New to recording. Can someone lend a hand?

L

lyricist

New member
hi.

I have an mp3 of our music.. im not sure if you are supposed to record with the mp3 or with midi or what.

basically.. i dont know what we're doing at all.

not looking to have anything professional sounding but also don't want it to be blury.

we want to record this on a computer.

All I have is FL studio on here. i know that is crap. i used it when i first started compising music and didnt know what i was doing :p now its of no real use to me.


I need to buy a mic of course, is the Marshall V67 good? Am I supposed to get a large condenser mic? im not looking to pay much more than $100 for the mic. in the future will upgrade. but for now- im not too sure. is there any type of mic that actually mixes well for not much more than $100? I dont want to be too cheap then get one that doesnt mix at all. :eek: (read something about the marshall v67g mixing well in another post. not sure if that and the v67 are one in the same, though?) in the v67(g) specs it says it needs phantom power. does that mean i need to buy one of these? http://www.8thstreet.com/Product.aspProductCode=1989&Category=Recording what do i do with it? I know i sound like a complete idiot but this is all new to me.


I also think I need a sound card- not too expensive, which should I get? is there a certian # of RAM needed on your computer to record well?


and last but not least how do we record? as in, do we plug the mic into the computer? or do we need to plug it into that phantom thing, etc...?


And lastly is there any software i need to play the mp3 and then record vocals onto it? or just software to record vocals period? All I have is the simple voice recorder that comes with windows. and how would i get the vocals to echo and all of that if wanted.. I guess "vocal effects"


can someone help me out here, ive been putting this off for too long mainly cos i dont know anyone who knows how to do this stuff. so hopefully someone here can give me a hand so we can atleast record a few songs digitally.

thanks :o id appreciate it.. also if you could try reply in something ican understand. i dont know much termonology.... I can write music and lyrics and thats about it! sometimes i read these posts and it sounds like a totally different language. :confused:

thanks again.
 
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I'm sure most of these questions are answered around here many times over. But without the terminology its hard to search and start putting together the whole picture.

So I'll see if I can help orient you here:

1) Soundcard.

Oy. Just about any sound card you may be thinking of buying isn't going to work all that well. They are noisey, usually have very poor quality convertors and (most importantly) don't have professional connectors and preamps. The Marshall V67, for example just won't work without additional equipment if you have a cheapy computer soundcard.

The term for recording "soundcards" is Audio Interface. Some are cards, some plug in via USB, some are Firewire. Some have preamps built in, and that's probably what you're going to want to get for your first setup.

Here's a couple links to m-aduio's products- common entry level devices and usually a good value:
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=products.list&ID=pciinterfaces
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=products.list&ID=mobileinterfaces

Poke around and take a look at the various features. Look for things like Phantom Power (which lets you use condensor mics like the V67), how many channels can you record at once (2? 4? 8?), how many preamps (mic inputs) does it have (2? 4? 8?). How many line inputs (for things like keyboards and external preamps)? Any instrument inputs (for plugging guitars and basses straight in)?

2) Mics

Lots of conversation about this kind of stuff in the mic forum. Hard to ask questions about because they almost literally are like brushes or colors for the recording engineer. Imagine a painter hoping on a bbs and asking "What color should I use for this painting I'm doing? Thanks!"

The right mic(s) depend heavily on what you're doing with them. The V67 is a good vocal and guitar mic (usually), but I wouldn't reach for it on a kick drum or bass. It would probably make a good room mic or quick & dirty live recordings. But its also REALLY sensitive and it'll pick up every last noise in your house along with your recording!

Common beginner mics are the Shure SM57 (A dynamic mic, doesn't need phantom power), the mics in the Studio Projects line, the V67, and a host of other mics you'll see being discussed in the mic forum. For a goldmine of way more than you might want to know about mics, checkout the sticky thread at the top of the Mic Forum. Settle in for a long read, but its worth every moment.

If you're just doing vocals, which it sounds like from your post- all you need is an audio interface with at least 1 mic input w/ phantom power and the V67. Not a bad start.

