New/very old personal folk/pop composition

gecko zzed

Grumpy Mod
An interesting song with an intriguing and complex arrangement.

I have a few observations.

1 The vocal is fine, but disconnected from the music. That's because it is dry and very dominant, so it's not sitting in the same musical space as the backing
2 The arrangement is interesting, but the percussion sounds as if it was added for the sake of having a dramatic effect. I don't think it was neeaasry. Likewise, I wasn't convinced by the accordian.
3 Because of the difference between vocal and backing level, at times the backing sounded too busym rather than being interesting.
4 I wasn't sure that the song needed to be 5 minutes long. My mind started to wander at about three minutes.
 

TECHNINOT

Member
Bless you, Grumpy Mod.

I appreciate your observations. Very finely tuned.
I will strip the song down and streamline it and see what that gives. I admit to have a tendency to overdo some aspects of production and to add percussion elements to make the songs sound more "pop" ( I suppose). Of course, a real accordion would have been more satisfying (as with all the accompanying synthesized instruments).

I'll give it try.

Thank you dearly,
William
 

gecko zzed

Grumpy Mod
I think the first things to do would be to add reverb to the vocals to give it a sense of similar space to the instruments, and bring up the overall level of the instruments.

That should give you a better feel of the interaction between vocals and instruments, and where things can be simplified.
 

TECHNINOT

Member
Mr. Grumpy
Thank you so much for the generous sharing of your intelligence, professional understanding, and time. As you suggested, I have begun the reworking of the song by listening differently to it. Already, I like it better without the drums and percussion. I cut out the last verse and everything that went with it and I agree, it’s enough just like that (4minutes). Now I’m tempted to put a new voice here and there, maybe everywhere - especially to see if I can replace the beats with a more rhythmic vocal performance. Anyway, I’m enjoying working on this tune again with the good advice you have offered me. Thank you.
 

TECHNINOT

Member
Hello!
Here's a new mix I did this afternoon, putting your suggestions to the test.
It's a once-in-a-lifetime mix as I use no automation. I like the new song personally and I will do some vocal work to make it even better.
Maybe even a bit of timing work with regard to the strings, etc.
What do you think?

Once again, THANK YOU.
William
 

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gecko zzed

Grumpy Mod
Okay. The new version sounds a lot more integrated. Well done.

There are a number of more subtle changes that you could make. For example, you could lower the level of the glockenspiel until it is just audible. High frequency sounds like that are very prevasive, and you only need a little bit to get a good effect. Also the horse hoofs only need to appear the once, rather than coming back. Both flute and accordian would benefit from a bit more reverb.
 
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TECHNINOT

Member
Yes. I have effectuated your suggestions. It's sounds better, I agree. Now all I have to do is record a better vocal rendition, but that will have to wait as I had a small
vocal accident a few days ago while working on a new song without being adequately warmed up. When I have completed a new totally modified mix, I'll
send you an mp3, OK?
 

famous beagle

Well-known member
I agree with Gecko's comments. Even in the second version, which did sound better, the vocals were still too up front (IMO), and the glock was way too loud.

Sounds as though you're a fan of Genesis, huh? :)
 

Papanate

Member
Yes. I have effectuated your suggestions. It's sounds better, I agree. Now all I have to do is record a better vocal rendition, but that will have to wait as I had a small
vocal accident a few days ago while working on a new song without being adequately warmed up. When I have completed a new totally modified mix, I'll
send you an mp3, OK?
Why No DAW?
 

TECHNINOT

Member
I agree with Gecko's comments. Even in the second version, which did sound better, the vocals were still too up front (IMO), and the glock was way too loud.

Sounds as though you're a fan of Genesis, huh? :)
Hello. Thank you for your well-meant criticism. Here’s the third and last mix of this particular song. I personally like what I hear; I could, of course go on and on, adding background voices, electric guitar, etc. but when I consider the total futility of trying to make my tunes sound as if they had been “produced” professionally, I don’t insist too much on trying to perfect them, I’m sure you’ll understand. The work I’m doing right now is much more “roots” - simple, acoustic. And no, I’ve never paid particular attention to what Genesis was doing.
View attachment OPEN YOUR EYES8 3.mp3
 

famous beagle

Well-known member
Hello. Thank you for your well-meant criticism. Here’s the third and last mix of this particular song. I personally like what I hear; I could, of course go on and on, adding background voices, electric guitar, etc. but when I consider the total futility of trying to make my tunes sound as if they had been “produced” professionally, I don’t insist too much on trying to perfect them, I’m sure you’ll understand. The work I’m doing right now is much more “roots” - simple, acoustic. And no, I’ve never paid particular attention to what Genesis was doing.
View attachment 110172
Wow ... I would think you would really dig Genesis (talking about earlier Genesis) after hearing this track. But who knows, though. Anyway ...
What do you use to record, by the way? (I don't use a DAW either.)
 

TECHNINOT

Member
I record onto a TASCAM DP24SD.
In fact, other than the local music of that period - Janis Joplin, Jefferson Airplane, Grateful Dead, The Byrds, etc. the "imported" music that moved me came from The Yardbirds, Moody Blues, Donovan, Cream and, of course, The Beatles.
 
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