just for extra storage. However, with three HD's and a CD and DVD you're gonna be running out of IDE controllers. Some of the new MoBo's have both SATA and IDE controllers, so if the new hard drives are SATA, you're probably OK.

Well, that might be more information than you need. The answer to your actual question is build a new one.
 
Good advice. Thanks.

Now I need to determine what componants I need for this new system. In other words, I need to be able to go to Newegg.com (i.e.) and order MoBo ?????, Hard Drive????? etc.

Any suggestions or past posts with this info would be appreciated.
 
First off, you should probably understand that your computer (except for the sound card) will have very little effect on the quality of your recordings. That will be determined much more by your upstream equipment - mics, pre-amps - and the quality of your A/D converters which will be in your sound card.

What the computer will do is allow you to handle more tracks/effects, and to use more powerful software. It'll make your life easier - but won't really effect the quality of what you record.

That said, a reasonably good Pentium with decent memory (512 MB) will handle most of your needs.

FWIW, I just built a system in the past few weeks that I am happy with. Here's what I got:

ASUS P4P800 MoBo
P4, 2.8 GHz with 800 MHz FSB (retail pack with heat sink/fan)
1 GIG Crucial DDR Ram (PC2700)
AGP 8X Graphics Card
Floppy Drive
Case
350W Power Supply
Case Fans

I also took the following from my previous computer:
CD Burner
2 X 7200 RPM IDE Hard Drives
Delta 1010 Sound Card
PCI Modem (I don't really use it with this system, but good to have just in case)
Mouse, Keyboard, Monitor

Make sure you try and get quiet fans and power supply. A noisy computer will be picked up by any decent condensor mic. And if you buy hard drives, make sure to get at least 7200 RPM models. The ASUS MoBo btw will handle IDE and SATA hard drives.

YMMV, and some people will argue you'll get more bang for your buck with AMD processors. Personally I'm willing to pay a few more bucks since I feel most software and peripherals are desgined and tested to work with Intel. I also don't like the fact that AMD's run hotter.

If you want any more info., let me know.
 
dachay2tnr said:
First off, you should probably understand that your computer (except for the sound card) will have very little effect on the quality of your recordings. That will be determined much more by your upstream equipment - mics, pre-amps - and the quality of your A/D converters which will be in your sound card.

What the computer will do is allow you to handle more tracks/effects, and to use more powerful software. It'll make your life easier - but won't really effect the quality of what you record.

That said, a reasonably good Pentium with decent memory (512 MB) will handle most of your needs.

FWIW, I just built a system in the past few weeks that I am happy with. Here's what I got:

ASUS P4P800 MoBo
Click to expand...

Digidesign said they have had good results with the following chip sets for Intel:
845
850
855
875

Must also be an "ATX" Type.

The ASUS P4P800 has an 848 chip set. Should I aim for one of the recomended? Also, why are some MoBo's $60 and others $195 when they appear to the novice to be equal?
P4, 2.8 GHz with 800 MHz FSB (retail pack with heat sink/fan)
Click to expand...
Is this part of the MoBo?
1 GIG Crucial DDR Ram (PC2700)
Click to expand...

512 is OK, correct?

AGP 8X Graphics Card, Delta 1010 Sound Card
Click to expand...
Do I need a graphics card? Digi 002 Rack has an integrated sound card. The tech told me an additional card is not required.
Case,350W Power Supply,Case Fans
Click to expand...
Any particular kind?
If you want any more info., let me know.
Click to expand...
Much appreciated!
 
Last edited:
OK. What do you think of this. Warning! Information overkill!! This is to Run Pro Tools Digi 002 Rack.

Just in case!


MoBo
---------------------------------------------------------------------
ASUS 875P Chipset Motherboard for Intel Socket 478 CPU, Model "P4C800 DELUXE"
Specifications:
Supported CPU: Socket 478 Pentium 4(HT)/Celeron Processors
Chipset: Intel 875P + ICH5
FSB: 800/533/400MHz
RAM: 4x DIMM support Dual Channel DDR400/333/266 Max 4GB
IDE: 2x UltraDMA 100, 1x UltraDMA 133(from Promise 20378) up to 6 Devices
Slots: 1x AGP Pro/8X, 5x PCI, 1x Wi-Fi
Ports: 2xPS2,1xCOM,1xLPT,8xUSB2.0(Rear 4),1xLAN,2x1394(Rear 1),SPDIF Out,Audio Ports
Onboard Audio: AD1985 6-Channel Codec
Onboard LAN: 3COM 3C940 GbE
Onboard SATA/RAID: Promise 20378, 2x SATA, RAID 0/1/0+1/Multiple RAID; ICH5, 2xSATA
Onboard 1394: VIA 1394 Controller
Form Factor: ATX
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RAM

Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 - OEM
Specification
Manufacturer: Corsair
Speed: DDR400(PC3200)
Type: 184 Pin DDR SDRAM
Error Checking: Non-ECC
Registered/Unbuffered: Unbuffered
Cas Latency: 2-3-3-6 1T
Support Voltage: 2.6V
Bandwidth: 3.2GB/s
Organization: 64M x 64 -Bit
Warranty: Lifetime
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hard Drive #1

Maxtor 80GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y080P0, OEM Drive Only
Specifications:
Capacity: 80GB
Average Seek Time: 9.3 ms
Buffer: 8MB
Rotational Speed: 7200 RPM
Interface: IDE ULTRA ATA133
Features: Maxtor Shock Protection and Data Protection Systems
Manufacturer Warranty: 1 year
Remark: OEM Drive
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hard Drive #2

Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, MODEL 6Y120M0, OEM Drive Only
Specifications:
Capacity: 120GB
Average Seek Time: 9.3 ms
Buffer: 8MB
Rotational Speed: 7200 RPM
Interface: Serial ATA
Features: FDB Motors
Manufacturer Warranty: 3 years
Remark: OEM Drive Only
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

O/S

Microsoft Windows XP Professional with Service Pack SP1a - Full Version OEM


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Case

ASPIRE Black Turbo Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "ATXB2KL/350" -RETAIL
Specifications:
Case Type: Mid-Tower ATX
Color: Black/Silver
Material: Metal
Drive Bays: 5.25" x 4/0, 3.5" x 2/4 (external/internal)
Expansion Slots: 7
Front Ports: 2xUSB2.0, 2xAudio
Power Supply: 350W
Cooling System: 1 x 80mm Side panel
Motherboard Compatibility: ATX/ BABY AT
Dimensions: 17"x 7.8"x 17" (DxWxH)
Special Features: Side Panel Fan for Extra Ventilation, Extended Body for All the Drives and Motherboards to Fit in
 
these would be nice systems..but if i recall if you want to run protools you have to hac MAC software..its no windows based yet..just the protoolsfree..i might be wrong...but most protoos set-up are done on apple computers..just me 2cents
 
XP Pro is a waste of money unless you have a multiprocessor system or need the extra networking features. Save $100 and use XP Home.
 
If you're going to build a PC from scratch and it's going to be your DAW, make sure you build it to be quiet. No excuse for having to replace loud parts later on.

Might want to read this article:
http://www.ocforums.com/vb/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=225234

You can also find interesting reads at the following site:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/index.php

The following website provides updates on great parts deals; kind of ragtag but maybe you'll find something useful there, too:
http://www.techbargains.com/

I think Newegg.com has an outstanding rating with people who have used it. A coworker recently built an outstanding gaming system using their site.

FWIW, Seagate HDs are the recommended for recording. I've read nothing but excellent comments on how quiet these hard disks are, and they seem to perform well. Your minimum target for your hard disk that you will be recording to is 7200 RPM, 8MB Cache Buffer.

There are many users here who also recommend a 2.5 GHz or 2.8 GHz Athlon + ASUS n-Force2 setup for CPU motherboard. It is notably cheaper. Some people claim that AMD CPUs/Mobo chipsets have compatibility issues; in my digging, I have not seen many occasions where this is the case. With Intel, you are safe, but you must decide if it's worth your extra money that could be spent elsewhere. This is from reading only, I'm a newb, don't take my word for it, but you can find it in the forum. Just do a search for AMD or Pentium on this board.

Hope this helps.
 
MoBettaBlues said:
OK. What do you think of this. Warning! Information overkill!! This is to Run Pro Tools Digi 002 Rack.

Just in case!


MoBo
---------------------------------------------------------------------
ASUS 875P Chipset Motherboard for Intel Socket 478 CPU, Model "P4C800 DELUXE"
Specifications:
Supported CPU: Socket 478 Pentium 4(HT)/Celeron Processors
Chipset: Intel 875P + ICH5
FSB: 800/533/400MHz
RAM: 4x DIMM support Dual Channel DDR400/333/266 Max 4GB
IDE: 2x UltraDMA 100, 1x UltraDMA 133(from Promise 20378) up to 6 Devices
Slots: 1x AGP Pro/8X, 5x PCI, 1x Wi-Fi
Ports: 2xPS2,1xCOM,1xLPT,8xUSB2.0(Rear 4),1xLAN,2x1394(Rear 1),SPDIF Out,Audio Ports
Onboard Audio: AD1985 6-Channel Codec
Onboard LAN: 3COM 3C940 GbE
Onboard SATA/RAID: Promise 20378, 2x SATA, RAID 0/1/0+1/Multiple RAID; ICH5, 2xSATA
Onboard 1394: VIA 1394 Controller
Form Factor: ATX
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RAM

Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 - OEM
Specification
Manufacturer: Corsair
Speed: DDR400(PC3200)
Type: 184 Pin DDR SDRAM
Error Checking: Non-ECC
Registered/Unbuffered: Unbuffered
Cas Latency: 2-3-3-6 1T
Support Voltage: 2.6V
Bandwidth: 3.2GB/s
Organization: 64M x 64 -Bit
Warranty: Lifetime
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hard Drive #1

Maxtor 80GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model 6Y080P0, OEM Drive Only
Specifications:
Capacity: 80GB
Average Seek Time: 9.3 ms
Buffer: 8MB
Rotational Speed: 7200 RPM
Interface: IDE ULTRA ATA133
Features: Maxtor Shock Protection and Data Protection Systems
Manufacturer Warranty: 1 year
Remark: OEM Drive
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hard Drive #2

Maxtor 120GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, MODEL 6Y120M0, OEM Drive Only
Specifications:
Capacity: 120GB
Average Seek Time: 9.3 ms
Buffer: 8MB
Rotational Speed: 7200 RPM
Interface: Serial ATA
Features: FDB Motors
Manufacturer Warranty: 3 years
Remark: OEM Drive Only
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

O/S

Microsoft Windows XP Professional with Service Pack SP1a - Full Version OEM


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Case

ASPIRE Black Turbo Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "ATXB2KL/350" -RETAIL
Specifications:
Case Type: Mid-Tower ATX
Color: Black/Silver
Material: Metal
Drive Bays: 5.25" x 4/0, 3.5" x 2/4 (external/internal)
Expansion Slots: 7
Front Ports: 2xUSB2.0, 2xAudio
Power Supply: 350W
Cooling System: 1 x 80mm Side panel
Motherboard Compatibility: ATX/ BABY AT
Dimensions: 17"x 7.8"x 17" (DxWxH)
Special Features: Side Panel Fan for Extra Ventilation, Extended Body for All the Drives and Motherboards to Fit in
Click to expand...
Looks reasonable to me. Listen to Brzilian and go for XP Home. XP Pro is only needed if you plan to run dual processors.

Meanwhile, where's your CPU? To answer your earlier question, the CPU doesn't come with the motherboard. You need to buy it separately. Some places will install it for you; however personally I found the P4 heatsink easier to install than the P3 version. So installation of the CPU is not as important as it may have been previously.

Also, try and buy a case without a power supply. As bluesboy said, you want it to be quiet. Getting a case without a power supply allows you to buy a separate QUIET power supply.
 
Thank you all. Some very good advice. I'll be doing some research and tweaking my "wish list" a bit.

I'll report back soon!
 
Well, I did some tweaking and my price tag is now over $900! Does that sound right? I've read some othe rposts where some have built a "great" system for $500.

My price doesn't even include the monitor.

Granted I added a CD-RW/DVD-RW $117 vs. $35 but the rest of the tweaks were needed stuff like a CPU, different HD's, different case, power supply etc.
 
That's a hot system you're getting there. Here's what I think.

That Asus mobo is great but an Asus P4P800 like Dachy's would be just as good and a lot cheaper. Do you want Raid? Also I didn't see your video card or cpu there. Why have you got 2 different HDs? Get 2 120GB drives.

I've just built a DAW on a P4P800 and it's killer. I highly recommend it
 
I didn't revise my BOM yet. I priced out the additional items and came up with the higher figure. I'll do that soon.

May I ask what the cost of your system was?

Also, I've been doing some research on the Digi forum and have been reading a lot regarding AMD vs Intel and it sounds like and AMD based system is more stable. Any thoughts on that?
 
AMD vs Intel

I have an AMD-based system -- it works fine. I actually have seen some software compatibility problems with AMD-based systems, but these were due to some of the support chips associated with the AMD CPU and not the CPU itself. I believe all of the known problems have been fixed on all contemporary AMD motherboards.

BTW -- I'd recommend getting 1 GB of memory, at least eventually. Similarly, I'd recommend getting a motherboard that supports RAID even if you don't use it right away. RAID really makes audio software fly. I was amazed at the difference. But, again, you can get started without it. AMD-support mother-boards typically cost an extra $20 for the RAID support logic.

Nevertheless, if you really want that extra margin of compatibility "safety", the Intel CPUs are always a little less likely to cause problems simply because every software vendor I know does the bulk of their testing on Intel-based systems. Yet, for me, I still prefer to save the 20% and go with AMD. I've never had problems...but maybe I've been lucky.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top