3) Software.

Geez- take your pick. A common place to start that is inexpensive but still really full-featured is n-track. http://www.fasoft.com/

What's wrong with FL studio?

Anyway. That's about all I'm good for at the moment. :) I hope its marginally helpful.

Take care,
Chris
 
Thanks Chris. haha your post actually was helpful and easy to understand! Now, if i could only get you back to respond again...



FL studio has junk sounds, IMO. So I would like something a bit different.

I have a synth but can't figure out if I am able to somehow save mp3s on there. But the synth has niiice sounds.



About that mic..picks up "every last noise" huh? That's not too good.


You said, "Some have preamps built in"

what is a preamp? Is the phantom an amp?

ps- Yes, just doing vocals! But like i mentioned, recording onto a mp3 we made. So needs to "mix" well.


I browsed around the mic forum a bit but sometimes i understood nothing. I followed a link I found there and read about the diaphragm compresion(I think thats what it was called) and it helped me understand more.

I guess for now i'll just get something simple and then when i found out more about my abilities and needs, I can go ahead and upgrade with a clearer understanding of what works right for me. And hopefully by that time I will understand more about what to do!



Thanks for the links on the soundcards, i'll check it out.

Thanks again for your help so far. :)
 
Oh gosh, how did I miss this part of your post?


Im going to sound REALLY stupid but please bare with me-- I want to understand this.


Here is what you said:


"Poke around and take a look at the various features. Look for things like Phantom Power (which lets you use condensor mics like the V67),"

can "phantom power" use other things other than condensor mics?

" how many channels can you record at once (2? 4? 8?), "

What do you mean by "channels".. Like you mean you could record guitar, piano, and vocals at once kind of thing???

if im right about that, lets say it told me it had only 2 channels. Could I go ahead and record maybe vocals and guitar together..save.. then go back and add 2 more? repeat process..


how many preamps (mic inputs) does it have (2? 4? 8?).

guess you answered my question of "what is a pre amp" earlier. I wouldnt need many preamps then if im just recording solo right? I guess probably should look for one with 2 atleast so if i need other people to sing?

"How many line inputs (for things like keyboards and external preamps)? Any instrument inputs (for plugging guitars and basses straight in)? "


"External preamps" so if i buy one with only 2 preamps and eventually i need more i can buy some external ones?

Also, If you plug a guitar in to record onto a channel(IF thats what a channel is) do you need a mic or does it just go right into your laptop and record??


one more thing-- If I plug in my keyboard to this thing and play ..will it record the sounds OF my keyboard? or will it act like midi and record the generic computer sounds??

:o I really like the sounds on my synth and that would be cool if I could plug it into this and play it and record the actual synth sounds!
 
You will get a much better sounding recording if you record in WAV instead of MP3. You can compress the WAV file to a MP3 file after you finish recording and mixing. You will need a MP3 encoder to do this. The faster your computer is, the better it will work for recording so the more RAM, the better. You may experience latency (sound card lag, sounds like an echo) which will annoy you greatly untill you discover how to change a few settings to correct it. This occurs when you are adding tracks to existing ones. From your post it sounds like you are using a laptop for recording, correct me if I misunderstood. If so, you will definately need an external mixer. These come with a variety of features, your needs will determine what options you should get. I recomend at least 4 ins and 4 outs, with a built in preamp. You don't have to spend a fortune but at least get a good one. Better gear wont make you a better engineer but it will make it a lot easier to get the hang of recording. Most people seem to agree that Pro Tools is the best for recording, for your purposes Cakewalk Music Creator 2005 might be some software to get your recordings off to a good start, it works quite well with MIDI and has multi track (layering) and a pretty good mixer. Keep asking questions and good luck.
 
I think at this point you should pick up a good book such as "Home Recording for Dummies" (not that you're a dummy!). It will cover alot of basic information, especially the technology. Once you get a handle on the basics, you can start figuring out what you need/want to buy. Good luck!
 
I second Evan's recommendtion on that book. Don't be put off by the title, it's a great intro for an extra-virgin rookie like yourself. Nothing to be ashamed of, either. Your questions are better than many by folks with experience ;).

But to help out a bit before gtting to the book...

PREAMPS
All microphones need a preamp. And microphones are the *only* devices - other than vinyl turntables - that use preamps.

Microphones put out relatively low voltage signals, lower than what comes from, say, a synth or a guitar pickup. It is also a lower voltage than the standard "line" voltages that run between the pieces or electronic gear like the mixer and the tape recorder, or even like between the CD player and the amplifier on your home stereo.

Therefore a preamp is the first thing that a mic plugs into, it "pre-amplifies" the signal coming out of the microphone and brings it up to a more standard "line level" voltage like all other gear. Other than the microphone itself, the preamp can be the most critical component in the signal chain when it comes to sound quality.

If a device like a mixer or an interface to the computer has a "Mic In" jack, you can assume that that jack leads to a built-in preamp.

PHANTOM POWER
While dynamic microphones work without needing any power supply, conndensor-based microphones need some electricity to operate. This is what "phantom power" is for. It supplies electricity to the condenser microphone via the mic cable. This is the only way in which phantom power is used.

HTH,

G.
 
I just wanted to correct that mics aren't the only things that need preamplification - anything that's not already at line level does. A guitar will indeed tend to have a much higher powered output than most mics, but it's still not at line level. While you could plug it in to a line input and probably get some sound, something with a hi-z instrument level preamp in it will interface it to line level systems as it's intended to (although you'll find that you can usually get a much better sound using a mic on a good sounding guitar amp.... bass is easier to record direct).

A guitar amp, for example, is basically a preamp suited to the tone and impedance of a guitar, followed by a power amp stage (that takes the line level signal and amplifies the power up enough to move a speaker)... and sometimes a speaker built in (a combo amp), or a jack to an external speaker (a head or whatnot).
 
mattamatta said:
I just wanted to correct that mics aren't the only things that need preamplification - anything that's not already at line level does. A guitar will indeed tend to have a much higher powered output than most mics, but it's still not at line level. While you could plug it in to a line input and probably get some sound, something with a hi-z instrument level preamp in it will interface it to line level systems as it's intended to (although you'll find that you can usually get a much better sound using a mic on a good sounding guitar amp.... bass is easier to record direct)
Click to expand...
This is all true. It could also be said that I mis-implied that turntables could use mic preamps. That would also be a false implication; a phono preamp is an entirely different animal from a mic preamp.

I should have been clearer. What I meant to say was that the preamps used for mics are typically used only for mics; one does not typically use a mic preamp for anything else. And that in this forum typically when the generic term preamp - or just "pre" - is used, it typically is referring to a mic preamp unless otherwise specified or in a specificlly different context.

Thanks for pointing out the clarification, matta. :) Now if I could only get you to shorten your location blurb... j/k ;) :D

G.
 
Ok i think i will buy that book.


Just one thing- Does that book tell what processor, speed, ram, etc you need?

Because that's what im stuck on! I need to buy a new laptop or desktop that actually is fast enough and has enough RAM...



I kind of wanted to use a laptop for recording but it looks like its easier and cheaper to go with a desktop..
 
lyricist said:
Just one thing- Does that book tell what processor, speed, ram, etc you need? Because that's what im stuck on! I need to buy a new laptop or desktop that actually is fast enough and has enough RAM...
Click to expand...

Well, the problem with any book is by the time it's published the computer world has moved on to bigger, faster, cheaper things.

A good place to start for a recording PC is somewhere in the vicinity of a 3.0 GHZ, 1 GB RAM, dual 10K RPM 80 gig hard drives (one for OS, software, plugins, samples) and the other to record to. Try and find a non-interlaced video card around 64 MB video RAM and get a good audio card... at least an MAudio, but preferrably something killer like a RME Hammerfall. Ditch the computer speakers and get something servicable for monitors like Event 20/20's (not great but doable).
 
3 GHz. lol Thanks. Mine is only a 1.4 :o


What is a good processor?? I was reading the thread about pentiums 3 and 4. lots of people said they used athlon? Never heard of that before.




When you gave those specs was it for a desktop or laptop?
 
Desktop or laptop does not really matter, specs are specs. A laptop of same specs will be more expensive, and less expandable; that's the downside. The upside is that it's more portable and (usually) quieter. If you're looking for something that will work and that you can take on live location or to a practice room or other ersatz studio, then a laptop may be more practable. But if you're looking to do pretty much all you stuff in one project studio location, go with a desktop tower configuration for maximum expandability.

When it comes to processor speed and memory, the more the merrier. 3.0GHz and 1GHz memory are wonderful, but don't fret if you wind up having to settle for ~2GHz and 512MB in an affordable laptop, it will still be servicable. The main difference is in how may simultaneous tracks you'll be able to run real-time effects on before the CPU boggs down, and even then there are work-arounds. For several years I was able to work very successfully in audio and video with a 45MHz Pentium 3 with 384MB of RAM. These days that sounds like a toy, but it finished several highly successful projects on that system with no problem. But get the fastest quality board you can afford with as much memory as you can afford to keep your bottlenecks down and to keep you system from going obsolete in 72 hours ;).

As far as CPU type, unless you buy used, you won't find Pentium 3s any more. It's all Pentium 4 in the Pentium series now. Intel also makes a "Celeron" processor, which will also be servicable, but I'd recommend spending the extra few bucks for the Pentium. It's worth it. The "Athelon" is the flagship chip by AMD, Intel's main rival. They are good chips, very popular amongst gamers, and there are a lot of recordists that use them successfully as well. But unless you can get a superior deal on an Athalon set, I'd personally recommend sticking not only with the Intel Pentium 4, but sticking with a full Intel chipset on the motherboard as well. The reason for that recommendation is that there are occasional cases of compatability issues between some recording hardware and software and some Athalon configurations.

HTH,

G.
 
Hey thanks a lot.


Im on a celeron now..1.4GHz

honestly im not going all out in recording.

What I do is use my synth to make music. Then I save it.. Then I want to record vocals.


That's all. Just something simple.

I only have 128RAM so I know i need more. but im trying to figure out if i need to sell this laptop to get a pentium 4 with around 2+GHz. or if this 1.4GHz with more RAM would run fine.

I think I will need more GHz, though.




As far as the CPU goes.. I need a lot more room than I have now. Cause when I run FLstudio with a lot of tracks it fills up. What gives me more CPU? the ram or the GHz?

thanks again
 
What do you think about this?

Manufacturer: Compaq & HP Compaq
Model: Compaq Presario R3230US - P4 2.8 MHz - 15
Description: 7.7 lbs, Intel Pentium 4 2.8 MHz , 512 MB DDR SDRAM , 60 GB IDE , 15 in TFT active matrix , 1 Lithium ion , Microsoft Windows XP Professional






Hey i have an important question- you know the sound card that you can plug into like the USB of your computer? and it has places you can plug in a guitar, keyboard etc?


Well..what if I plug in my synth to that and i start to play the piano on it and am recording- will it record the actual sound that comes form the synth????

Because right now i record on my synth then put the disc in the synth and select "save"(only saves as midi) but when i put the disc on my laptop and play it its totally different sounds.

So with the soundcard will it straight out record my synth sounds onto the computer??
 
First off, find out what the maximum amount of memory is that your current laptop can take. Your biggest bottelneck right now is probably the 128MB RAM. Frankly you could probably get by with your current configuration and about 512MB RAM just fine for the tasks you describe as long as you don't need to go high into the double digits on the number of tracks, though a bigger system with a Pentium would be more efficient and give you more room to breathe.

As far as what matters more, CPU speed or amount of memory, the memory will be the biggest logjam if you don't have enough of it (less than 512MB, say.) But if you have enough memory to go around, then the CPU and board speed will start becoming the bigger bottleneck. CAUTION: This is VERY generalized advice with many caveats, plus there are many other factors involved than just those two specs, but IN VERY GENERAL TERMS that is usually the case.

H.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
as long as you don't need to go high into the double digits on the number of tracks, though a bigger system with a Pentium would be more efficient and give you more room to breathe.

As far as what matters more, CPU speed or amount of memory, the memory will be the biggest logjam if you don't have enough of it (less than 512MB, say.) But if you have enough memory to go around, then the CPU and board speed will start becoming the bigger bottleneck. CAUTION: This is VERY generalized advice with many caveats, plus there are many other factors involved than just those two specs, but IN VERY GENERAL TERMS that is usually the case.

H.
Click to expand...
No.. I only go about 10 tracks if that. 10-20 at the most..

But so it's safer to just get a pentium 4 with possibly 3GHz just because in the future i might go bigger and it will end up saving me money, right??

Also, I save a lot of pictures and music so...



thanks!











ETA- i JUST noticed im saying "GHz" and "MHz" ah getting confused..

You said 3 GHz is good. the laptop specs i posted said 2 something MHz. :confused:
 
lyricist said:
What do you think about this?

Manufacturer: Compaq & HP Compaq


Hey i have an important question- you know the sound card that you can plug into like the USB of your computer? and it has places you can plug in a guitar, keyboard etc?


Well..what if I plug in my synth to that and i start to play the piano on it and am recording- will it record the actual sound that comes form the synth????

Because right now i record on my synth then put the disc in the synth and select "save"(only saves as midi) but when i put the disc on my laptop and play it its totally different sounds.

So with the soundcard will it straight out record my synth sounds onto the computer??
Click to expand...
Personally, I wouldn't touch a Compaq desktop with a 10 ft. pole. They *work* and they tend to be inexpensive, but their internal layout and engineering is a pain in the ass to deal with. I don't have as much experience with their laptops, so I'll reserve comment there.

I have two systems here, one desktop and one laptop. My laptop is a Toshiba Satellite that I got for a very good price new and retail and I have been very happy with that.

As far as the USB interface, if your synth has standard line out jacks from with you can run a cable into one (or two for stereo) of te inputs on the USB interface box, then yes you can record direct that way. If you don't aloready have one of those interfaces, I might recommend the Tascam us122. Built like a tank, has excellent-sounding mic preamps for the price, comes with good software and performs well.

G.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
Personally, I wouldn't touch a Compaq desktop with a 10 ft. pole. They *work* and they tend to be inexpensive, but their internal layout and engineering is a pain in the ass to deal with. I don't have as much experience with their laptops, so I'll reserve comment there.

I have two systems here, one desktop and one laptop. My laptop is a Toshiba Satellite that I got for a very good price new and retail and I have been very happy with that.
Click to expand...

Haha i had a feeling they were crap. I keep seeing things about the toshiba sattelite, though. Is that what you use for your recording??


As far as the USB interface, if your synth has standard line out jacks from with you can run a cable into one (or two for stereo) of te inputs on the USB interface box, then yes you can record direct that way.
Click to expand...

and would it record MY synth sounds? because with FLstudio if i do that it does NOT record my synth sounds. It makes me choose one of FLstudio's peice of crap sounds.

if the way you tell me does record MY synth sounds..can i also edit it??
 
Your best bet would probably be to build your own pc. That way you get everything you want in it and would have to suffer warranty invalidation if you decide to upgrade some of the components. And it will probably work out cheaper too. In which case go for an Athlon, they are cheaper but in my opinion just as good as Pentiums. You can get an Athlon XP 3200+ for less than £120 (insert relevant dollar converstion here). Alternatively, Dell are doing stuff pretty cheap these days. Although Dell tend to invalidate your warranty as soon as you open the case, which you probably will do when you install a decent soundcard for recording. (Which I doubt you would get with a Dell).
 
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